My last thread got pretty log, so i thought I would start another. It ended on a very defensive note. I felt like I was receiving a lot of unwarranted criticism. Specifically, there was an impression by multiple people that I lack compassion, and am bitter. That is not how I view myself.
I am struggling. I have never dealt with anything like this before. I don't know how I am supposed to deal with these situations "Compassionately". Last night was awful. Here is the text exchange my W and i had while I was at work:
Me: I was thinking about getting back into swing dancing. there is a dance on 9/21. I assume you are not interested in going. Do I need to get a sitter?
Her: I don't want to go and don't know about a sitter. Besides, I thought you didn't have any extra money and you were broke. Why don't you help pay for some of your kids activities that I can't pay for instead? Dance class begins Thursday, D6 wants to do gymnastics. I haven't worked enough tiger's games this year to pay for all of D12's gymnastics, Cheerleading still has charges. I'm drowning in debt and can't afford everything on my own. Maybe you should think of your kids instead of dance class. Or maybe you can tell them they can't do these things because what you want is more important.
Me: The dance is $12. I am paying more than my share of the bills. I will get a sitter.
Her: And I will let you tell the girls they can't do things. Can't wait for the divorce papers to say that you have to pay half of their stuff and have it backdated to the beginning of the year. That will be a nice check!
I would like to have a family meeting to explain all of this to the girls tonight.
Me: I have no desire to include the girls. If you want to sit down with a neutral 3rd party to go through our monthly bills, I am willing to do this.
Until we do this, I won't be paying any additional bills.
Her: We need to have a meeting tonight to discuss what they will and won't be doing this year.
Thats fine, but we need to talk to the girls.
Me: You and I can discuss without the girls.
Her: No, I want them present. You seem to include them on everything else.
Me: You have plenty of money to pay these bills. Please do not threaten my reputation with my kids in order to extort money from me.
Her: We will have the conversation tonight.
Me: Just to be clear, I will not participate in a discussion with the kids.
Her: We will do whether you talk or not. And when you don't talk, I will say its because you are embarrassed by your actions.
Me: I will not be present.
Her: You will because you have a soccer game tonight.
Me: That is not an appropriate setting to discuss. Please talk to someone about the wisdom of this before causing a scene at their soccer game.
Her: You leave me no choice.
Me: I have to get back to work. Please talk to someone. Again, if you want me to pay more bills, then we need to sit down with a 3rd party.
Her: I've already told you I would. You never arranged it and I will have the conversation tonight.
Me: You were not willing to provide an itemized list of the bills you are paying. When you provide the list, I will setup a meeting.
Her: Whatever.
When I came home, she called the kids downstairs for a "Family meeting". I re-iterated that the kids had no place in this discussion. She ignored me and continued to call them. I said that I would not participate and left early for the soccer game. MIL brought the kids to the game. W never showed up.
After the game, I ran D14 around on some errands and got home around 9:30. I went to my room. My W followed me to my room, and stood in the doorway. She called the kids again. I tried to leave, but she blocked the door and informed me that if I pushed past her, she would call the police and charge me with abuse.
Then she told the kids that they would not be doing any activities this year, because I wasn't willing to pay for them. I don't remember the exact words, but it was basically, "If your dad loved you, he would pay these bills". All I could say is that this isn't true, that I love them, and for them to get ready for bed.
I then shut the bedroom door and we argued for another 30 minutes. My home is a dysfunctional mess. I think it is time to move out.
So what am I supposed to do in this situation that would show "Compassion"?
Note1: This is an honest question, not sarcasm.
Note2: My W has plenty of money. She can afford these activities. She just doesn't want to. She wants to save her money. I pay all the household bills (rent, insurance, utilities, taxes, home equity loan) %100. she is living in the home bill free and works full time.
Note3: On Saturday, she paid $400? for UofM/Notre Dame tickets to take some guy out for the evening. This just adds more insult to the conversation.
I then shut the bedroom door and we argued for another 30 minutes. My home is a dysfunctional mess. I think it is time to move out.
OMG - You are absolutely right it is a dysfunctional mess and obviously your wife has little to no concern for the emotional well being of your kids. She sounds very narcissitic. I am sorry you (and more so your kids) are going through this. I do think that you have their best intentions at heart, but I personally think you and your wife have both involved them too much in this whole mess. I kind of cringe thinking about the pain and suffering they are experiencing. Hopefully you have them in regular counseling so that they have an impartial adult they can vent to.
I think the both of you continuing to live under the same roof and having these types of interactions in front of your kids is a very bad idea. Not sure what the solution is, but as Dr. Phil says "how is this working for you?" Something needs to change.
I just went through something the other day reminding me the toll divorce takes on kids. My D14wrote a paper about the devastation of the divorce, her dad remarrying( to his affair partner) and how she was actually suicidal. She and her sister thought up a story and that has been their saving light.
Do everything that you can to protect them, there is going to be enough fallout as it is. Keep being there for them. Work on making you better. Your W is a mess, she isn't going to care what damage she does. Thus the reason to focus on you. Hopefully someday she will pull herself out of the muck, but don't hold your breath.
Hang in there, kat
Me-53(and learning!) S24, S21, D18, D17 Just keep swimming, Just keep swimming. Dory
I would contact your attorney and ask that bad-mouthing you in front of the kids is not allowed (usually that is standard wording in a divorce)
I would then let her know (in a non-confrontational, matter of fact way) that if she continues to do this, you will file contempt charges
I am sorry your wife is a mess and I am sorry you both seem to be involving the kids. They should know little to nothing about the conflict in your relationship
Interms of MLC, the monster is hungry and wants you to feed her anger, she wants you to look bad in front of the kids in order for her to justify her actions in terms of the marriage break up, unfortunately for you she sucked you into her drama and made you play into her trap.
This comment sums it up Her: We will do whether you talk or not. And when you don't talk, I will say its because you are embarrassed by your actions.
What if you said “ok, I’ll pay for the kids activities” . I don’t know your financial situation but if you do that the drama is over or averted. I know in my situation this is exactly what I have had to do.
A positive for you is if she is playing games like this then you should know that you have been playing it straight and it is annoying her, the bad thing is that she’ll keep trying to stunts like this to destabilise you.
Rock situations like this is no win for us, all we can do is what’s best for us and what’s best for the kids.
Always think “avoid the drama” and that will help you deal with situations like this (compassion or no compassion).
Lanzo, I spent most of my marriage giving in to her and avoiding conflict. this was a 180 off me. i thought I could learn to assert myself without these issues escalating.
Every time I have tried, however, it ends up escalating into a mess. I don't know how to establish boundaries with her. I really thought I took a reasoned approach on this one.
The money isn't that important. It is such a small fraction of the bills that I am already paying. It is the disrespect. Once I give in to a bully who is willing to use my kids to manipulate me, where does it end?
Yes, I could just pay the bills and avoid the conflict. I am just not sure that is the right thing to do.
Fig - Very good question. I called my attorney today to get her advice, but she had a mediation and I wasn't able to get a hold of her. Right now I am sitting at work trying to decide if I should move out when I get home.
My W and I agreed on the terms of the divorce, but nothing is signed. I am worried about moving out without an agreed to custody arrangement. Maybe for everyone involved, it is what needs to happen.
the condition of "no bad moutihng" is in the custody agreement, for whatever it is worth. But, like I mentioned, it has not been signed yet.
Kat - D14 is in counseling. She seems to be the one most affected. She was seeing my counselor (mid 50's, male), but my S thought she might do better with a younger female counselor. I found one and she just saw her last week. I am going to setup a weekly counseling appointment.
In our argument, I mentioned that I am paying for the kids counseling without any financial help from my W. She said she wouldn't help because it was a waste of money. they don't need counseling.
//Something needs to change// I am sure I am going to repeat these words over and over again as I drive home. Maybe moving out is the right thing to do. Ijust don't know.
