It seems that you are missing a critical piece to relationship happiness- empathy. You seem very concerned with how other people hurt you or your feelings, yet are simultaneously unable to see how your words and actions affect and hurt others.
I suspect it is your lack of empathy that has driven your wife away - whether or not she is aware of the word or it's meaning. To her it feels as if everything has to revolve around you. What matters to her is never considered, unless it serves you as well. Several times by my count (I read all of your many, many posts) she has reached out to you in a very vulnerable way, by phone, text and in person. You squandered each opportunity to connect with her by throwing back at her how YOU were the hurt one, or how YOU were the one in the right. You've blown it at every chance she's thrown to you.
Reading DB, DR, or any other book will do you no good if you don't start empathizing with your wife (or anyone for that matter). Unless you've got a serious personality disorder, empathy can be learned- that's the good news.
You can start where it will most likely be the easiest for you: empathizing with your daughter. Sit in a quiet room and try to see life through her eyes. Imagine living through her day. Imagine how she sees you (not how she should see you, or how you see you). Imagine the emotions she is grappling with each day. Imagine the turmoil her world is in. How are each of the people in her life touching her? Who makes her feel safe and warm? Who makes her fear for her future? Who makes her happy and how? Who makes her sad and why?
We're you able to sit through the exercise and come out feeling like you understand her better, or did you focus on you and become impatient with it?
With few exceptions on this board, we have contributed directly to the issues we currently face in our marriages. Part of growing is learning from these mistakes an changing ourselves for the better. If you cannot see how you contribute to your own unhappiness, and the unhappiness of those around you, you will never see the need to make the changes in yourself that are required- for you and your family. you get advice on this board that you either simply dismiss, or put up a defense against.
You got you here. Do not attempt to shift the blame to anyone else, circumstance, or the universe. It's on you. If you had been looking at your actions as they affected your wife all along, you would be happily married right now and not posting on here. Writing back to me to defend yourself will not bring your wife back. Owning it and making changes might.
I'm hoping for your sake (but mostly your daughter's) that you are able to change.
-hs
Well here are my thoughts… What HS wrote spoke to me. I felt as if it could have been posted on my thread. Was it too much, no not really to me, but I am at a point that I need the hard truth and a kick in the A55. I have traveled with SP since the beginning and share several of his same traits, so maybe this is why I can relate in this way. It is very important to read what others write and do it knowing that they do it out of a sense of caring and wanting to help. I have been pushed over the edge by some of the post 25 has wrote on my thread and I go back to them often reading them over and over as there is hard truth in them. I think there is something positive in everyone’s post, as we are all trying to help the other person as well as ourselves. Do we ever get it wrong, ya no doubt, but we are trying. I think what I like best is the variety of personalities here… Urworthy, wise and kind. Mach1, makes you think and can see deep into a person. 25, tells it like it is and pushes us to change. Sandi, tells it like it is and pushes us to open our eyes Another stander, shoots from the hip with kindness and validation. Please no bad feelings from those I didn’t list, as there are so many… Just remember we are all helping each other and ourselves. Take what works for you and be grateful for this place.
M46,W41 D16,D18 M22,T25 BD 11/12 W moved out 01/13 Piecing 10/13 Divorced 01/15 "Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
Like 25 always says, lose the scorecard. No one here has said your W is blameless, all we've been saying is your posts have been almost solely focused on blaming your W for everything while owning none of your own faults. Even in this post you say you did have your faults, "BUT..." Whenever you say "but" you negate everything before it. DB'ing is all about owning your faults, forgiving your spouse for theirs, and moving on to make yourself the best possible person you can. You have never owned your faults because in your eyes, your W's faults are worse. What we're telling you is her faults DO NOT MATTER. Those are HERS to own. They are HER roadblock to being the best possible person she can be. You've got to focus on your faults and let hers go.
I don't know why, but today this rings pretty loudly in my ears. I really think I have been defensive during a lot of this, because I feel that Wife and I have been on opposing teams. Every time someone points out one of my flaw, I scored one for wife. Therefore, I had to knock her down a notch by pointing out her flaws....dumb!.....Thanks for this one, AS. Makes great sense!
SP. It's never too late to change, but know it's has to be for you. I am just now (finally) "seeing" that.
M46,W41 D16,D18 M22,T25 BD 11/12 W moved out 01/13 Piecing 10/13 Divorced 01/15 "Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
Most of your big post had me rolling my eyes and saying "again with the scorecard, this guy SURE likes measuring and he never comes out as the one who is 'more wrong', she always always does."
Though I still see most of your post that way, I also see some glimmers of insight and your last response to a post (from AS i think) is more hopeful to me.
Stay in your sandbox and do your work. Don't even look at your wife's sandbox, let alone comment on it or compare it to yours. That is going to slow down YOUR growth, which hurts you and does not hurt her, if that is your goal.
in other words, it's like I said,
"holding onto anger to hurt someone else is like
lighting yourself on fire, ----- to get smoke in their eyes."
(meaning, it does not make your wife think twice or feel bad about leaving you to have your negative thoughts about her, thrown in her face. Or to see your disapproval or to feel your judgement upon her.
On the contrary, it makes her feel MORE right about leaving you.
When you finally "get" this^^, it should help you detach. And to stay in your sandbox working only on you.
Because
Real insights are just that. You find a flaw you want to work on in You. And you do the work.
You do not then look up to see around you and then fault someone else - under the mistaken belief that it will "level the playing field" (so you won't feel so bad about yourself.) SP
There is NO "playing field", no "leveling out" either, and no one is competing with you. No one 'wins' because someone else loses.
You EACH are in charge of your life and that's all.
Feel good about yourself b/c you are working on you. Learn to accept that despite your flaws, which God knows all of, HE still loves you and you are still worthy.
Let's face it, the really deep seated fear we all had/have is that
"if we are such good people, why is the one person I truly loved, leaving me?" The gut wrenching fear is that we are not really lovable AND OR that no one will really love us again.
Those fears are lies.
When you realize this^^,
and that you do NOT have to see the world thru your family's eyes or put others down to "even it out", or think the glass is half empty,
you will so much happier.
And yes you will be loved again, if you want to be, which I think you do very much want. You just have your life to live as well as You can live it.
Not easy, but not complicated.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Daughters birthday is coming up. I decided to throw her a surprise party. I told W she was welcome to join in and celebrate it with us.
I am trying very hard to live my life in a healthy, happy way. I am conscious of my shortcomings, and I know that I have to actively work on improving myself. That alone is going to help me grow. Plus, I really want to grow and be a better person for myself and the people around me. I am proud of who I am. I always have been. I want to be even prouder. These are things that I am reminding myself of every day, no matter how hard the day is. I still feel a lot of sorrow, but I think that is probably to be expected. From time to time, I still feel a whole lot of anger as well. Just this morning, I woke up thinking about W again. I didn't wake with happy reminiscent dreams. I woke just flat pissed off at how she could do what she has done, not only to me, but mainly to daughter. I know that is just more of the same line of thinking, but I don't believe I have any control of my dreams. They just come out. Waking up feeling this way is not a great way to start a day, but I promise myself that I am going to turn it around and make the best of it. I am going to let that anger go.
TODAY, will be a great day and tomorrow even better!
No, I don't think that she did this TO me or TO daughter. That was a misuse of verbage on my part. I realize that this was her solution to what she felt was troubling her in the marriage. My point was, that I woke up angry from a dream (or nightmare depending on the perspective), and I made a conscious decision to turn it around before I even left the house this morning.
Daughters birthday is coming up. I decided to throw her a surprise party. I told W she was welcome to join in and celebrate it with us.
Wow! Well that had to be a tough thing for you to do, but I think it's a great move towards maintaining a good coparenting relationship. Good job!
Quote:
I am trying very hard to live my life in a healthy, happy way. I am conscious of my shortcomings, and I know that I have to actively work on improving myself. That alone is going to help me grow. Plus, I really want to grow and be a better person for myself and the people around me.
^^THAT^^ should be printed out and posted somewhere where you will see it every day
Quote:
From time to time, I still feel a whole lot of anger as well. Just this morning, I woke up thinking about W again. I didn't wake with happy reminiscent dreams. I woke just flat pissed off at how she could do what she has done, not only to me, but mainly to daughter. I know that is just more of the same line of thinking, but I don't believe I have any control of my dreams.
The anger is masking pain. Anger is an easy place to live. Pain isn't. But pain is temporary whereas anger will weave its tentacles all through your body. When you get angry, ask yourself why? Is it because you love your wife and want her to quit this crazy behavior and just come home already? And it brings you pain and sorrow that she does not? Or maybe it's because the sitch is hurting you financially, or taking you away from your D. Or maybe it's all of those things, or something else. Whatever it is, explore it, get to the ROOT of the pain and feel it, experience it, process it. Work through the hurt, don't use anger as a shield to hide from it.
The anger is masking pain. Anger is an easy place to live. Pain isn't. But pain is temporary whereas anger will weave its tentacles all through your body. When you get angry, ask yourself why? Is it because you love your wife and want her to quit this crazy behavior and just come home already? And it brings you pain and sorrow that she does not? Or maybe it's because the sitch is hurting you financially, or taking you away from your D. Or maybe it's all of those things, or something else. Whatever it is, explore it, get to the ROOT of the pain and feel it, experience it, process it. Work through the hurt, don't use anger as a shield to hide from it.
I think my pain is coming from several things, a lot of what you mentioned above. One thing that hasn't been said, and something that I think is one of my biggest struggles is, the lost connection. I miss the very simple things my family had together. I never thought those things would go away, and today they are just memories that haunt me when I sleep. I also feel pain about past experiences and togetherness with my W and D, things we shared, things we relied on each other for. I guess it is hard to explain all of it, but it does still hurt, very much so. A final thing that hurts is knowing that I can never go back. Even if W decided today that she made a mistake and wanted to return to our family, I wouldn't be able to get past the damage that has been done. I wouldn't be able to get past the fact that she was living as a couple with another man and incorporated my D into that relationship as if she never missed a beat. I couldn't get past the pain and heartache she has put our families through, that she has put me through. That hurts a lot.
And this is right where your W has been: {s}he made a mistake and wanted to return to our family, I wouldn't be able to get past the damage that has been done.
I hope you don't come back with "But she's the one who left the family!" There are many ways to leave a R, I left mine in many ways but was still living in the same house, sleeping in the same bed.
You have a choice hold on to the hurt or recognize it, be honest with yourself and use it to grow.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
