NEW LIFE / NEW ME

[sandi2]

Originally Posted By: LTH
It does seem that your W is going to need to miss you and understand that things are different now if anything is going to change.

I agree to this and in here is also one of my big problems!
I understand she got fed up with me! Coach told me that she properly moved out in anger and I understand this as well. She got enough and I pushed her away. This was prior to BD.
Few weeks after BD I changed totally and started working 180s, PMA and all of that and I have done this for five months. I can without any doubt say that if we didn’t have a history she would be attracted towards me today.

F, has it crossed your constant wheel-turning brain, that you did a lot of the pushing away after the BD? Do you know why she got fed up? I'm not talking about anything before BD, but afterwards, you pushed and kept pushing. We tried to tell you to back off and that you were pursuing, but you would say you were "trying". You're a nice guy and I don't want this to sound harshly, but honestly, you are still pursuing to a point. You need to forget that 3 - 1 rule of yours. Do not initiate any contact that is not an emergency.

LTH is 100% correct. Your W needs to miss you. Miss you really badly! The two of you will always be connected, so it would be rather difficult to go completely dark on her. But I'm not talking dark, I'm talking about not initiating any contact with her.

You say you can't detach b/c you still love her (or words similar to those). You don't have to stop loving in order to detach. You've been given information and you are a smart enough person to read about it. Let me put it this way. (I'm saying this softly, even if you can't hear my voice.) If you want to detach bad enough.....you'll do it. And you will love still love her.

This happens to men all the time. They make the same mistakes you made pre-BD. Then you panic at the realization you're losing her. The reason you can't detach is b/c you are still scared to death of living with that loss.

You kept thinking your stitch was different b/c your W wasn't being the b!tch that you read about in other threads. She didn't have to be, as LTH pointed out, you have made things easy. Not that you wanted the break-up, but you made it easy by not fighting and standing in her way. Which, of course, you really couldn't do much else.

You really have no doubts that she would be attracted to you today.....if not for the history? My, but that almost sounds like a confident man! So why the fear? Yes, history can be held against the LBH, but it can also be a plus for the LBH. She's the mother of your kids, after all. I remember how you didn't understand why she was leaving b/c you had such a great R. That has to count for something. Besides, you've heard about women changing their minds!

But if she is stuck prior to BD this will be almost impossible to R.

Hogwash! Stop giving her excuses. Your are your own worst enemy. If you do what we have preached to you all this time, (need I repeat it again), she can become unstuck whenever she decides she's ready to give the R another chance.

On July 23. I gave things a last shot and got this from her:

By "a last shot" you mean you initiated a R talk, and/or pursued her. See, still pushing.

We have been talking about this over and over
I have been withholding myself so much for the last months.
This has been coming for so long and you didn’t see.
It is not fair that you tell me you feel cheated because you didn’t get the chance.
Funny enough you are not angry in the mornings anymore
IDLY

What does the IDLY stand for? I do love you or I don't love you? I'll take a guess. Look, she was trying to be nice as long as she was living in the same house with you. She probably didn't want any fighting and wanted to get out being "friends". But you kept pushing.

You have been pursuing me for sex – I don’t believe how you have gotten through these months

July 23rd? Was that the last shot you were talking about?

I have given you everything you wanted
This already started when before D4 was born.
You have gotten it your way since BD

What does she mean by given you everything you wanted? I understand what she means in the second sentence (which is another reason you shouldn't have pursued sex). What exactly does she mean in the third sentence? If she's referring to you standing up and not letting her use you......then, good.

She is in the fog and this is not something she will miss.

Are you referring to sex?

So how do I make her miss me?

Don't make me come through this screen.

Can I do anything but focus on me, GAL and detach because that’s what I am doing.

You stop playing "family" with her, that's how.

Should I address her anger at some point?

No, not unless she unleashes it on you in a disrespectful manner. Otherwise, you have to let her deal with it and get through it in the way she decides. Don't try to decide for her.

For now I feel I shouldn’t address anything at all and just let her be!

Absolutely!! You must leave her alone and stop trying to "be there for her". I know that goes against your feelings, but that is what works. For her to experience what it's like to not have you in her life.

I don’t believe she is cakeeating at the moment.

Whenever she can call on you to help her with........anything, it is cake-eating. Calling to chat, or asking you to come help screw in a light bulb, or keep the kids while she does something else.....whatever her requests are for your help. But the number one way of cake-eating for the WAS is having "family" time together. She left that option, remember? Once a week, are you kidding? And don't let her (and neither should you) use the excuse that it would be good for the kids. Both sides are often guilty of using that one, but reality needs to set in as quick as possible. Those family times would immediately stop the minute another person entered the picture anyway. So why let the children think it would always be that way? I hope I answered your question about if you need to do it.

I will do all the good I can for the children but doing good for one should not hurt another (to much).
I don’t know if this makes sense and would really like your comments. (It feels like W doesn’t realize that D will have impacts on the children!)

Yes, very good, I like it. And you're right, your W doesn't, or won't, recognize the fact D harms children. That fantasy fog helps her believe they will be fine as long as they have both of you.

How and when should I pull back?

Be unavailable by phone. Let it go to VM or TM. That keeps her from getting too chatty. If it has something important about the kids, and if she is asking a direct question....then give a two or three word sentence. But for the most part, you can text back with a "K". But don't respond immediately, or if she doesn't ask a question. I've known some couples who never spoke or saw each other after the D and they had children. This is not what you want. But you are the Chatty-Cathy doll! I know! You need to create some kind of a shift to adjust to a new connection with each other. You want to have a friend--ly R with her, but sometimes there has to be a break in order to build a bridge, KWIM? You have to stop filling that role of H for her and allow her to make it on her own. Stand back and allow her to fail......or succeed at being a single mom. She chose it, now let (or make) her live it.

Don't go inside her house when you pick-up or deliver the kids. Don't agree to go with her to anything. No family events. Just don't be available for her in any way for now. I know it sounds terribly cold to hear it, but if she keeps having you at her convenience, she will not be able to progress to the place she needs to be in order to come out of the fog.

I do not feel I am being a doormat. I am still working on my values and boundaries and I do try to stick firmly with these.

That's good.

Sandi, you told me many times in the beginning that there was no magic-word that would fix this. I looked but I am not doing that anymore. I am working me. Off course I look towards W but I mind my own business and me and I do not try to adjust the me towards her – anymore! So what is left is the hope and the patience.

Yes, hope and patience. Hope....while you go on living. Patience.....b/c it may take her two years before she comes out of this. And I'm not trying to kill your hope by telling you this, but I want you to realize what could be ahead.

How do I earn respect?
How do I go from respect towards feel in love?
How do I show the manliness you talk about?
How do I attract her from here?
Do you believe coach is right about the anger that W feels?

Oh wow! Well, you have a good idea on the respect part. A woman wants a man who is inwardly strong and works hard to provide for his family. She wants a man with integrity, loyalty, honor, and a good leader. She wants a man who will stand up to her, and remind her, in a Rhett Butler way, she's dealing with a "man" and not a jackass. A man who takes nothing off her, but would defend her to his death....and she has no doubt of his love for her. She wants a man who is passionate, and can stir the passion in her. But, I think I may be getting off the subject a bit....

It is kind of hard to tell a man how to display manliness that women are attracted to. My H can cook and keep house when he has too, however, he looks manly while he's doing it. It's more about not be a wimp and acting clingy and needy. I think ambition is attractive, as long as it's not sand castles and he's dealing with reality. I think laziness and some other unlikable qualities is far from attractive, but goodness, look at the books that's been written on the subject of attraction and what women like.

Have to stop for now.