"homework" from job - Hi Job, thank you

[Pudmuddle]

I think that is the difficult part for me, of how to get myself unstuck. I will take your questions and starting writing it out to see if I can find answers for myself.

There was a time in the past few years, where I knew I was not a person I would want to be married to and depression started to grow. I internalized a lot and didn't know how to release it effectively. I didn't think my H wanted to hear it, when in reality he probably did want to help and I ignored his efforts. I thought he didn't want to see that emotional person, and the last few years proved that, because he was already over it.

I have some thinking to do.

[Underdog]

Pud,

I think the hardest thing in making any changes to ourselves is figuring out where to begin. And then how to begin. My dad always tells me when I'm overwhelmed that you only eat an elephant one bite at a time. I'm 51 now, and he still tells me this.

Some time ago, I found Debbie Ford. She was an incredible person, speaker and writer who passed away earlier this year from cancer. Her sister is managing her website now, and she's got online classes and books if you want to peruse. One of the gems is The Best Year of Your Life.

The beauty in that book is that you can begin Day 1 now and not wait until the new year to kick start your own path to happiness and self fulfillment.

We used to say here way back when that the best thing to do is to stop rubbernecking at his train wreck and just stay on our own side of the street and keep moving. You'll be a happier and healthier you, no matter what happens.

Great job on the weight loss and getting on track there.

Mach and Cat have done a good job keeping focused on the issue of MLC or no. He's right in that your path is the same regardless. Some people just never get through the MLC process. They stay messed up and just don't feel they have what it takes to heal their own issues. And sometimes they do, but they wind up being completely different people. And some folks are lucky enough to discover that they both want to be different people together (and yes, I'm happy to report that I know 2 such couples who muddled through their own MLCs and wound up together, happy AND healthy).

There are no guarantees. So without them, you have to commit yourself to a plan that guarantees you are not stagnating but growing. You make the changes that matter in the 2nd half of your life. Does that make sense?

It's definitely not for the faint of heart. The good news is that you'll be a role model for your S16. He's at an age where he'll soak up your positive actions and learn from you.

But it's so much easier to do if you start small and then build on your successes.

You can do this.

Betsey

[Pudmuddle]

Betsey, thank you so much for that post. You all are definitely giving me my homework! Love it.

I feel stronger every time I come on these boards and read from the wisdom and experience. Hopefully I can soon really feel like I am being pushed out of this wheel rut.

I will look into the Debbie Ford site and books, sounds very fascinating.

On another note, I have seen glimpses of my old H the past few days. One time he called and asked if I needed anything at the grocery store. Me...shocked. So I let him know we needed salad stuff, lettuce, tomatoes, carrots. He said ok well send that to me in a text. He couldn't remember lettuce, tomato and carrots. LOL, ok. So I did. Then I noticed in the frig that evening that he had bought a guacamole I like and some extra veggies that I hadn't asked for. this is unusual because neither he nor my son eat the veggies I like to eat, so I knew he had done it for me.

Then he noticed a new jacket I had on and told me I looked nice in it. Then today, he noticed I had different glasses on. I had found them in an old box the other day and they looked like hot teacher glasses, LOL.

My S16 still won't tell his father what is bothering him, but he has told me. I told H the other day I wanted to respect S's wishes so I would not tell him until my S felt ready to talk to his Dad. H was actually accepting and ok with that, said I should absolutely respect S's wishes.

I took my S16 to a therapist today, to talk things out with since he has been feeling down and low. Good thing is the therapist said my son was mostly a normal kid. He did see a bit of depression and asked him to join a teenage group therapy. My S was kind of glad about this, so I think it will be a good thing.

Then when we got home from that H wanted to know what happened. I asked S if he wanted to start or if I could. He didn't say anything so I just said what the therapist said to me and about the group therapy. My H goes "Oh so you were there?" Um...Derhee? I think he is feeling really left out in this sitch, but he hasn't shown much in pushing to get involved either. My S just told him I will tell you when I'm ready. I think that hurt H.

Then when I asked H earlier about his day at work, he just grumbled and said "It's just the same old stuff, it will never change". This is something he has said for years about his job. In the past I tried to convince him to look at if from a different perspective then things COULD change. Now I just looked at him and said "well it could change". Not very validating but I just don't know what to say to him.

He has often said this in some heated discussions we've had in the past or in talking with things his family deals with...that things will never change. How sad that he is stuck there. I probably should have said 'I understand it's annoying for you, what do you want to do?" His reply in the past would have been, 'Nothing, it won't change'. Sigh.

He has been coming up to my room in the mornings when I have my light on and has small talked and then said Have a Nice Day. He wasn't doing that before.

I think he is not understanding why I have been happy the past few days. Pud is learning to detach and be happy! When I thought he had left for his kickboxing class, I was in the kitchen with my little dog, Hank, and I was exclaiming to Hank how happy I was to see one last pickle in the frig! LOL!! Normally my S eats them all.

My H happened to come back upstairs to retrieve his travel drink glass and heard my say this to my dog and H kind of had a funny smile on his face at me being silly.

Silly stuff.

[cat04]

Pud,

I haven't stated whether I think MLC or not for a few reasons...

Mostly because there is so much in your sitch that I am not sure.

And what I think doesn't matter that much anyway.

There is depression, on both parts, frustration, anger, and confusion as well...

For me, it mattered whether my X was MLC or WAS. It mattered because I am the type of person who needs to understand...

It helped me because as soon as I understood, then I knew where to start. With me...

Ultimately, I would have started with me anyway, however I had developed such a low opinion of myself (oddly only within my marriage), that without that understanding, I could have spent years and years changing everything he spewed (it was similar to Angela's H's spew) and never even scratched the surface and I would have been still doing everything wrong.

That is something I think you can understand.

Of course I went on the LBS diet and quickly began feeling better about my physical appearance.

As I started weeding through the spew to figure out what I agreed with that my X said, and what I wanted to change about myself, it became easier to become unstuck.

I started by deciding that I didn't have enough activity outside of the house and I started walking once a week with a friend. I hated it, but I forced myself to go.

As I realized that I didn't like that but did like being out of the house, it was easier to find things to get me out.

I made a bucket list of sorts. Not the true type of bucket list, but simply one of things I thought I might like to try.

I got reinvolved in some of my old hobbies. I got busy enjoying my S.

And I started to feel happier. And that made dealing with everything else easier. Because I was in a different mindset.

Sometimes we have to force the change. At least initially.

So pick something, anything, and just do it. And see where it leads...

[Pudmuddle]

So H didn't come up to my room this morning, nor say goodbye have a nice day like he has been. And you know what? I knew he wouldn't! LOL and it did not bother me at all. In fact I couldn't wait until he left.

We shall see what transpires today and this weekend.

It snowed here! So it's cold and snowy day. Good day to stay home and snuggle...with my DOGS. I have to go to work but nice thought.

[Underdog]

Cat,

That's a fabulous post!

As I started weeding through the spew to figure out what I agreed with that my X said, and what I wanted to change about myself, it became easier to become unstuck.

I did the same, and it was very tough. But you have to start somewhere, right?

So pick something, anything, and just do it. And see where it leads...

Exactly! The Debbie Ford book I recommended makes it really easy to do this in manageable chunks, and any day of the 365 day year can start now. It made me realize that you don't need a new year's resolution to commit to a new habit or belief system.

Pud, you and I might be geographically close because it snowed here this morning. If I wasn't so busy at work, with so much crap happening that requires my direct intervention, I'd stay home myself. I like being home on snowy days.

So hopefully you can use Cat to propel you to start your own path. I didn't really care about the MLC/WAS distinction - only because the end result was the same and I still needed to turn our ship around to know. We were separated for 2 years before he told me that he wanted to pull the plug and file for D. At that point, I knew that I didn't want to continue to try to make someone love me who wanted out. I figured if we were supposed to be together, it would happen somehow. And just letting things go the way they were supposed to go made both of us happier in the long run.

It's hard. No 2 ways around it. And the only way out is through.

So, Pud, where and when do you want to take the first step?

Good luck-

Betsey

[Ab Fab]

Pud, you actually seem to be doing really well right now, but keeping it up can be hard.

sometimes you just have to accept that some days will be better than others, and good will eventually outnumber bad.

Try to just change one little thing that you are stuck with at a time - and when you do something that works move on to the next.

Seems H is noticing the changes though - use that as an incentive to continue

[Pudmuddle]

Cat, thank you again for the insight, into your own sitch which helps me understand better.

I am still absorbing what everyone has said in my post here and am doing some serious thinking and self-study. I actually do make an effort to get out and jog every day, even if I don't feel like it. Afterwards I have happy chemicals and can PMA much better!

The reason I think he is MLC, is because he seems to need the drug...the adoration, and appreciation and the high he gets from the temporary happiness of someone who puts him on his macho pedestal.

My H won't and doesn't spew at me (Thank God) so I don't know what he thinks I should fix. I have asked him for a list of such things in the past if he couldn't tell me in person. So while it's good he doesn't spew, I also don't know what he sees either. Hence my need to reexamine past issues, fights, behaviors to see if I can glean any insight that way. But for now I can't so I am looking at myself as if someone else would want to date or marry me, what would they see?

Underdog, we are close. I am in Aurora, I think you are in Denver somewhere? I will let you know what I choose to do to get unstuck as soon as I figure that out. I've been muddling a few things over.

All alone, I DO feel better and stronger today. I am realizing how much I lost my self in my efforts to make H happy with me. Total fail. I realize I cannot make him happy if he is not happy with him first. Same for me.

[Underdog]

Pud,

I realize I cannot make him happy if he is not happy with him first. Same for me.

This sums up everything in very few words.

Backing up...

My H won't and doesn't spew at me (Thank God) so I don't know what he thinks I should fix. I have asked him for a list of such things in the past if he couldn't tell me in person.

Well, maybe you can back into the list. What behaviors, thoughts or belief systems push him (and/or others) away? For example, do you have to have the last word? Do you use one-upmanship to discount his pain? Do you have to be right? Do you get defensive when people offer criticism? Do you lash out in anger when you can't control people and/or situations?

I threw these out there because they seem to be common traits of those of us on the BB - and they were definitely on my own personal list as well. If one of those kick you in the gut, choose that one to work on and then put it on your list. Identify things you can do to change that behavior and go for it. Try one and see? You may not be comfortable for the first month while changing, but stick with it.

But for now I can't so I am looking at myself as if someone else would want to date or marry me, what would they see?

That's a great way to put your truths to the test.

LOL, you're in Aurora? I work in SE Denver, right on the border of Aurora and live in the DTC area. My XH lives in Aurora. So not far.

Sounds like you've got a lot to muddle over. It's a good place to start. Keep up the jogging and I'm sure you'll get some good ideas.

Stay warm!

Betsey

[Pudmuddle]

Well, maybe you can back into the list. What behaviors, thoughts or belief systems push him (and/or others) away? For example, do you have to have the last word? Do you use one-upmanship to discount his pain? Do you have to be right? Do you get defensive when people offer criticism? Do you lash out in anger when you can't control people and/or situations?

Wow. Yes. Yes. Yes. Used to, but no longer. Yes. The funny thing is I used to not be this way, this has come out in dealing with all the emotion and life events that have occurred. Also, the type of job I do requires that I stick to my guns even if no one is listening at the moment. So I am positive that some of that transferred over to my R. I used to love confrontations because I handled them with grace so they didn't bother me. Now I feel like I am afraid of my own shadow. I also used to love criticism from others because I knew it meant I needed to improve something. Unless it was unwarranted.

Thanks for helping me look at this another way Betsey. Awesome.

LOL, you're in Aurora? I work in SE Denver, right on the border of Aurora and live in the DTC area. My XH lives in Aurora. So not far.

I live in Aurora and work in the Southglenn area. Nice to know your nearby!