PATIENCE PROMISCUITY AND PROFIDIOUSNESS

[MrBond]

"So as to what I'm venting here...B.S. on the assumptions about me."

And I say the same about the assumptions you have about him. You haven't even talked to him about the receipt and yet you've come up with a number of scenarios in your head. That's mindreading at it's worst.

You say that you've confronted him before. About what? About other woman? About different situations? How did you confront him? If it was accusatory like you're currently doing, I can see why he might shut down.

[Ambivalent]

H. is not passive aggressive. Or maybe he has become that...I don't know at this point.

I can deal with a prostitute, don't ask me why. But an affair is different.

The irony, he felt his daughters just saw him as a paycheck. The woman for which he bought over 300.00 of clothes, she is thinking that he has money. And he did that to gain. Wow, the compartmentalization and justification astounds me.

Something inside me has died. He is very needy right now, and I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I want to at this point.

I don't feel sexual about him at present. With the stress this has caused, the stress of school, the stress of what I have to do around him, the stress of trying to function, I am slowly being eaten away.

Sorry if I can't just snap back. This is over 33 years I've given to this man. I have been forgiving in the past. I have discussed and shared how I felt about ugly behavior before, and then let it go.

I never threw it in his face. I took him at his word. That is gone. How does someone ever trust again?

He is being so " nice " because he feels guilty about his dual life. He knows this is wrong. He does have a choice. He is not under the influence of heavy drugs, or alcohol, he is not an addict. He is an adult and has chosen to do this.

[MrBond]

"H. is not passive aggressive. Or maybe he has become that...I don't know at this point."

He's not and hasn't acted that way towards you. THAT you worked out in your own head. Mindreading on your part.

"I can deal with a prostitute, don't ask me why. But an affair is different."

Mindreading about the A.

"The irony, he felt his daughters just saw him as a paycheck. The woman for which he bought over 300.00 of clothes, she is thinking that he has money. And he did that to gain. Wow, the compartmentalization and justification astounds me."

Mindreading.

"Something inside me has died. He is very needy right now, and I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I want to at this point."

How about stop doing what doesn't work, and in your case it's making up scenarios in your head.

"I don't feel sexual about him at present. With the stress this has caused, the stress of school, the stress of what I have to do around him, the stress of trying to function, I am slowly being eaten away."

That's YOUR choice. You are causing the stress to yourself.

"Sorry if I can't just snap back. This is over 33 years I've given to this man. I have been forgiving in the past. I have discussed and shared how I felt about ugly behavior before, and then let it go."

You also were responsible for what happened 50% of the time.

"I never threw it in his face. I took him at his word. That is gone. How does someone ever trust again?"

You're totally mindreading on things that may or may not have happened.

"He is being so " nice " because he feels guilty about his dual life. He knows this is wrong. He does have a choice. He is not under the influence of heavy drugs, or alcohol, he is not an addict. He is an adult and has chosen to do this.""

This is mindreading especially. You don't "know" your H. Assumptions are what have killed MANY relationships. Stop saying you "know" him. After all, you never "knew" he was going to leave you. Stick to actual facts and not what fantasies you are coming up with on your own.

[RosaLinda]

Just checking to see how you're holding up here Amba. I'm so sorry to see you spinning this way, it hurts us to see you hurting so, my friend. You asked:

"It is so confusing...On one hand I'm being told it isn't me, it is him and his MLC. On the other , It is about me, my behavior . On this board I am getting dual messages. If it isn't about me, then why change?"

I think what people are trying to tell you is that this affair is not about you, this OW is just a person, and probably a pretty needy skanky person at that, whom your H is using to try to make himself feel temporarily better. But it ain't gonna work, that is what Job was saying. Your H is broken inside, temporarily crazy, and is searching for a way to feel better about himself. But happiness does not come from outside us, we, your H, need to find happiness inside us.

You say that H is an adult, and that he made a choice here. Well you're right, but I try to look at my H as a temporarily crazy person, and not as an adult. Our MLCers are not thinking at full capacity. Their memories are shot, their morals are hidden under a bunch of lies they have told themselves about us to justify their actions. You cannot change him right now, you can just accept him as he is, accept that he loves you the best he can right now, and give him the time and space to work thru this horrible thing he is going thru.

But when the posters on the forum are telling you to change, they are saying to change the things YOU don't like about yourself. To look deep inside yourself and see how you might have contributed to the breakdown of your marriage. If you can identify any issues, then fix them. But the changing is for you, not for him.

For example, you know that my H is sick, and has not been able to work for many years. I now realize that having me support him made him feel like less than a man Amba. It broke his spirit and left him with no self esteem. I always respected him and loved him with all my heart but I did not show him. And so he has turned elsewhere for validation as a man, and boy was he able to find plenty of EAs and PAs willing to tell him how wonderful he was. I will regret this until my dying day and am hoping for a chance to make it up to him someday. I am not saying you did anything as rotten as that, but if anyone had ever asked me what I had contributed to the breakdown of my marriage, I would have scoffed and said it was all him going nuts. But after looking inside me I can see that a lot of it was me. Do you know what I mean?

When Bond tells you to "Stick to actual facts and not what fantasies you are coming up with on your own" he's right. I do this too. With every single new EA I thought "this is it, he is really in love with this one, this time my M is over" but it never was. After 4 long years, my H is still living it up in replay land. Don't make things worse than they actually are, Amba.

You have been at this for many long months, and know the ins and outs of DBing and MLC. I am sorry that you had to learn about this OW. But please know Amba, that OW is just part of your H's journey thru his MLC. Hang in there Amba, you CAN do this.

[Hopefull2]

Ambivalent,

Give yourself some time to digest this new information. You have done a lot of work on yourself, your attitude and have addressed many things you wanted to change in yourself. You have mande many of those changes and you know your husband noticed.... So whether you kick him to the curb or not you know those changes are going to serve you well.

Give yourself a little time to digest this. Do not be rash or make life changing decisions right now. I did the week i found out and have regreted it ever since. slow down. step back.

I personaly would at least have the discussion with him then be prepared to give yourself some space for a while to allow yourself time to heal.

You may come to the point that you decide you can never trust again but you may find that you can. That is a DECISION you can make later

[Ambivalent]

"H. is not passive aggressive. Or maybe he has become that...I don't know at this point."

He's not and hasn't acted that way towards you. THAT you worked out in your own head. Mindreading on your part

The reason I said maybe is, prior to him leaving he started leaving his shoes in the middle of walkways, and where I could trip on them. Looking back it seemed intentional, considering the agreement we had abut leaving things about.

So no mindreading here, just realizing.

"Something inside me has died. He is very needy right now, and I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I want to at this point."

How about stop doing what doesn't work, and in your case it's making up scenarios in your head.

Really, okay so it may be a prostitute? Call girls go shopping with johns instead of taking cash?

"I don't feel sexual about him at present. With the stress this has caused, the stress of school, the stress of what I have to do around him, the stress of trying to function, I am slowly being eaten away."

That's YOUR choice. You are causing the stress to yourself.

Mr. Bond, anxiety is not a choice, stress is not a choice. And as for the receipt I know my husband enough to know that the purchase was not for a friend, not for a buddy, not for me, my kids or my in laws. So either an affair or a prostitute. No need for Viagra in his bag either, unless trying to sustain an erection. He has NO heart condition!

"Sorry if I can't just snap back. This is over 33 years I've given to this man. I have been forgiving in the past. I have discussed and shared how I felt about ugly behavior before, and then let it go."

You also were responsible for what happened 50% of the time

And the point of this is? I've been pretty open and honest on here and with my husband about our mistakes that WE made.

And yes, I have worked my ass off, and I am venting, and sobbing and mourning...OKAY?

"I never threw it in his face. I took him at his word. That is gone. How does someone ever trust again?"

You're totally mindreading on things that may or may not have happened.

Actually I'm not. I'm referring to past behaviors , not to the receipt.

I believe you aren't completely up to speed on what I have written.

"He is being so " nice " because he feels guilty about his dual life. He knows this is wrong. He does have a choice. He is not under the influence of heavy drugs, or alcohol, he is not an addict. He is an adult and has chosen to do this.""

This is mindreading especially. You don't "know" your H. Assumptions are what have killed MANY relationships. Stop saying you "know" him. After all, you never "knew" he was going to leave you. Stick to actual facts and not what fantasies you are coming up with on your own.

He has expressed his guilt to me, on several occasions. I may be mind reading as to the possibility of him feeling guilty about him and another woman, but I seriously doubt it.

If he wasn't guilty , there would be no reason to hide this from me, or at this point not be honest. This comes from a relationship of over 33 years. He doesn't want me to hate him, that too was expressed. He doesn't want his daughters to hate him.

He is not a sociopath, charming , yes. Not that devious.

Yes my head is whirling, and if I didn't know his past lies, behavior , and other pieces of information, I would be way more inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I am not planning on confronting him until I have
control over my emotions. At present I am all over the place, and I have to see him again in the next 24 hours.

Part of why I don't want to confront him is that it "seemed" as if the past three days were good. We connected. Of all the people who wishes I didn't come across this it is I.

If I could have continued and not discovered it, perhaps I would never know and everything would be so much easier.

No plans to do anything until after I go to counseling on Tuesday. But I am raw, and I cannot help the way I feel.

[Wonka]

I'm so disgusted at my decision in choice of a man.

Amb,

Take a look back and ask yourself what made you fall in love with the H in the first place. He was the man that you married and create a family with him. You made that choice when you married him. You did not feel disgust at all when you walked down the aisle.

Right now, H has been kidnapped by yours truly as in MIB "Men in Black" aliens and whisked away on a far away Mother Ship and replaced with a C-3PO clone that isn't H at all. His innards are on the blinker and not in good working order at all. That was not a conscious choice by H at all. He didn't wake up on a Halloween morning scheming and devising various evil ways to call up numerous curses from the big black cauldron upon you and the family! How crazy is that thought process!?? Right. I most certainly didn't do this when the onset of MLC hit me unawareness.

Something inside me has died.

Yeah, the old and weak Amb is no more! A receipt did not kill you. You're giving it way tooooo much power. Good gosh...many of us have had to face all sorts of god-awful stuff when we stumbled on our spouses' affairs. Some have caught their MCLer/WASes in bed with the OW/OM in the midst of intercourse or fellatio. Guess what? We've survived those nuclear blasts and picked ourselves up from the floor.

So can you. The choice is in your hands. Would you rather be right as exemplified by self-righteous, moralizing) or be happy by forgiveness and unconditional love? It totally up to you. First, you need to get past the internal anger and foot stomping over the discovery of a receipt which is just a piece of paper!

It's high time to show a "new" Amb who is steely strong, calm and collected!!! Out with the old and usher in the new awesome Amb.

He is being so " nice " because he feels guilty about his dual life.

You just don't know. That is purely mindreading. LET IT GO.

He knows this is wrong. He does have a choice. He is not under the influence of heavy drugs, or alcohol, he is not an addict. He is an adult and has chosen to do this.

As a former MLCer, I can say without any qualms that that is not the case at all. If H were a non-MLCer, I'd probably say that he might have some inkling of knowing this is "wrong." From our experience, we are in SO much pain and feeling incredibly overwhelmed with EVERYTHING that we want to GET THE HELL away from our spouses and marital home. Shouldn't this be the first clue that "something" is definitely wrong with the MLCer, right? The reason we obtain OWs/OMs is to feel good about ourselves. In my case, my OW was simply a woman who happened to be available for the taking. Which is why many of the A's you see in MLCers are often affaired down.

We certainly didn't choose our MLC...for sure! Not by a long shot. It wasn't something that we picked out from the big manual called "Life" with unabashed delight.

Take a look around the MLC forum and piecing, nearly all LBSs have made the choice to get past the affair and work their way though it.

What do you want to do, Amb? The choice is in YOUR own hands. Choose wisely.

[MrBond]

"The reason I said maybe is, prior to him leaving he started leaving his shoes in the middle of walkways, and where I could trip on them. Looking back it seemed intentional, considering the agreement we had abut leaving things about.

So no mindreading here, just realizing."

Had to chuckle at this. It is mindreading. And besides, did you actually ask him about this? If not, then you're mindreading. Maybe he just got lazy. Doesn't mean that he was "intentionally" trying to hurt you. If I were passive aggressive, I could think of doing alot worse things than leaving my shoes out.

"Really, okay so it may be a prostitute? Call girls go shopping with johns instead of taking cash?"

I wasn't sure if you were being serious about this quote or being sarcastic. Can't tell from the rest of the mindreading.

"Mr. Bond, anxiety is not a choice, stress is not a choice."

Yes it is. It is self-inflicted. If you started detaching (as is DB 101) you wouldn't be affecting yourself like this.

"And as for the receipt I know my husband enough to know that the purchase was not for a friend, not for a buddy, not for me, my kids or my in laws. So either an affair or a prostitute. No need for Viagra in his bag either, unless trying to sustain an erection. He has NO heart condition!"

So you need to decide if you want to save the M or not. He sees himself as "separated" from you and that means (to him) he can do as he chooses. And to be frank, he is free to do what he wants to just as much as you do.

"And the point of this is? I've been pretty open and honest on here and with my husband about our mistakes that WE made."

But right now it's not the mistakes that the two of you have done that you can control. You can only correct YOUR mistakes.

"And yes, I have worked my ass off, and I am venting, and sobbing and mourning...OKAY?"

Venting, sobbing and mourning are perfectly fine. HOWEVER, your posts are showing that you're actually poisoning your mind with thoughts that YOU created. They may or may not be true, but right now they are being generated by yourself with no proof.

"I believe you aren't completely up to speed on what I have written."

I am. I just decided to step in because your thought process was escalating in a direction that I felt wasn't going to help your sitch at all.

"He has expressed his guilt to me, on several occasions. I may be mind reading as to the possibility of him feeling guilty about him and another woman, but I seriously doubt it."

More mindreading. And in any event, if it was the worst case scenario that he had an OW, then you need to decide if you can forgive this or not. This also includes not bringing it up after you two reconcile.

"If he wasn't guilty , there would be no reason to hide this from me, or at this point not be honest. This comes from a relationship of over 33 years."

Mindreading. You don't even know if he was "hiding" anything.

"He doesn't want me to hate him, that too was expressed. He doesn't want his daughters to hate him."

Of course not, because he left.

"He is not a sociopath, charming , yes. Not that devious."

You are the one presenting him as a sociopath. Not us.

"I am not planning on confronting him until I have control over my emotions. At present I am all over the place, and I have to see him again in the next 24 hours."

Not only do you have to have control over your emotions. You need to have control over your thoughts.

"Part of why I don't want to confront him is that it "seemed" as if the past three days were good. We connected. Of all the people who wishes I didn't come across this it is I."

Then increase those positive interactions with him.

[Ambivalent]

Receive text from H.

"HTTR
Redskins win in overtime.
I'm at KOC for xxxxx'x 40TH
birthday party

Later text
" No hunting tomorrow.
I have work stuff to do.
I think you should take the car to the tire place in the morning

I have not responded, doesn't really look like it needs one.

[back56]

Ambivalent,

I did very similar mind reading with my husband that you are doing. 95% of what I thought was going down did not happen. I have to admit that I kind of got off on thinking I was really in the know and had a handle on what my husband was up to. And as it unfolded, I found I was wrong. Even in light of what I thought was good evidence. I'm not saying your husband isn't having an affair, but I AM saying that no matter what you think or how you feel right now, you really don't know the facts. To let that "monster" go will be the best gift you can give yourself right now. It's not about being naive or blind or stupid. It's about letting go of control. In my own case I had so many details wrong about my husband and the OW. I am actually kind of embarrassed at how wrong I was about my assumptions. This may not be the case for you.......but many of us have been in your shoes, only later to find out the OP is/was really not a factor. And trust me, though I don't know why you should, you don't know me, the OW is not the reason for your troubles. Hang in there. Allow yourself the freedom to believe in the possibility that you really don't have all the accurate facts. You are at a critical point in determining the course moving forward. My best to you. Back56