"I Love you but love her too"....WHAT?

[RosaLinda]

Wow that is a difficult call NLT. I think this is the best site, but can see why you would not like OW's H reading your sitch. That might prove pretty uncomfortable. Cadet mentioned a site once, the Hero's Wife or Hero's Spouse. Something like that. I've read lots of relationship books, but most were for women. Marriage Fitness was pretty helpful, but I like Divorce Remedy best because it gives specific concrete instructions. 

I'm sorry your H didn't remember your birthday. Par for the course huh? My H missed my 60th. Made me feel SO crappy because he sent his EA#1, whom he hasn't spoken to in almost 2 years, flowers for her birthday a few days later. I hate hate hate MLC, NLT. And OW. 

You seem pretty calm with OW being here, except for your concerns about your daughter. How do you manage to get so detached? I need all the tips I can get because I know I'll become more and more basket-case-like as my H's second conjugal visit with RT draws closer. 

[job]

I know you want to be helpful, but I think it would be best to suggest that he google affairs and let him select a site that would be helpful to him. There are a number of excellent sites out there and he will locate them w/o any problem. Do not share what this site w/him or the books that are directly related to this site. You want to keep your postings as private as can be and do not want your info to be used against you at a later time.

[Notlikingthis]

Linda, I definitely don't want him to find me here. He'd recognize the story for certain. The other problem is that he doesn't know half of what is going on between them. Yes, he knows about their "affair" and has even told my h to butt out and leave his w alone but he doesn't know about my h's mlc or for that matter the possibility of his w's mlc. He needs that to be pointed to him but I'll let him figure it out on his own.

I am only calm because I look at her as just another symptom. Of course it's a living, breathing, conniving, gold digging symptom but I try to forget that part. There are times when it gets to me so I come here and laugh at the antics of others' h's and w's and know that he is just another h doing and saying the same things as hundreds and hundreds of other mlcers.

As for my birthday, it's just fine. I'd rather remember his kind and loving words from past birthday's than get a generic card or gift that wasn't given with love but rather as an obligation. I'm sorry that your h treated you so crappy. That was pretty telling of his state of mind, wasn't it? They can't help themselves sometimes. In a way I resent that we have to tolerate such behaviors but....the reason that most of us are here is to help ourselves feel better about ourselves and to understand what might be going on during the process. It beats serving jail time for smacking them with a 2X4. I hate mlc but I like the ow even less for not having the decency or respect for herself to tell him to get lost right from the start. Her h told me that this is the first married man that she's had an affair with. Most of the others have been much younger than her and didn't have the means to support her extravagant lifestyle so she dumped them. I wonder sometimes whether he would have taken up with an ow if we hadn't met her and her h at the precise time that we did. He had just lost his job and was already in his MLC. She has a, live for today, tomorrow may never come, philosophy and that attitude mirrored my h's mlc attitude so he was attracted to her for that reason, imo. She also has a spend it all, attitude that my h has never had. That could get scary if she does actually stay here in the long term.

Snodderly,

I knew that would be the answer somehow! LOL! Giving him too much information isn't a good thing. You're right, let him research and find the books and help on his own. I just pray that he doesn't run into this site while he's surfing the web on Affairs. Yesterday's text and phone count: 2 calls, 4 texts! Answered 1 call and replied to 1 text. The call that I answered, he said that he wasn't calling for any particular reason and that he didn't want me to think that he only calls when he needs or wants something from me. One of the texts WAS because he wanted something. LOL

I planned on being gone from the house when he came by to get his truck in the afternoon but he arrived 2 hours earlier than he usually does. I was busy outside washing windows and he actually scared me when he walked up. He asked me if he had any mail and he followed me into the house when I went to get it. I asked him if he wanted something cold to drink and he asked if I had some wine. Told him that I didn't have a chilled bottle so he pointed to the wine cooler and asked me to "get one out of there". I knew something was up. A few weeks ago when he came by he took several bottles of the more expensive wines from the wine cellar. After he left, I went to the cellar and brought up as many of the expensive bottles as I could and locked them into the cooler. At some point between that day and yesterday he must have tried to get into the cooler. We have never locked that cooler so I think it was his way of telling me that he knew that I had locked him out. He even asked me why it was locked. Thank God he doesn't have a key to the house otherwise I'd be dealing with a petty thief like you did!

We had a glass of wine and he talked about work, the new house and how he's replaced a few of the boards on the deck etc. Never mentioned the ow. He did ask how I was doing being alone in the house. I told him I was doing well and that I am just a little more aware of the sounds at night (which is very true)but that it was probably just the deer or raccoons coming close to the house. He told me that if I was ever afraid to call and he'd come right over. He also said that he "wasn't putting me second" and repeated that "if I needed ANYTHING or just wanted to come over and hang out that I was welcome anytime." What is he thinking? He's NOT! I have to assume that the ow is still there. The look on my face must have been one of confusion. Hope he didn't notice. He stayed for over an hour. When he got up to leave he kissed me and gave me a hug and off he went!

After he left, I poured myself another half glass of wine went out to my little garden where the birds hang out. I wasn't sure if I should laugh or cry. I did a little of both. I replayed the conversation to see if he gave me any clues as to where he might be mentally. Around 3 months ago he seemed irritated and impatient with me at times and since moving that has disappeared. While he's never directed his anger at me, he has seemed angry about things in general. He's still a little restless but not as much as when he was still living here. It's been nearly a month since he moved and I do see a change of sorts. When I talked to him earlier in the day yesterday he seemed to lack energy and there was definitely no enthusiasm in his voice, which is NOT how he was before mlc. LOL He said that he sent a proposal to the Non-Profit that he'd interviewed with and hoped that he hear back from them soon. The job he has now seems to be going okay but I can tell that he's not happy there. I can tell he's doing a lot of thinking. Just wish that gold digging ow wasn't around to distract him. He's a brilliant man. He'll figure this out. Sooner than later works best for me!!!!!

He'll be here soon, gotta get outta here NOW.

[kml]

He's sure wondering what you're doing there while he's gone. And probably regretting OW already (bringing her obnoxious friend with her??? Really??? That's not the fantasy he had, for sure).

Take most of the rest of those nice bottles of wine and hide them somewhere else. Leave two used wine glasses with dregs of red wine in the bottom out on your deck, so that next time he pops by, he'll wonder who ELSE has been enjoying your company. (If he asks, just answer "Oh, a friend of mine stopped by - you don't know them").

Also - buy flowers for yourself and put them in a vase - let him wonder who those red roses came from.

Set the stage for mystery. Let him be thinking more about what's going on in YOUR house, than about what's happening in HIS.

[RosaLinda]

Ellie! That would be funny

Wow NLT, how did your H respond when OW's H told him to keep away from his wife??? Women can be catty and nasty, but men punch each other out over stuff like that! I love your description of her as "a living, breathing, conniving, gold digging symptom" of his MLC! Too funny. It does help, doesn't it, to be able to come here and realize that our spouses are doing and saying the exact same thing as hundreds of other men and women? Some of their shenanigans crack me up, and help me to see that my own H is not really abnormal. Well, not when compared to other MLCers, anyway. He's pretty nutz compared to normal people!

But on the other hand, how strange that all of these MLCers do not know each other at all, live in different parts of the world, are different ages and have completely different life situations, yet use the exact same words and do the exact same actions. It's quite a phenomenon!

Proof of temporary insanity: "He told me that if I was ever afraid to call and he'd come right over. He also said that he "wasn't putting me second" and repeated that "if I needed ANYTHING or just wanted to come over and hang out that I was welcome anytime." What is he thinking? He's NOT! I have to assume that the ow is still there. The look on my face must have been one of confusion. Hope he didn't notice. He stayed for over an hour. When he got up to leave he kissed me and gave me a hug and off he went!"

He's not putting you second? How does that work -- he moved out. You're welcome to come and hang out anytime? The OW would love that! I'm glad he gave you a kiss and hug. Really the whole thing is so confusing, but I can see that he wants to stay connected to you. I know he'll figure it out, NLT. Keeping DBing!

[Notlikingthis]

kml, The funniest part my h's description of the ow's gf is that the ow is just as obnoxious! She never stops talking, can't sit still, never answers a question even if it's a yes/no question and it's always all about her! It's all smoke and mirrors with her. Moving target is a good way to describe her. Wonder how that's all going to work out in the long term? LOL

I met a friend of ours for lunch this afternoon. He's been trying to get a hold of h for months and h isn't returning calls to him so he called me to see if everything was okay. I didn't really say much but told him that h was having a rough time. He asked me to meet him for lunch. My cell phone rang. I was in still in "hands free" mode and there was no caller ID. Thinking it might be our friend calling to tell me that he was running late, I answered. Of course it was h just calling to say hi. Asked me what I was up to and after a bit he asked if I could go check something out in a file here at the house. Told him that I wouldn't be home till later in the afternoon but that I'd do it when I returned. He asked where I was. I told him that I was just getting ready to go into a restaurant then changed the subject back to the info that he was seeking. On my way home I stopped and picked up not 1 but 2 dozen roses. Unfortunately, he had already come by and picked up his truck. Maybe tomorrow he'll see them and put the restaurant and the roses together! The empty wine glasses on the deck will be next. Thanks for the suggestions! I can tell you that he won't like seeing the roses OR 2 mostly empty wine glasses.

Our friend was in shock that h was acting as he is. I didn't get into too many details but enough to let him know that h wasn't in a good place right now. We've know he and his wife for almost as many years as we've been married. He told that h needs a smack with a 2X4. This guy is not someone you'd want to mess around with. He's a former (NY/NJ) undercover narcotics cop and has seen and heard it all. H has always said that he'd never want to piss him off to ever be on his bad side. Oops, sorry h, I didn't mean to tell him.

Btw, I went down to the wine cellar and took 5 more bottles out of there and hid them. I noticed the Champagne section is short 2 bottles of the expensive stuff. He must have taken them while he was still living here. There are too many bottles to hide, I'll just have to keep a closer watch on him when he visits or maybe just cut off the visits entirely.

[Notlikingthis]

Linda, my h saw ow's h's threat as a challenge and just turned up his pursuit of ow. The standard, "no one's going to tell me what to do". Teenage behavior for sure. It seemed to me that it almost became a game, a very sick game to him. He was and still is a very competitive person and needs to "win". It's more out of control now and that competitive nature has spilled over into his personal life. So now that he's "won" he will more than likely get bored with her. He's a Gemini and they change their mind more often than they change their socks! Thank God my birthday missed the Gemini sign by a few days. Anyway, I did worry that the ow's h was going to come here and find him and do some real harm to him. The times that he went to visit her I had visions of a knock down drag out fight happening and someone getting hurt.

The fact that the MLCers around the country and around the world all have the same script makes this a lot easier to deal with. You're right, coming here has been a Godsend for a lot of us. I really meant it when I suggested that we start a separate thread on the things they say. I crack up every time I read TVS's thread. She, uRw, nero, you, T2 and all of the others that post over there have helped brighten my rough days.

Yeah, just another WTF MLC statement by a man confused and in a fog. He moves, ow comes to visit/live here and I'm not second? Maybe I should take him up on the offer to hang out. He seems to want a needy, clingy, obnoxious ow to take care of. Maybe I could learn a few tricks from her if I hang out with them. Actually, wouldn't it be fun to be a fly on the wall when our h's and ow have a conversation? I've always wondered if they are totally different or if they let some of the mlc show through with the op. They don't seem to be in control of their behavior with us so why would it be different with the op?

Keep detaching Linda, it's the way to keep your sanity. Laugh (to yourself) when your h says or does the unthinkable. Snap the rubber band that you should be wearing on your wrist to remind yourself that you have no control over and can't change his behavior! LOL As the seasoned sages here say, "Believe none of what they say and half of what they do."

Guess I should try to go back to bed and get some sleep now. Having a little trouble tonight for some reason.

[beatrice]

You know I think there was a thread on things they say a long time back - really funny, and worth doing another - in part because it is funny, and in part because as you say - central scripting does a great job.

[RosaLinda]

I do have a rubber band on my wrist to snap for detachment NLT, actually an elastic hair band. I call it my "Snodderly band"

I think they need the clingy obnoxious OWs. It seems to be part of the process to "affair down" as it's been described. Look at TVS's H's OW. A friend of theirs, whom he used to make fun of as fat and obnoxious. My H has described his OW as a bitch, nothing special, pushy, a user. And they have had lots of fights. Besides being crazy from his MLC, my H is pretty unreasonable and nasty when he does not feel well from his lyme disease headaches, and does not like to be pushed. Although he tolerates it better from her than anyone else I must say. When do you expect your H to come by again and see the roses? If nothing else, you have some lovely flowers to cheer you up!

I'd love to read a thread like that Bea, of all the funny things. Although it means a lot more when it's your friend's MLCer saying something off the wall!

[Notlikingthis]

Bea, I'm not good at thread titles so what do you think we should call this new thread.....maybe, MLCer-isms? MLC gibberish? Someone will come up with the right title.

Now for the highlight of my day. I get a text from a number that I didn't recognize. It said: "I'm on the road dear. Remind me r u doing my floor time tomorrow@1130"

I look up the area code and realize this must be from my h's ow!! My first thought was how did she get my cell phone number. My second thought is who is she sending this message to and why is she lying? I think about it for a few minutes and the only thing I can come with is something that my h told me about the ow. She is in a sales position and that she must be trying to run her business from here but isn't telling her employer....nearly 1,000 miles away. I thought about it for a few minutes and even typed a response back but couldn't hit the send so I missed my opportunity to tell her what I think about her lack of respect for me as well as herself. Oh well, I'll let my h take care of that. He wasn't in a very good mood today when he left his "just sayin' hi" message and didn't even come to the door to chat when he came to get his truck after work. Maybe reality is starting to set in. She's been here for a week now, that might be is limit. I think he knows that he needs peace and quiet and wasn't expecting chatty and needy.


Linda,

I wonder why that is that they gravitate toward obnoxious and clingy women too. Do you thing that subconsciously they feel that they don't deserve women such as us!? LOL! I can't remember which poster it was but one of the ladies' h felt that because his ow was a forgotten soul, that it was HIS, responsibility to take care of her.

Anyway, RT will certainly show her true colors if your h does indeed make that trip to Russia and he will show his. Go on your trip to the UK and don't waste one minute of that trip thinking about either of them.

You HAVE to see the Crown Jewels at the Tower of London. I had a blast in England but it's been quite a few years since I've been there now so I can't really recommend specific places to stay or eat. I loved the history there. The museums, Harrod's, the pubs, oh yes, the pubs. Great food in the pubs.

Don't lose that "Snodderly Band" and have a great weekend!