Confused about detaching!!!

[Accuray]

I understand how you feel. Unfortunately from my seat in the bleachers it looks like he's manipulating you. I really don't believe the way he's treating you is okay, and his explanations ring hollow to me. Sometimes when you're too close to a situation, you believe what you want to believe.

why the second phone and why is it locked? He says it’s just to spite me because he’s tired of how nosey I am....When we talk about that kind of stuff he tells me I’m just being the “old” me and that nothing ever changes. Sometimes, we can calmly discuss this stuff, but most times, he just gets really defensive and angry.

That's a giant sack-load of BS. I think a DB coach or an IC can help you to interpret these comments (is it him or is it me) and help you to formulate constructive responses. There is no reason to have a second private and locked cell phone when you are married. That is NOT marriage-friendly behavior at all and is not acceptable. He's using his anger to bully you and hanging a threat of leaving over your head so he can do as he likes -- that's manipulation.

Here's the thing -- saving your marriage and DB is very much a waiting game. When your spouse is checked out, you don't really have any grounds to ask for anything. Your goal is really not to push them farther away. In many ways, when YOU are the one trying to save your marriage, you have to be totally selfless, focus on yourself, and have no expectations.

However, that can't go on indefinitely. At some point, balance needs to be restored to the relationship, and you need to start getting your own needs met as well. If you're coming up on the 1 year mark, it's probably a good time to meet with a DB coach or an IC and take stock of where you are and what your goals are.

Many people find it useful to create a timeline for yourself (but don't share it with H under any circumstance). i.e. "I will continue to DB and accept not having my needs met for another X months. At that point, if things have not improved, I will Y."

You have to make your own plan and figure out what YOU want, but do it from a place of confidence, not fear. Know that you are worthy and deserve to be treated as a loved spouse. It is your obligation to do any needed work on yourself, to understand how to meet his needs, listen to his complaints, and react to them professionally assuming they're not crazy. Once you've done that work, you either need to get to piecing where H will commit to meeting your needs, or you need to force a crisis where he either decides to commit or leave.

but how do I set boundaries without just completely ticking him off? Does it matter if he gets ticked off?

In situations like this you usually have to make things worse before they will get better.

I spent a weekend with some friends recently and observed how boundaries apply to parenting. My friend's kids did a lot of whining, and would whine until they got what they wanted. The whining would really annoy their parents, and they would threaten consequences, but never follow through and ultimately would give in to negotiation with the kids so that they at least partially got what they were whining about.

Looking at that situation from the outside, the kids were distressed when they were whining -- I'm sure they didn't want to feel that way. The parents were distressed when the kids were whining, I'm sure they didn't want to feel that way either. To stop the whining would mean making things worse -- enforcing consequences and probably enduring a tantrum or two.

My W and I do not respond to whining at all -- as soon as one of our kids whine, it's game over, no more discussion about whatever it was and there's no way they will get anything through whining. Consequently our kids don't whine, they've learned it's useless to do so. Therefore, if they're disappointed, they might complain, but if they get a negative response they let it go. I believe this makes both their lives and our lives much less stressful. They understand the boundary, they understand the consequence, and that trying to swim against the current is useless.

You can get your H into this mode -- you have trained him that threatening you and getting angry results in him getting his way and you backing off. This puts both of you into an uncomfortable situation where when you aren't happy, you'll push him, he'll get angry or threaten, and you will back off and give in.

What if he learned that anger and threats had no effect on you, that if he went there, the discussion was over (for now), but that you were not going to back down?

I predict you'd have fewer angry confrontations, and more productive discussions.

People truly like rules and order, but they hate change. Therefore, when you set and enforce boundaries, things almost always get worse before they get better, because of the friction the change itself causes.

That will often lead you to conclude your change was bad and revert, when if you had just given it more time and allowed it to become the new norm, you'd be in a better place.

Acc