My Story - Need Advice (Thread 2)

[Breakdown]

Wow, I am really impressed with your discussion with your W Chris. Way to go man! Keep that going!

[makingmagic]

W2G Chris !!

[ChrisN]

Thanks all,

I am really trying to follow the DB techniques and your advice. The few days away really helped me, and I am really trying to focus on me and D first and foremost. That will make me a better person for whatever happens. I obviously still want my W and M back, but, there is no quick fix here. It can't be "microwaved"

Journal:

Went to W new place last night to quickly see D and drop off a doll I brought her from my trip. I was very excited to see her and she me. She is the world to me.

I made sure though that I looked good when I went, and W noticed.
W: is that a new shirt? You look fantastic. You really do.
M: yeah, it is. Thanks, I feel really really good. How are you doing? How was your day?
W: I'm okay, not sleeping all that great, mind always going. Work is okay. BTW, the dog wold not listen to me, she ran away once, and would not settle down for me at night at all while you were gone. She was pacing around, etc.
M: oh, okay. She doesn't run away on me at all, still listens really well. To be honest, she doesn't settle down well at night, and has been like that since you left. (background, my W was the 'alpha dog' with our dog, and the dog would go to bed at when my wife did, so her routine is completely off at night)
W: Oh my...I guess I've wreaked havoc in everyone's life. And maybe some day I'll be ale to figure out why I made the decision.
M: you haven't wreaked havoc...well, okay, that's a fair statement. This has been hard on everyone, including you most of all I suspect. What do you mean, someday figure out why? He (me) is standing right in front of you, it was the marriage.
W: No, it wasn't all you or the marriage. The marriage was a big part of it, but, I don't know all the reasons. I know I don't know who I am, or what I want. I don't know what I want from my job, where I want to live, or what I really want from life type thing.
M: what do you mean by where you want to live? As in another city? (I had to ask as I was worried about D)
W: oh no, not that at all, I never want to live in any other city, I wouldn't try to move away from you with her. That's not what I meant...
(Mind reading I know, but, this makes me think about the conversation she had w/ me on Thursday night that I posted Friday...about how she feels comfortable here in our house and feels like she should be here still at times...)
M: Okay, thanks for explaining that. I'm sorry you're going through this and can't imagine how it's making you feel.
W: I feel like I have no roots now. Like I'm floating through life. I never thought I would be this age, living in a small apartment as a single parent. We had always had "our" life. There are plenty of nights I sit here and want to cry about this, and I do. The other days and nights that I don't cry, I just survive.. I just exist.
M: oh sweetheart, I'm so sorry you're feeling this way. I've never wanted you to feel sad or be hurt..ever. If you want to talk about anything, I will listen..but, I can't solve your problems, as much as I wish I could, I can't. You made this decision and you need to figure out what is what. But, you know I am always here, day or night for you.
W: I know, and I don't know what to say to you. I can't commit to anything with you and us because I don't know who I'll be in 6 months. I wish I could tell you, give me six months to figure myself put, then we'll go work on figuring us out...but, I don't want to give you false hope... I don't know who I will be or what I will want... I feel completely like I'm floating through life right now.
M: I understand. I won't ask you to commit or do anything you feel youre not ready to. In fact, i feel myself changing through the exploration I'm doing because of this. So, I understand, because, I don't know who I will be in 6 months either. I think I'll just be a better version of me, and will feel the same way for you and us, but, I can't guarantee that to you either.
W: I know, and that's something I may have to live with...
M: I am going to keep going to my therapist.
W: Me too. Do we still want to go see one together at some point?
M: absolutely if you do. I'm wondering though if there is any need for us to rush to go? Or should we keep doing our own individual and sort of playing by ear? We may gain more perspective with time?
W: I think that's fine...I just can't commit to anything...to us right now.
M: I understand...I do. I can't guarantee everyone either, we're really broken, but, what I can commit to you for is that I'm here, and I'm not going anywhere....and i want to talk.. I think we shoud talk...when youre ready to talk.
W: I know, and I want to talk, and I'll start talking when I can.
M: that's all I can ask of you, no more then that...im here when you're ready.

I the pn talked to D and played for awhile and when I left, W gave me a hug.

I dont know what to make of all this.., I'm trying to not engage, but, there have been times in the last week where she has, and I feel I should talk when she does... Or should I not? It's also confusing because, she'll have conversations like this, then the next day, the wall will be back up. I guess I need to keep trying to detach, so it's not a roller coaster based on her emotions. This is ALL so hard!

As always, thanks for the support and any advice!

[jp787]

I'll let a vet dissect that for you, but I hear the same from my W about not knowing, unsure about everything. We just need to let them do their thing as hard as that is...

[Accuray]

Chris,

It's nice that you're being so supportive but it is working against you. You need to lean out so she can lean in. Your reassurances are too much -- if you told her how you felt once and she's not deaf she heard you.

The visual I get reading this is that if I pulled you away from her in that conversation there would be claw marks on the floor!

You need to adopt more of a "friendly co-worker" standard. For a person like that, you would be polite and emotionally available up to a point, but beyond that you'd say "good luck, I hope you work that out" and then step back.

You're doing a lot of things really well, but your pursuing speeches are sabotaging your efforts.

Pull back. It does not make you heartless, in fact, you're being a good husband by giving her just what she wants: physical and emotional space.

The best thing you can do right now is to be LESS available emotionally. Limit how deep you will go. Don't get any depth into what you're thinking about, planning, or what you might do in the future beyond logistical facts.

Keep your cards close to the vest and make her wonder. If she sees that you are moving on with your life without her and that there may NOT be a place for her later as your wife that will help you.

If she wants to come back, GREAT, you'd be willing to talk about the conditions of her return. If not, GREAT you are going to be happy anyway and you wish her the best.

Either way, YOU are a prize to be won, not the consolation prize sitting on the shelf.

This is important -- if you don't believe, challenge

[uRworthy]

Ah, Chris, agree completely with Acc.

Too many words, man. Too many words. She heard you. She knows you are right where she left you because you have told her that a million times. How is she going to look inside if she knows you are the fall guy? If her life doesnt work out the way she wants, no worries, because Chris will be there to pick up the pieces. He's there day or night, anytime I am ready to talk.

Sorry to be a little harsh, but, reread that convo.

Should have gone something like this.

W: is that a new shirt? You look fantastic. You really do.
M: Yep, new shirt and thanks. I am going to give daughter the doll I got her and then I have to get going.

Or at the very least:
W: I'm okay, not sleeping all that great, mind always going. Work is okay. BTW, the dog wold not listen to me, she ran away once, and would not settle down for me at night at all while you were gone. She was pacing around, etc.
M: oh, okay.
W: Oh my...I guess I've wreaked havoc in everyone's life. And maybe some day I'll be ale to figure out why I made the decision.
M: I understand what you are saying.
W: No, it wasn't all you or the marriage. The marriage was a big part of it, but, I don't know all the reasons. I know I don't know who I am, or what I want. I don't know what I want from my job, where I want to live, or what I really want from life type thing.
M: Ok.
W: oh no, not that at all, I never want to live in any other city, I wouldn't try to move away from you with her. That's not what I meant...
W: I feel like I have no roots now. Like I'm floating through life. I never thought I would be this age, living in a small apartment as a single parent. We had always had "our" life. There are plenty of nights I sit here and want to cry about this, and I do. The other days and nights that I don't cry, I just survive.. I just exist.
M: Sorry you're struggling.
W: I know, and I don't know what to say to you. I can't commit to anything with you and us because I don't know who I'll be in 6 months. I wish I could tell you, give me six months to figure myself put, then we'll go work on figuring us out...but, I don't want to give you false hope... I don't know who I will be or what I will want... I feel completely like I'm floating through life right now.
W: Me too. Do we still want to go see one together at some point?
M: That's not something I can really commit to at this time.
M: I am going to go see daughter and then I have to get going. Take care.

[cbtdad]

Sorry to hijack ChrisN, but I have a question for Urworthy and acc about this. Maybe they have some insight, maybe they don't. But here it goes:

I understand what both of you are saying about leaning out so they can lean in. As well keeping answers short, etc, etc
But when you want so badly to get some insight and have them finally talking how do you get away from that? That's been my hardest thing. It's like I want to make one point or something but I can't help get into a longer conversation where it seems like I do most of the talking.
Detaching? Walking away? Prepare mentally?
Ideas if y'all have any please:) I struggle with this constantly

[uRworthy]

C, Ill answer on your thread, ok?

[ChrisN]

No worries CBT... I was just going to respond with a similar question.

I get what you guys are saying ACC and Ur... I need to lean out, to be more aloof and keep it short and sweet. But, I feel the same as CBT, you so badly want them to start talking, and when they do and you see some positives...how do you not/stop for wanting to talk? I felt I was doing everything I could to to pursue or talk too much. In hindsight with your feedback, I didn't. I was better then I have been, but it good enough. How do we do it?

[Accuray]

You need to find another outlet to air your thoughts and feelings, someone you can call 24x7, then do your talking to them instead.

What your going through and thinking about must come out, but *cannot* come out with your spouse!

You need to mentally prepare for your conversations and prepare some escape phrases for yourself if you start getting sucked in. Something like "hey, I'm supposed to be meeting up with some friends in a few minutes and don't want to be late, can we continue this another time?"

Most importantly, understand and convince yourself of the damage you are doing by getting into these conversations.

It's very difficult to practice self control and requires discipline. You need to prepare your exits in advance.

I'm sure URworthy has more good stuff for you!