I won't give up II

[BrightFuture]

NLT, I’m with you here. How do you enforce the boundaries? It is a tough one in your situation. I’ve read all the good advice to you and I still don’t have a clue what would be an effective enforcement. It seems like OW doesn’t have much problem with you, since she waived at you. Or she thinks that you are not relevant. I wonder if he talks to her about you in the same way he talks to you about her, and she is ok with it. If this is the case, he is going to continue the same behavior.

I lean towards Portia’s advice to go dim a little bit, become a little mysterious.

[Notlikingthis]

Fy,

Thinking of the benefits that I supply. Hmmm, there really aren't any benefits unless we look at being polite, listening to his woes and accepting a dinner invitation occasionally as benefits. Maybe he sees those as benefits as I could be a raving B when he stops by.

I really never thought of setting a boundary for something that I had no control over or might not even know if he crosses. It would be easy to voice how disrespected I feel when they act as if we're all best of friends. As for running into our daughter again, my first thought is to tell him to send the hooker to the store by herself so that there won't be another traumatic experience for him. That makes me sound like a "mom" solving HIS problem. Asking him to be respectful of our daughter and letting him figure out what that means may be an option too.

I know that he doesn't want to lose what is left of our r. I hear it in his words and feel it when I talk to him. I've been looking through posts and archives to find the proper way to set a boundary. Once it's out there, I will have no problem enforcing it. It has to be set with a non threatening tone and that's where I'm lost.

When we had our last conversation about the sale of the car he agreed to let me pick up the check (will have both of our names on it) from the dealership and deposit into a joint 2 year financial instrument. I set another small one when he came by a few days ago asking me if he could take a bottle of wine with him. I flat out said no, if you need wine the grocery store has many to choose from...I said it with a smile in my voice but he got the point. He tried to argue a little and I told him that the bottles in the cellar were purchased for US. He dropped it.

RL, I didn't see your post here until after I posted on your thread. I'm in full agreement about why they take ow/om back or even continuing in a so called relationship with someone that they speak so poorly of. Your h might have a legitimate reason for his behavior because of his Lyme's disease. Mine doesn't. He's a bright man who has gotten lost in the smoke and mirrors of the ow.

Today he called to tell me about another award that he received at work. He has a wall and desk full of awards and commendations for the work that he has done over the past 10 years with his current company. Excellence in this, Outstanding performance in that, Creativity awards, blah, blah, blah. They mean nothing to him except to feed his ego now. He is invincible and entitled during this mlc, just as a teenager would feel.

He has been just slightly more aware recently. He explained to me why he wanted to sell the car and how plans on selling a few more items that he doesn't need. Backing up 3-4 years now. When we moved to our new home here our decision was based on downsizing our home, possessions, getting out of the rat race and simplifying our lifestyle. We got rid of at least 1/3 of our belongings and kept only what we valued most. Over the past year or so he's accumulated some extras that weren't necessary but that he thought he wanted or needed.

He's decided to go back to that philosophy and is getting rid of everything that he sees no need for, telling me that they are just "things". I see it as a positive as he's gone back to a pre-mlc attitude. The car, which btw I'm happy to see go as it was tainted by ow's ickyness, was the car that he played musical garages with when they had their blow outs. It was a 2008 sporty sedan with less than 3,000 miles on it. They gave US a little over $22K for it. The rest of the items won't have nearly the value but it's the idea of coming full circle that has me thinking about where he's headed. I could be dead wrong but maybe he's starting to think more rationally.

He will be left with his truck and the ow is going to bring her old van up here. It's one that she would have had towed to the junk yard had he not told her that she should bring it up here if she wanted as there is no more sporty sedan for her. HA! In my dreams he is squeezing her into a lifestyle that she doesn't want and will probably not put up with for very long.

There is more to this but I will continue as it unfolds.

Thanks again for stopping by to help me see things in a clearer way. I'll get this eventually. Reading has helped me remember that there is no one set way to do this and no concrete answers to most of the questions that I have. I have to do the hard part and find a way that works for me and my mlcer.

[ForeverYoung]

"I really never thought of setting a boundary for something that I had no control over or might not even know if he crosses."

We have no control over anything they do, only our response to it.

True, if he's flaunting OW around town and you don't know about it, you can't apply your consequence. That's ok. But what about all the times you do know about it? Like when they wave to you, or D or friends see them and report back to you?

I'd be inclined to refuse all contact for X period of time after learning he crossed this boundary. "Sorry, we can talk or meet up tomorrow" (or whatever time period works for you)

He won't like it at first, but I'll bet he'll begin to respect you more in time. He seriously doesn't want to lose you. (and I don't blame him!) Now you have to stop baking him cakes.

No infractions? Good! You're best buddies. Reward positive behavior.

[Notlikingthis]

Bea,

I'm seeing just how difficult this can be with a mlcer. Even if they're not mean, angry or haven't given you a clue as to what was missing in the marriage, it's still a puzzling situation to be in. I think there were two things that he's complained about and neither of them had to do with my behaviors before his mlc. I rarely told him what to do without him asking. My big mistake in his mind was me voicing my displeasure with the situation and telling him what the consequences would be. "If you go visit the ow, you will be doing irreparable damage to our marriage (pre dbing)." To me that was more setting a boundary with a twist and voicing an opinion. I am far from perfect so I've had to figure out on my own what he may not have appreciated about me.

I'm a true supporter of and encourage individuality. What's right for me isn't necessarily right for someone else. If I saw him struggling with making a decision I might make a suggestion or try to get him to talk it through but would rarely tell him what to do. The manner in which he and I solve problems and resolve issues is so different that no natter what it was, he was going to have to figure it out on his own.

Boundary setting is getting slightly easier as I read and think about how to do it without making threats as I said above. I'll get there. I started with the car and then the wine. I'll be damned if I'm going to let him take it and share it with her!!! That's what motivated me but that's not how or why he saw me setting the boundary. I simply said NO with little explanation. Right or wrong, it felt good and right to me and so far seems effective. What more can we ask for on this crazy journey that we've been thrown into.

As always, I appreciate and look forward to your posts. You really make me dig deep and think. That is what I need, my friend. Thank you.

[beatrice]

NLT you have an unusual MLCer who values you (mine doesn't, and makes that very clear). Also you are handling it well. Which is what always causes me to make comparisons with Holly, who I got to know on and off the boards.

You cannot, as you know, regulate the behaviour of your husband with OW, but you can, if you wish, point out the consequences to him. That sooner or later your daughter will realise what is going on for example. If you could have a pleasant conversation just asking him if he has considered what will happen if your daughter puts two and two together, and how she will then feel?

Incidentally I do not think it is bad dbing to tell a MLCer that an affair will do damage to the marriage. It is a fact, it has damaged the marriage, and your husband doesn't care.

Right now if he had to choose between OW and you he would probably choose OW, that is true, and it isn't sensible to push that choice on them. Gradually he will come to see that he has problems, and maybe deal with them. SO I agree no ultimatums but that is not the same as boundaries.

My xh knew OW1 was trashy, and that was part of the allure. I think you are handling it so well - the iron fist in the velvet glove -

[Notlikingthis]

Portia,

Sorry my night hawk friend, I missed your post. I'm having a sleepless night once again. So to answer your question, getting to bed earlier is hit and miss with me. Usually I can get there by midnight and most nights fall asleep but then wake up within a couple of hours wide awake. What's up with that? LOL

I like your suggestion about not accepting any dates at all. He will have to find someone else to entertain him while the ow is away. I've been playing it by ear with him up until now and sometimes accept and other times not. I have let him do the pursuing, calling and texting for quite awhile now. Contacting him only when there is a business related question and returning calls to him that require an answer.

Seeing the ow did make me laugh because of the ridiculous "costume/outfit" that she was wearing. Still not sure which it was but thinking back to before she became an issue in our marriage, she did dress in a very young way.

Is it possible that I'm detaching too much? I really don't care what they do as long as it doesn't effect my younger daughter. I still care about him and his well being and I haven't given up. Maybe I'm becoming numb to it all just as you have. That's how I feel today anyway.

I appreciate your thoughts and yes, I will do the right thing for me. I think that changes as time passes.

[Notlikingthis]

BF,

I agree, this can be very confusing at times. I have decided to enforce what I can and not worry about the things that they might be doing while I'm not around.

The ow doesn't have much problem with me because we knew each other before she decided that MY h was easy prey. She has much more confidence in herself than she should, imo. If she wins the "prize" then she deserves everything that she will get. A man who is as broken as she is and will soon be as penniless as she is! She is no different than most of the ow in any mlcers life. Reading what job posted on how they Affair Down on another thread just reinforces what most of us believe. The ow is a band-aide for a much bigger problem.

As for whether he talks to her about me? I don't think he that does. According to him she controls all of their conversations and tries to control what and how he thinks. A woman like that wouldn't tolerate him talking about what she sees as her competition! LOL

Thanks for the encouragement and your thoughts. I haven't been posting much lately but have been reading archives. I will try to find your thread and catch up with your situation.

[beatrice]

NLT thanks for posting on my thread - I too was a night hawk for the longest time. Now I usually sleep deeply and soundly, thanks goodness. The not sleeping is depleting. Sometimes I have a restless night. MLC is traumatizing for us and it takes its toll

As for 'too detached' there is no such thing imo. I suspect you are a mix of detaching with a bit of numbness thrown in. When I manage real detachment it is almost zen like - you care, but not in any way that engages you emotionally in their drama. I am truly sorry (as well as exasperated and occasionally still hurt) for all that has happened and is happening, but I can do nothing about it except live my life

I think you are a class act

[BrightFuture]

NLT, thanks for stopping by at my thread. You were right, I went to the vacation home again. It was planned and lots of friends were there. I remembered your description of OW when I saw one of these women my H made friends with. Well, it was a sister of one of the new friends. And she did look like and behaved like a hooker. Then I remembered that our mutual friend (male) told me last March that he saw H fancying this woman and went to give H a piece of his mind. He told H that if he left me for “this”, then is a very mad man. I was disgusted when I thought about my H and this woman. But then I thought that if this is what he wants, then this is just who he is right now and I don’t want to be part of it.

[Notlikingthis]

Hi All,


It's been awhile since I posted mostly because I've been busy with my life and partly because I've been watching the parade from the sidelines!

Nothing specific has happened although there have been some positive signs of H growing weary or maybe even bored with his life with ow.

He's also been revisiting his past....more on that later. He is here and waiting for me to come and watch a movie with him so I have to make this short. He has been calling many times a day and stopping by more often lately as well. Today he left work at noon and called to ask me if it would be okay for him to stop in for a few minutes. Long story short, he stayed for lunch and then asked me if it would be alright if he came by this evening.

I will update with more details after he leaves. I need prayers and your thought tonight. It's been relaxed and I don't have a feeling of dread yet I'm not sure what he's up to either!!!

Gotta run.