I agree about your book idea. I think many times people move on to a second marriage and bring the same 'ol problems with them and wonder why the new marriage is failing. For sure DB'ing helps with that. We are taking control of our behaviour and taking accountability for our actions. You are right, it is easy to put the blame on the other person. Hopefully we can come out of it in the end with a fair perspective on everything.
Chicken or Egg would also be a great title for a book I am not sure what context you were using that expression, but I think of that "chicken or egg" question a lot in different scenarios. For example, my H thinks that I don't trust him. Now is it that I don't trust him because he seems to be pulling away from me and I am wondering why, or is he pulling away from me because he feels that I don't trust him?
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
I think many times people move on to a second marriage and bring the same 'ol problems with them and wonder why the new marriage is failing. For sure DB'ing helps with that.
This is absolutely true. The way I think of things right now between W and I is that neither of us are really healthy enough for a relationship at this point, so it actually makes sense that we're S. Both people need to be at a healthy place before entering into a mature, loving relationship. Part of moving on for me will be completely accepting of whatever path W takes and not holding any grudges or resentments against her. What good would any of that do anyhow?
Originally Posted By: chasingpavements
Hopefully we can come out of it in the end with a fair perspective on everything.
I wholeheartedly agree. One of my goals right now is to reach some sort of objectivity about all of this. I know I'm automatically biased just by being "a side" in the relationship. To truly grow I believe we need to find a place closer to objective truth where we can see our own faults as they are, be honest about them and not try to hide from them.
Originally Posted By: chasingpavements
Chicken or Egg would also be a great title for a book I am not sure what context you were using that expression, but I think of that "chicken or egg" question a lot in different scenarios. For example, my H thinks that I don't trust him. Now is it that I don't trust him because he seems to be pulling away from me and I am wondering why, or is he pulling away from me because he feels that I don't trust him?
Funny how we have the same thing going on. Another copntext where we have it is that my W complains that she doesn't feel at peace around me or that I'm not calm. For right now at least I think a lot of this has to do with the fact of the sitch we're in. In other words, if we weren't in the process of getting D, we'd likely be more at ease with each other. If the children weren't in the midst of having their family broken up and we both wanted to work on R, things would likely be more calm. Maybe I'm wrong, but what a conundrum!
ETC
"Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
Well, for better or worse, below is an example of the dynamic I've got going on with my W.
W: So, I was thinking of bringing some food over to your place so we can eat as a family.
M: Sounds great! See ya then.
W: Oh, I like the plan you've come up for separating the finances.
M: Yeah, I'm happy with it too. It makes the most sense for us right now.
W: So, we'll just talk to the L at our meeting to finalize everything?
M: Sounds great honey!
W: OK, bye.
Of course, I'm exaggerating just a smidge, but sometimes I wonder if I'm even DBing anymore. I'm just so fine with life going in whatever direction it goes and have basically tucked away my M in a little box somewhere. I'm so focused on trying to loving everyone in my life unconditionally (including W) D doesn't seem to be a big deal anymore. There's good and bad mixed in there... It will be interesting to see where it all leads.
I will admit sometimes I feel this rage inside of "how could she do this to me and our family!?!?" and then I just take a step back and say to the little boy "get in the back seat buddy."
Thoughts?
ETC
"Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
Hi etc. I think that you have come a long way, and that you are at a good point right now, where you realize that you are fine with things, no matter which way you are headed. No matter what you will be fine. You ARE DB'ing.. you are GAL and taking care of yourself and your children. You are making your happiness a priority.
It's good that you are pushing those thoughts of "how could she do this to me?" out of your mind. I find myself slipping into those thoughts every so often as well. Then I just rationalize to myself that there is no help in worrying about things that now cannot be changed. However, we can move forward and keep on DB'ing and living life to it's fullest.
Originally Posted By: etc
There's no place to be angry with the MLCer b/c this is really just a stage of life for them that they were going to go through no matter what. They're not doing this on purpose to be vengeful even though we're often taking it this way. We need to have complete compassion for them no matter how difficult it is b/c they're actually teaching us about ourselves and how much we were overly dependent upon them pre-BD. Our dependence (even if it's a mis-perception on their part) burned them out and for whatever reason gave them this strong urge to run from us.
I need to keep remembering this.. that they are not doing it on purpose, they are on their own journey right now.
Originally Posted By: etc
The only way for us to really heal is to completely let go of the past over and over again and to start each day as a new beginning. This is the only way to true forgiveness and thus this is the only way reconciliation will ever be possible for our sitches. We need to prove that we won't hold any of this over their head when their journeys are finally complete.
Well said etc!!
I especially like the last part about not holding it over their heads. I need to remember that. My H wants to have a talk with me about possibly reconciling. We are both trying to think of some things we would like to change in order to move forward. In talking with my H in the past I have usually jumped into 'defensive mode' rather than validating, and trying to understand what he is going through, and actually listening to his concerns. I used to be on the "debate team" in high school. lol!!!! I think H and I tend to debate during arguments (why we are right and they are wrong.. not good!!!)
For me, going into this talk, I need to remember what you have written here about not holding things over his head to be used against him... At times I feel so resentful toward him, feeling that he has put me through so much pain. I feel like every so often I need to go back and remember what you have written there about their journey and having compassion for them.
Thanks etc!!!
M: 8 yrs T:14 Twins:7 S:5 BD:'NLILWY': Feb/2013 Mar/Apr/May: MC June: "living in limbo" Sept 12: H moves out Oct 20: reconciling Jan-Feb 2014:MC Feb 2014: separating, and H moved out.
Thank you CP!! You don't know how much it means to me to get your responses. They're so helpful. I love how positive you are. I hope your H wakes up to what a catch you are. His loss if he doesn't...
I know exactly what you mean about debating. We've been in the right-fighting mode ourselves for a long time and I now know how detrimental it can be to a relationship. At times you think it's good, b/c it shows that you at least "care" enough to debate but over the long haul the debates get exhausting and most never get properly resolved. Now I know how important it is to choose battles wisely, throw out the scoreboard and agree to disagree often.
I feel like I'm in a pretty good place right now, but it feels kinda odd to not be "fighting" for my M as I see us going right to the D process, you know? We're getting ready to get legal and though I'm sure it's not going to happen overnight, I never dreamed I'd be here. I guess it's at least good to know I'm not alone, though I wouldn't wish this upon anyone.
Regardless, I'm thankful that we're getting along through it all - esp. for our kids' sake. I'm finding that DBing has helped me come to a place where I can be OK with any outcome, be more relaxed about the sitch overall and still have a great life.
My big challenge right now is loneliness. I don't want to get into a new R right now and have a lot of guy friends, but I do miss closeness and good conversations with women my age. I'm trying to figure out ways to make new friends which is proving more difficult than during my college days. I know I have a lot of other stuff on my plate though and there's plenty of time for this...
Everything in its own time!!
Hang in there CP! You sound great!
ETC
"Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
I haven't been in your spot, but I would do as you said...STFU and take copious notes...commit to nothing ATM, just listen a lot to see where things stand and may go.
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
I am not sure what context you were using that expression, but I think of that "chicken or egg" question a lot in different scenarios. For example, my H thinks that I don't trust him. Now is it that I don't trust him because he seems to be pulling away from me and I am wondering why, or is he pulling away from me because he feels that I don't trust him?