One month down, zero casualties

[RosaLinda]

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"If we took OW out of the equation, I think there would just be another OW or also with my H, single guy friends who are immature for them to text. I think there is a need for constant contact from somewhere, something that makes them feel needed and important."

sort of sad that the love, admiration and devotion of the person who loves him most in the world isn't enough to make him feel needed and important. My H has had 8 or 10 female Russian pen pals over the past 3 1/2 years, all of whom adored the very ground he walked on. Not actual EAs I don't think, but flirtations, infatuations, exciting constantly new relationships supplying LOTS of admiration and attention. These relationships were not as prolonged or involved as your H's relationships with his 5 OW, and no physical contact, as they were all 3,000 miles away. 

"It's hard because he is reaching out, but his is not dropping any of the other ropes. I don't like the feeling that I'm just one of several ropes he is holding."

Do you think the same old wife will ever be enough for them once they're properly baked? Or will they wear permanent grooves and blisters into their hands from refusing to drop that rope? 

Gotta just keep trusting the process!

[Takevowsserious]

Hi Raine!

First off, I just want to tell you that your posts make me laugh! "Eager beavers"? Burial suit for the phone (which I would also like btw) I so get your sense of humor

I think home is more symbolic and meaningful for our guys than we could ever imagine. During the bomb speech, my H yelled at one point, "How do you think it feels that I can't even stand being in my own home?"

They feel trapped, want to run, need space. Some leave, some don't. Some return, some don't. But for all the newbies out there, it is IMPERATIVE that you give space, no matter what.

I think home is also a reminder to them of their old life. A life that they have rewritten many things about, a life which they often try to forget.

I think it's good that your H came home.

It's hard when we are one of the ropes, but I think of it as a transition. They aren't going to let go of all of the other ropes and just have us till they are ready. They need to fully realize they don't need those other ropes ( and that these ropes actually make their life worse, not better).

You are doing great Raine! Keep those toes sparkling like your personality

[TSquared2]

"It all just feels like a test."

It probably is then...the WAS/MLC "testing" the LBS is well documented here, it really opened my eyes once I could "see" it with W. It can change how you look at some of the odd, mean or inconsistent behaviors, for the better, imo. Having raised 1 teenager pretty much through to being his own man, have 1 in the oven and 1 who thinks he is 16...I see their testing, the similarities to W's "testing" astound me sometimes.

I apologize, I can't think of a prize....the humor within/from the people here is such a joy, blessing. Most people wouldn't ever "get" the humor in ""Lots of time to bake"...ugh! Well, at least he is in the oven right...near the oven? He's in the house where the oven is...right?" (That still cracks me up).

Just keep being YOU, the joy, the lighthouse, the rock...

[nero]

hey hi guys -

raine - sorry to glom onto your thread here- but am in my usual quandry - over some comments in there - still could use some input/help - interpreting

[/quote]Do you think the same old wife will ever be enough for them once they're properly baked? Or will they wear permanent grooves and blisters into their hands from refusing to drop that rope? linda m

one wonders - we all wonder...

takes vows:
[quote]I think home is more symbolic and meaningful for our guys than we could ever imagine. During the bomb speech, my H yelled at one point, "How do you think it feels that I can't even stand being in my own home?"

They feel trapped, want to run, need space. Some leave, some don't. Some return, some don't. But for all the newbies out there, it is IMPERATIVE that you give space, no matter what.

i think you are soooo right. my h retired & when he didn't have his office as HIS PLACE TO BE (so he took away mine) (our home) - he started treating me like some stupid boarder who was encroaching on HIS space- oh man.....

but i can't figure out what the heck the "right" thing for me to be doing now is. he is waaaaaay less critical & prickly & awful-

i've been staying in nj- let him decide to come & go. i said i'd like to go to fl in aug (as usual) - see my neices & babies? (could see dr, banking, dermatologist- things local-it's my legal residence) i could skip it- i miss them - but i wonder/dread being back down there in my "home" of 37 yrs and feeling displaced & not welcome-

any insight about that?? just curious- it's strange. i said it to him- but my mind feels i can back out anytime i want.

part of me thinks "keep a presence" in that life (he said don't move out my stuff- so my "print" is allover that place) i miss my "home" & life & people down there - (he has ow there - ick ick ick)

he's said fine - but he'll go see ow- maybe i'd croak - maybe i'd be cool - idk how i'd act/feel/ (i am embarassed to say this stuff - it's soooo shabby) huh?

any thought about that kind of a sitch???

I think home is also a reminder to them of their old life. A life that they have rewritten many things about, a life which they often try to forget.

i agree. maybe he thinks of it (or always has) as JUST HIS home? idk what this nj house is to him- he putzes around, fixes stuff, here's me at the end of this rope - there's her at the end of that other rope -

idon't want to be just this forever either- we're all in our little boxes somewhere - at the end of that particular rope0

any comments from anyone about the nj house - fl house thing welcome. it's a stumper for me-

flyin blind here

thanks

happy 4th to everybody

[RosaLinda]

I agree with everyone Raine, you are a delight and always cheer me up with your humor. Maybe someday, since we are all muddling thru this together, we'll all be done with this unwanted career of baker that has been foisted upon us at the same time, and can continue to share our triumphs and our hard-won wisdom with newbies!

Nero, I don't think there is any way in hell you can figure out what your H is thinking or not thinking at this point. He seems to love both of his homes and both of his lives. Not ready to give up either of them. You just need to hang on, to keep giving him space, to keep your GALs up at this point honey, and someday (maybe) it will all become clearer. You are doing great!

T^ I want to borrow some goggles and white lab coat from you, but does anyone have one of those spiffy white bakers hats I could have too? It's always good to have two careers to put one one's resume after all!

[Wonka]

"Lots of time to bake"...ugh! Well, at least he is in the oven right...near the oven? He's in the house where the oven is...right? smile

Oh, yeah. Lookee here, Raine....he's playing with his cute lil' Easy-Bake oven set!

[AJM]

They feel trapped, want to run, need space. Some leave, some don't. Some return, some don't. But for all the newbies out there, it is IMPERATIVE that you give space, no matter what.

I think home is also a reminder to them of their old life. A life that they have rewritten many things about, a life which they often try to forget.

I think it's good that your H came home.

Seconded. Except I don't think they try to forget it. They may like to, but I think they remember it all too well and it gets in the way of what they feel compelled to do. Whatever that may be. And they only seem to remember parts of it at a time, which makes for odd conversation at times

Peace,
AJ

[Raine]

Reading posts about the MLCer preparing to jump a puddle on TVS's thread, made me think of this quiz I did and then had my H do right before bomb drop, just days before. It was in the Oprah magazine that month. Here is the quiz, and then I'll post what his results were below:

Part 1: Think of a dilemma you're currently facing.

Now quickly push it aside and switch mental gears: Imagine you're walking through a park when you come to a hole in the ground blocking your path. On a piece of paper, sketch a scene that illustrates how you manage to continue on your way.

DO THIS NOW IF YOU WANT TO TAKE THE QUIZ YOURSELF, then read on.

"When you draw yourself solving a problem, you call on your creative strengths," says Lynn Kapitan, PhD, therapist and executive editor of the academic journal Art Therapy. "Instead of thinking, I can't do this, you imagine what you can do—and realize you have strategies hidden within."

Part 2: The way you drew yourself getting past the hole—whether on a tree-branch bridge or in a hot-air balloon—may give you new perspective on getting past the obstacle you're facing in real life. Kapitan suggests asking yourself these simple questions about your picture:

Q: How big is the hole? If it's more like a ditch than a canyon, maybe your real-world problem isn't as severe as you thought.

Q: Did you use the environment around you to get across the hole? If so, you might benefit from the support of friends, family, or a counselor as you tackle your problem. If you relied on yourself, try to identify any coping skills you take for granted (the ability to stay levelheaded, for example, or to find humor in any situation); they might serve you now.

Q: Did you draw your picture quickly? If you were guided by instinct, you may prefer to trust your gut. But if you took time to think, you might want to learn more about your problem before you proceed.

Q: Did you end up taking a risk, a leap of faith? Bold action just might move you closer to your goal.

My results at the time: My hole wasn't very big, but I used planks to get across. I did it rather quickly.

H's results: His hole was bigger than mine, but he didn't use anything to get across. Instead he avoided. He said that he would walk around it, no matter how much longer it would take, or how big the hole was. He was also concerned I would want to know what the dilemma was, and I said no, that's not the point.

Very interesting to me now in retrospect. He is going on his own path, in his own time, which is way off course from happiness is found and taking so much longer.

[uRworthy]

That is interesting, Raine.

While we feel that all of our spouses are in a MLC, the reasons that brought them about are unique to each one.

And so, while there are similarities in actions and words, each MLCer has to go through this in their own time, in their own way.

They have to complete and close out each part and reconcile what brought it about in order to come out whole.

They cant take any shortcuts, or they will wind up back in the tunnel again.

I know it is so hard to watch and live through. You are doing wonderfully, R.

Oh and as I said on T's thread - I have the patterns for the clothes - one burial suit coming up. Black, grey or blue? LOL!

[Raine]

Wonka, I nearly grabbed the easy-bake oven out today after reading your post. That is just the perfect size for his phone.

AJ, it's a weird dynamic for sure. I didn't think I would be in this situation. The plan in my mind was always I would let him come home once he had proven through long continuous action that he had changed, woken up, and wanted to work on us. Now I'm like "Uh...what happened." At what point do I ever have anything go according to plan? Now it will be interesting to see how things actually play out. I wish I had some clue as to how things are going to happen from here on out. The only thing I'm definite on is the timeline for achieving the goals I've set for myself.

Linda, so true about why isn't the love of the person who knows you and care about you more than anyone else in the world enough? With my H, nothing is enough. It's all just a selfish game to see what he can conquer next. Who can he use to make him feel better about himself. I don't know if I will ever be enough for him. And I don't want him on any other terms.

TVS, I love your sense of humor too. I think a good sense of humor is an absolute must to make it through this intact. I'm happy that he is feeling safe here. It was not very long ago that he really made me feel bad by saying that he is not comfortable here, that this is my house, and that he feels like he is an intruder when he is here. Now it is like he never left, that this is his as much as mine, except for the master bedroom.

One of my friend's H who left to have an affair wanted to make sure his wife would take him back before he broke up with the OW. Like he couldn't stand not having the option, or being without someone for even five minutes. That's what I feel like with my H right now too. He needs the options.

T2, I hate that the test always seems to change too. What I sense from him is always changing, like at some points I feel like he wants me and at others he doesn't. I just don't know what is real or fake either. I think I do, but I can't ever be sure.

He plays all the OW. I kind of wonder with OW5 if there is no challenge there and she is also the one who knows he is playing the field, while all the other ones think they are the only one. He told OW5 that he has a friend(OW2) he wants to hook up with on this next trip, that he didn't last trip because he had a better offer(OW3), but this time he wants to. He said he will just have to sweet talk her. And so he has been. He has been telling OW3 he loves her. Saying he wants to just go on a walk with her when he is there, and if it goes further than that, it's just icing. He just wants to spend some time with her. I believe this was his first cheating companion, the one that like started a few years ago, but has not been a full PA. He has also talked to me about her, and I have never heard anything positive. She can't hold down a job. She does things that annoys people. She got fired for sexual harassment. I wonder if he went after her, after that firing. I'm really not sure at what point they had a physical encounter. I can only guess, based on when he seemed to be guilt ridden and hinting at things.

I wonder if he is winding down with the OW, but he wants to make sure he has done everything he wanted to. Very limited encounters since he moved back. It's so crazy to me how he plays them. This OW2 he goes months without talking to her, and then out of the blue reconnects and acts like they're this lovey couple. And then he chats with her once a week for 5 mins, like a check in to make sure she is still on the hook and won't bail on him. Weird, weird, weird. I think I would be upset by all the EA stuff, had he not told OW5 he needed to sweet talk her. Creepy.

Thing between us are the pretty much the same. He's sometimes there for the kids, and sometimes not. He doesn't put the kids to bed or getting them up and ready, even though I'm the one who is up multiple times during the night. He goes to sleep at weird hours, like 3am and sleeps until noon, like I remember doing as a teenager too. He likes to invite people over and is including me with his new group of friends. They're all right, but not at the same point in life as me: younger, not married, no kids, not much in common. He wants to go places with me, do the things I'm doing, but he also wants to have his nights out 3-4 times a week.

Oh, one interesting tidbit, he does not text when we are doing things together anymore. He will sometimes in the car or if we are in the same room, but not during activities. If we are playing games or hanging out with another couple or eating a meal, he puts it away. He left it in his room yesterday while we were playing board games together. I'm glad that I told him that it was something he needs to work on. That one line seemed to have a pretty big impact for the time being.