You're all right. I've been thinking for a while on this and went to see IC yesterday (even though I was dreading seeing a new one and having to re-tell my story). She said to let it go about the 3-day weekend and chock it up as a "I screwed-up" and move on and think about what could I do next. Well, my D's B-day(turning 3)is next Wed and I was thinking it would be cool to show up as a surprise. Although I remember W talking about delaying her party until I show 1st week of May.
Baseball fan ????
Cause I'm gonna throw you a curveball....
Going to visit would have been a GREAT idea, if you would have done it last week.
Showing up for a birthday, normally would be a great thing, and it is a great idea for your children...
Your children ONLY...
Sadly, showing up for the good times is what this marriage has been about all along.
Anyone can do the 'better' in a marriage.
It is the 'worse' . that causes people to fail miserably...
And you blew an opportunity last weekend, to be there for the 'worse'
So IF you decide to go, you go for your kids only, and you plan to stay anywhere besides the home, unless you are asked to stay in the home.
You go, not expecting anything in return from your spouse....
This visit isn't about her, it is about your Daughter...
Although you CAN leave an impression along the way.
You can plant a seed , that can grow...in time
Originally Posted By: RS
Currently, I haven't been able to talk to W so I have no way of making these plans at the moment because I don't know what her schedule is. I called last night and there was no answer. It's frustrating and S and I still haven't been able to skype for the 1st time yet. This is why I'm believing now that going up there asap (as everyone has pointed out) is perhaps a good idea. I'm getting nowhere at this moment with phone conversations or texts. If W was serious about having D's B-day later, then I can be there for the party and help W with moving. But she mentioned that the move was in the timespan of the 1st 2 weeks of May. I need to know. Arrggh!
DO NOT SHOW UP UNEXPECTED....
You need to communicate your plans to your spouse.
Send a carrier pigeon if you have to...
Showing up at her door without planning anything will be perceived as pressure to her , and she will NOT do well with it.
Do not expect things to be all normal , and do not expect a romp in the sack with her....
She still needs time and space , although she needs to feel special.
You do that with your actions now, and you listen when/IF she wants to speak of it....
Does this change the time you planned for May ???
RS, you are walking a VERY fine tightrope , and hope you have the balance that you need for it...
This is about you being different when you interact with her, this is about showing her that she is the most important thing in your life, and this is about no more empty words from you...
And it has to be done with consistency....without over doing it...
So if you have any plans of showing up with a Rodeo clown and a field full of flowers ???
M1, this isn't the total reply to your post, I'll write more tonight. I will say at this time I did indeed miss a HUGE opportunity to show I care. W texted last night that she's still sick and been very tired. Sigh! I will remember this as a lesson learned.
Ok, finally we've had some communication tonight. Usually it's S calling me on the phone, but tonight it was W on the phone. A pleasant surprise for me. She explained that between the cold and work, she's been very tired at the end of the day and that was the reason for not staying in touch. She did most of the talking and told me about all the new things that she's been doing to make positive changes for herself. Seeking a better depression med, connecting with pen pals, simplifying the home and getting it ready for the move, reconnecting with old friends, etc. I told her I was pleased that she's happy and finding joy in her new things. After talking about the kids and her insights on different cultures, she asked what I was up to and I just told her getting ready for a fundraiser dinner tomorrow night and other than that a whole lot of nothing. She asked how my fitness was going and I told her it was going good. I was surprised she asked! I spoke with S for a little bit, then she wanted to talk at me before calling it a night. She told me that she was glad I was coming up to help out and that we were able to have this conversation tonight. So this was a nice ending for the evening. Now, I will mention that in the conversation, she did express to me that when she was with OM, that he didn't care about her appearance (weight) and made her feel beautiful regardless. I told her I understand and remember how she used to tell me about when she'd get a look or a compliment from another man and how good it would make her feel. I told her that I need to work at that and I've failed in the past to remind her how I feel. I could tell that made her feel uneasy and I didn't say anything further. So it appears to me that she's in the "don't tell me, show me" mode perhaps. I'll be sure to finish reading 5 LL a 2nd time before I go on the trip. I'll have my notebook with too.
M1, as I promised, I'll respond fully to your post.
As I've said before, I acknowledge that I missed a great opportunity. Having said that I'll move on and learn my lesson and not beat myself up about it.
The nice thing from tonight's talk was that W is going to wait for D's B-day party until I get there. BTW, I think I'll stay for only 4 days. I do know that being there is for the kids, yes.
Well I did find out our next 3-day weekend is in June and we'll see how things go on the May trip to see if it would be a good idea to go again. I understand she still needs time and space and I WILL NOT expect any intimacy.
I plan on starting small. I first need to pay attention to her and listen to her and be ready for the verbal/non-verbal cues so I can act on them and begin the transformation of myself to be more thoughtful. Visit goals: 1. Treat her the way she treated me in the past with her thoughtful kindness and not to expect anything in return.
2. Allow her plenty of space from the kids so she can have some "me time."
3. Show her I can be a confident spouse that doesn't need to solve everything for her. Listen to and validate her.
I think these are a good start for the short time I'll be there.
Well I appreciate all the assistance I've been given during my time of need. I understand that you veterans are probably helping others that need it more than me. I respect that.
According to the IC I've got a lot on my plate, yet I'm doing the right things to keep me balanced.
I've got the travel plans set and will be doing 3 days of business in Germany, then head up to Denmark to help W get ready for and execute the move. I'll be there for 6 days. Plenty of time to get the quality time or gift LL ball rolling(she hasn't taken the 5LL quiz).
Thanks to W postponing the party, we'll be able to celebrate D's 3rd birthday while I'm there.
I'm bringing my "work" attitude. This won't be a vacation. (Literally, we have to repaint the outgoing place. I'm bringing my coveralls. :))
W and I have been able to talk on the phone, but not frequently. So I'll be making an effort when I'm there to really get the communication flowing by allowing more quality time so she can talk and I can listen and validate.
My goal is for her to think after I've left, "Hmm, maybe he's not that bad of a guy after all. I really enjoyed him being here."
My goal is for her to think after I've left, "Hmm, maybe he's not that bad of a guy after all. I really enjoyed him being here."
Me thinks you miss the point....
RS...
Why wouldn't your goal be...
To go, and be yourself, and IF she misses THAT guy ???
Then you are building something that is real, instead of some act, that she will see through, like a glassed bottomed Navy ship....
Single...
I'm not convinced that you are doing this completely. I see signs of you wanting to do better, or at least you say that you want to do better, and then I see you say things that go against everything that you said you wanted to change.
What you typed up there, I read as manipulative from you.
Do you see that ???
You see...
DBing teeters on manipulative behavior. the difference is how the focus is applied..
Splitting hairs ?
Maybe...
Going there with the intention of solely changing her mind with your actions, whilst knowing full well that you really don't have it in you to be consistent with the things that YOU want to change about yourself, and your intention is to purely to change her mind...
Is manipulative...
Actually doing the hard work, changing your behavior, and going there to help her with what SHE needs, regardless of her response, yet HOPING that she sees a different side of you, and not expecting anything in return....
Is actual DBing...
And then there is this..
\/ \/ \/ \/
Originally Posted By: RS
Well I appreciate all the assistance I've been given during my time of need. I understand that you veterans are probably helping others that need it more than me. I respect that.
That reads just a tad bit passive aggressive....
And maybe a behavioral pattern that you display when things don't go the way that you want them too. ( dammed expectations). What it also says, is that IF that is true, what happens when you go there with the premise to help her move, you try to take over, temperature check her. She gets pissed, you fight, and you passive aggressively say "fine!", and travel back to your base ????
And then you come here, and post about how miserably YOU were treated by her...
I see what you're saying, but if were to be the guy I was before, where I was neglecting her LL of quality time or gifts, I may as well stay home. That is what I'll be working on including listening to her more and validating her feelings. I'll be checking my ego at the door and forget that our marriage is a competition. The last thing I want to be is manipulative. That's one of the reasons I left my 1st wife.
My changed behavior so far is not running my mouth and letting her speak. If there isn't anything really important to tell her, I wish her a good day/evening and end the conversation Last night it was D's b-day and since she's too young to understand, I called W so I could just tell her that I was very grateful that she decided to postpone her b-day party until I was there. I told her that it meant a lot to me. I told her that's all I wanted to say and to have a good evening.
My plan is to really listen to her words, pay attention to her non-verbals and focus on her. It's difficult to do this long-distance, so I'm planning on applying myself.
Quote:
What it also says, is that IF that is true, what happens when you go there with the premise to help her move, you try to take over, temperature check her. She gets pissed, you fight, and you passive aggressively say "fine!", and travel back to your base ????
And then you come here, and post about how miserably YOU were treated by her...
Oh, no! I went through that sitch over last Christmas/New Years. I will completely avoid stuff that will bring us to that point. That was a miserable time.
The move is absolutely her call so I am there to help. Not take over. I've told myself that so as to prepare. No offering solutions unless she asks.
I don't think it would be wise to temp ck with how short of a visit and it being the first since the BD.
Ok, here's a better goal. Don't travel back with regrets or bad feelings toward her. That's what happened the last trip.
OK, not a BD, but I feel like a grenade was just hurled at me.
The following PM I got from W on FB:
I need the following from you. Melatonin 2 bottles Coffee S wants some jelly beans the real stuff D needs Adidas or Nike sneakers in size 6 ---////-------- From the house: The Tupperware for lunch meat The polish pottery The silverware I bought in Germany, in a suitcase. I can give you some instead. My panini grill or if you can buy me one here
First of all, I don't know why she didn't call me. We haven't been strangers to using the phone. I have no problem with the first half of the request, it's the second half that I do. That is a lot of weight and I would definitely be either paying overweight baggage charges or I'd be limited for what military space-a flight I could take if I have too much luggage.
My plan was to fly space-a, travel light and only bring what was necessary. I have two small gifts for the kids I'm bringing. I was going to bring the coffee because W likes it and can't get it in her country.
Second, I don't know how to reply to the second half of the request without saying the wrong things. So for now I'm remaining silent.
If W doesn't call me tonight regarding this "heavy" request, I'll make sure to see IC tomorrow. This really troubles me.
W did call me and asked if I saw the request. I told her that the polish pottery alone weighs 25 lbs. She replied she didn't realize that, but asked if I could bring 4 plates. I told her those are my daily dishes I use. I told her I could bring the silverware. I offered to buy her a new panini grill since I use this one and she was concerned I'd buy something cheap. I told her I'd look for one with the same features. She said you may as well wait until I'm with her so she can pick it out. That kinda hurt.
Well I'll head off to bed and keep reading 5LL. That's all I can do right now.
W called back after about 10 mins and apologized for being so demanding. She said she was in a bad mood (cramps) and the kids are pushing her buttons. She said this isn't about a pissing match of who gets what. It's just about some stuff that she misses and could use. I told her that we could talk about it further tomorrow since she wasn't feeling good. I wished her a good week and she said I'll talk to you tomorrow.
