Newcomer's brief summary

[doubledown]

TT:

thanks for that feedback. OK, I realize I need to accept the fact that I'm working independently of OM and W and any attempt to interfere there will only provide opportunity for W to associate me with unhappiness. Tough to do, but considering the alternative, I can do it.

On Labor Day, my W mentioned she wanted to have some shelving put up in the bathroom and paint as well. So, I showered, got dresssed(looked/smelled good) walked into the room where she was. She looked at me surprised at my atire and before she could say anything, I said:"you wanna go with me to loook at shelving"? She said: "oh, ok, yeh!" So, we and the kids went out for the day shopping. Then we went to lunch. After we finished, I said:" wasn't that a fun lunch?" W responded "yes it was".

We returned home and W went out ot work in the yard/gardens and I began working on a raised bed for some Grape vines we want to plant. Occassionally, I would walk over to visit W and compliment her on the plants or design. I asked her for her help a couple times as well. It was a really pleasant day altogther.

One thing I found interesting was when I walked into the back yard and saw W looking up into a large tree we have in the yard. I asked her what she was doing, and she said she was just thinking about what might need to be done with the tree if we were to consider having a swimming pool installed in the Spring. I was surprised, because we had talked about a pool, but from what I had read in texts /emails between W and OM in the recent past, their plan was to move in together and begin their life together.

Now, I'm told to believe nothing she says and only 50% of what she does. So, what do I make of this? Is she reconsidering her plans with OM? Maybe just planning to stay at home and keep him on the side indefinitely? Or is it just something to disregard?

I've really just been focusing on being positive toward W and kids, being pleasant, non-critical, no anger and very helpful. I need to keep coming up with things to do that demonstrate that I'm a fun guy to be with!

[doubledown]

LTH:

Thanks for responding. In reading your response, I can see how you would want to keep one foot in each relationship. I can see how that can be comforting.

At this point, since my W has no idea that I'm aware or her A, I'm really focusing on being a loving father and kind husband. Lord knows, that was simply not the case for most of our marriage.

Now that my W has acknowledged that she has noticed my behavior as some "Father of the year and husband of the year" and she doesn't know how to take it or what to make of that person, I'm trying to keep doing what I've been doing. The hard part will be knowing that she is still seeing the OM and trying to keep that picture out of my head!

I suppose I'll have to convince my W that the changes she's seeing are not going to evaporate. I'm sure she's just waiting for me to drop the ball. I just can't let that happen. As long as I give her hope that it is possible for me to change, and convince her that I'm not going to relapse into the angry, critical, impatient and controlling husband that she has suffered with for years, I have a chance at saving our marriage.

I sure the kids are playing a role in her staying for the time being. I sure hope there is a tiny, tiny sliver of hope that our M can be improved. I'll keep working toward that and hopefully, that feeling is awakened.

[lovethehub]

I agree with Jersey, you are in a really tough situation yet you are keeping your eye on your long term goal and handling this better than most would. Has your coach said how long you should keep your knowledge of the A quiet?

[doubledown]

Hi Jersey:

Thanks for the compliments! It's nice to hear.

Sorry to hear about what you're going through with your H.

Unfortunately, I think most of America has gotten passed the result of hurrican Sandy and we forget that many, like yourselves, are still suffering its effects. I hope things improve for you in that regard as well.

I checked out your back story and saw that you mentioned that some have said you were crazy to want to stay with your H and rebuild your marriage. Remember, it's your choice and your M, not their's. They won't have to put anything into this. It's very easy from an outsider's perspective to make comments like that. They have no skin in the game. Even if they've been through a similar situation, they made their choices, but this is for you to decide.

I know for me, it was an easy choice to commit to saving and rebuilding my M. My W is the love of my life and I accept responsibility for the many mistakes I've made that have contributed to me being in this situation.

Regardless of what she has decided to do in some attempt to fiill the hole inside her or ease her emptiness, I can only work on me and make changes to improve myself. Hopefully, the end result will include my W reconsidering what she has done and perhaps decide that she likes what she sees in me and we can begin to rebuild.

That's what keeps me going.

[doubledown]

Thanks LTH:

I had a therapy appointment last night and the Dr. said the same thing. During my initial visit, he pushed for me to confront my W. But now that he sees my committment to the DB/DR process and how I'm handling it, he mentioned 3 or 4 time show impressed he was with my ability to maintain my composure and work to improve myself and the M.

It feels good to hear these kind of compliments, but it's still very tough. The emotions truly ebb and flow, just like the tide.

To answer your question, I had another DB coaching call on 8/28/13. We agreed that I should just maintain what I'm doing at this point. I got a little feedback from W that she has noticed some change in me, so I want to continue with 180's, DBing and add some GAL.

I think that until my W either ends the relationship with OM or it somehow fizzles, there would be much more of a negative impact if I were to confront her about the A than if I just continue my work while it goes on. Do you agree?

What are your thoughts?

You mentioned that in your situation, you knew you weren't leaving, but rather keeping a foot in both relationships as kind of a comfort to yourself. In my sitch, all I have to base things on are the text/email messages I have seen between my W and OM. I've stopped my snooping so I don't really know what the very current status is with regard to their topics of conversation on a daily basis or if I'm mentioned at all.

But, last I saw, they were talking about how much they love each other and how wonderful it will be one day to wake up next to each other.

Now that my W has started her new job, I'm hoping the work load picks up and demands her concentration and focus. That and the kids starting back to school this week will really give her something else to foucs on, rather than just the OM.

We got into bed last night and I told my W how much I apprecaiated her efforts over the past week, and especially that day, for all the work she put into school shopping for the kids and running around with them from 8:30a.m. to 4:30 that afternoon. I said:"you're a good mom!"

She thanked me and continued telling me that while she was sitting on a bench at the school watching the kids play on the playground, she wondered to herself if she was a good mom. I repaeated myself and said: "you're a good mom".

Truthfully, with all the poor choices she's made over the past several months with regard to her A and neglecting the kids to focus on her A and working 7/days a week and getting home late every night, choosing time with OM over time with our kids, is not the work of a "good mom".

However, I know she struggles with whether she is a good mom, so I put one in her love tank.

Is that wrong? It can only help, right?

[too trusting]

LTH's advice from 8/27 had some very good pointers

e.g. "This is one reason you are wise to keep your mouth shut about the affair. If you started changing these things AFTER you told her knew, she would suspect you were only doing it because of her A and it would take a lot longer for her to believe they were true changes."

and also LTH's post on 9/3 where she gives her perspective "from the other side" is very informative and useful.

now I am not saying to wait forever, or 4 years, or anything like that. but right now is not the time to confront W. *first* you need to make yourself the more attractive choice - so that when *eventually* you say "me or him" she will choose you and not say "ok, bye!"

you wrote: "Some things I read say it can last a few months, 6 months or up to 4 years! That last one is tough to swallow." and I wouldn't let it go for 4 years (that's just when someone is having a MLC and are totally out of it). I understand that 6 months is average; I would say to allow up to a year and then take stock of the situation and decide what to do next.

why a year and not 6 months? first, to leave a margin of safety time-wise. and also so that you will have sufficient time to undo bad habits from the past, so that she will fully be able to see you as the better choice.

but that's just a guideline. it could be that between now and then something might happen to cast the dice one way or the other. e.g. with her new job plus the improvements you are making, she might leave OM sooner, especially now that they aren't working together. or, she might sink deeper into her fantasy world and start leaving obvious clues that are impossible to ignore. you need to play it by ear, but don't jump in with a confrontation too soon because that would ruin what you are trying to do.

also, when you do eventually confront her (if it is necessary), then you don't let her know that you've known about it all this time. that would make you look like a wimp. when the time comes, if you do need to confront her, then you only use recent evidence and not "ancient history".

you wrote: "There is a shed I could finish, painting that needs done. I'd also like to kayak the river in our area. W and I used to enjoy that. Haven't done it since the kids came along. Do these sound like a good start?"

yes, good ideas. how long does the kayaking take - a few hrs or a few days? i.e. can you get a babysitter to stay with your sons so that you and W can do this together? or, could you substitute another type of boating that would be safe to bring your sons along?

your description of Labor Day sounds very encouraging! as well as the fact that she is including you in future plans.

as LTH also said, keep doing what you're doing so that your wife will see that your changes are permanent. you know what, she'll like you a lot more, and you'll like yourself a lot more! a win-win!

We got into bed last night and I told my W how much I apprecaiated her efforts over the past week, and especially that day, for all the work she put into school shopping for the kids and running around with them from 8:30a.m. to 4:30 that afternoon. I said:"you're a good mom!"

She thanked me and continued telling me that while she was sitting on a bench at the school watching the kids play on the playground, she wondered to herself if she was a good mom. I repaeated myself and said: "you're a good mom".

Truthfully, with all the poor choices she's made over the past several months with regard to her A and neglecting the kids to focus on her A and working 7/days a week and getting home late every night, choosing time with OM over time with our kids, is not the work of a "good mom".

However, I know she struggles with whether she is a good mom, so I put one in her love tank.

Is that wrong? It can only help, right?

yes, I think you did good with this! I think that giving her that encouragement, will make her want to continue to do more to be a good mom!

[doubledown]

Thanks for your valuable thoughts, TT. I really appreciate you keeping in touch with me and my sitch.

I feel good about what you said regarding how the time frame can work and reinforcing that I should maintain my efforts and focus more long term, 6 mos to a year. That makes sense. My W is experiencing alot of change right now with leaving her old job and beginning her new one. Even though I know she is still sneaking time to see the OM, at least their time together has been reduced significantly.

I'm greatful to LTH for her willingness to share her perspective with me from the side of the WAS. That is invaluable! She has been very encouraging as well, and I will follow her advice.

This weekend was pretty good. We had our nephew spend the night with our boys here and they all had a blast. W and I watched a movie after we put them to bed. On Sunday, we both worked outside on separate projects but interacted.

I'm realizing recently that the DB techniques are one thing, but I'm feeling very lonely. I pine for my wife's attention and time. I realize that she is not interested in me right now and it's hard to deal with. I can just imagine how the next 6 mos or a year will be with no real intimacy or quality time with W will be.

I think I've got the 180's down and I'm maintaining a pretty good positive attitude, but I think I made my first backslide this weekend. Dang it!

I got home Friday evening around 5:45. My W is supposed to pick up the kids from after care at school at around 5:30. Well, it was just after 6:00 and they were not home, so I called her. The phone rang and rang with no answer. I kept trying, but no answer. She finally answered and told me she had stopped at a store on the way home and left her phone in the car. When she got home she mentioned that I seemed a little overzealous about her whereabouts and shouldn't be so concerned about where she is every 15 minutes.

Well, these days I am very curious where she is. I guess I need to work on that. Anyway, we continued to talk about it and she began to get bothered by my "prying".

So, I asked her if she would do me a favor. She said yes? I said: "can you help me understand what it is that bothered you so much about this evening"? She told me that it was my need to always know where she is and what she's doing. If she stops for 15 minutes, I need to know! Etc. I thanked her for helping me understand her concerns and stated that I will no longer do that.

I realize that only the guilty have a problem with being questioned. Apparently, she's fogged out of her mind on that one!

So, my next 180 is to not ask any questions regarding her whereabouts. What do you think?

[lovethehub]

DD,

You are doing a great job, keep it up!

[doubledown]

Thanks LTH:

I'm trying my best. One thing that is really tough to get past is how obvious it is that my wife just doesn't like me much right now and I can tell she just doesn't want to be around me.

I've got to find a way to keep my distance from her, so I don't annoy her and push her away.

I'm not snooping anymore and I think that helps me feel a little better because, like "Whizzed" said, it can really twist the knife right into your heart when you find info or read texts/emails and create your own version of what will transpire based on the brief exchanges.

I just really want to know what is going through W mind right now.

I have a golf tournament this weekend, so W will be with the boys and I will try to get my mind on other things. Plus, that will keep her time occupied.