The View from the Blanket III

[bustingout]

Ok I am posting a lot as something became clear to me. I felt empathy for H. In my thoughts, I could see him as my friend again and not my estranged H. I wasnt hurt and I could see clearly his repeated patterns of behaviour (I have known H for almost 25 years). And I felt empathy. This has helped me release the negativity I was feeling from yesterday and the stress of him being here.

Bug was spot on. Empathy is the cure for anger.

[JuneReN]

Sometimes we talk about the fog that the WAS lives in, but I say we live in one too. Good thing, I think, because it helps us not be overwhelmed at the beginning, I mean critically overwhelmed (because we all are shell shocked) That fog lifts over time, allowing to see more clearly and take closer inspection of things that may have been indistinct or blurry before.

But I find that you can't see these things until you are ready. Sounds like you are ready

[needgrace]

hi busting,

bug directed me to a talk on the soundstrue website on shame by brene brown. i have listened to it three times and i think it may very well be the key to how we are feeling and acting and also how the WAS feels and acts.

i have been wondering what makes it easier for some on this site to DB during interactions with their WAS, to be less stuck than I feel and to maintain their self worth despite the rejection.. that question has been really bothering me as i consider myself a really calm, caring person but when i am around my STBX... i have been like a child many times..

i think the difference may be that i am in a shame storm about my sitch.

brown's research showed that love and belonging are irreduceable needs and that their absence creates suffering. (don't we know it??)

the difference in how people come through this suffering depended on if they felt worthy of love and belonging. and shame is the root of feelings of unworthiness (i am not good enough, not loveable, etc.) she feels that shame is universal but that some people are shame-resistant because of how they handle shame.

shame is different than guilt. guilt is "I did something bad." shame is "I am bad."
guilt is adaptive and motivates real change. shame correlates with addictions, depression, etc...

when we feel shame, there are generally three responses 1) move away (hide, silence) 2) move toward (people please) 3) move against ("I'm in so much pain, screw her") she said that we tend to use all three, but in different situations..

this was an amazing talk for me, busting... she said that shame triggers the amygdala, the fight or flight response... and is like experiencing trauma..which i think explains both our and our WAS responses many times in our conversations.

i now understand that i have responded many times out of the deep shame and resulting fear of not feeling loveable which was triggered by BD (BD confirmed my underlying greatest shame/fear) ... and i feel as if my STBX felt great shame about our sitch and that fueled her behavior as well...

i think that the ones on here (SS and Brit stand out to me) that did not seem to allow the BD to define them (or not for very long) were able to hold on to their feelings of worthiness throughout their sitches..

busting, i am not sure if this is applicable to you or your H in any way, but thought i would post some of this here as i have always felt such a kinship with you. i am going to post more later as she also talked about the ways in which we can become shame resistant. i think this site helps us to do that. hope you dont mind my rant on shame

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Busting))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[keep_going]

NG - Thanks for posting this - it really hit home for me not so much re. my H's actions, but my own...

Busting - sending you love, dear friend!

[JuneReN]

Thanks from me too NG...:)

[bustingout]

NG, thank you for this. This is very interesting to me. I am at work now and when I get home am going to reread and absorb.

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((NG))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[needgrace]

oops i meant shame resilient, not resistant.

busting, i posted more from the talk on my thread.

love you.

[bustingout]

NG your post is very relevant to me and my H I believe, in different ways. Its almost as if it was a 'perfect storm' of events that led to the BD...built on repressed shame and feeling of being unworthy.

I would be doing a lot of mind reading if I tried to analyse H too much so I wont go into that, yet I do see how this have resulted in several of his behaviors; those leading up to BD, the death of his father, and his subsequent decisions and actions.

My BD also confirmed my biggest underlying shame and fear. I wonder too if this has resulted in me taking so long to feel unstuck.

I am going to go read your thread to read some more and also look up the talk as well. Thank you NG. My virtual sister....I love you too.


Journal

Past couple of days have been not much to report on the H front. On the GAL front, Val was right...I Galed to exhaustion and last night I fell asleep at 930 pm lol I haven't slept 8 hours straight in years.

I guess the biggest difference is again, I feel different. Not anxious anymore around H. I still need to get better at STFU. It still hurts when he leaves at night. It still suxx that he doesn't see me anymore. I am living though. And I am enjoying the life I have right now. I have no expectations from him. He actually surprises me when he shows signs of respecting me and my boundaries. I dont think they are hard core boundaries. Perhaps because it is different for me to state things in a clam way, he can hear me better than when I was ranting and raving.

This morning when H came I opened my mouth and said lets go have a coffee (Tuesdays I dont need to be a school early so I usually drop the kids off and go back home, and H doesnt go to the office that early on any day). I wanted to bite my tongue. He gave me a look of 'ok'. I didnt say anything again. And we went. We didnt really talk. Had coffee. Some small chit chat about the kids and thats all. I said thank you and left.

I would have considered this a SIGN a few months ago.I would have thanked him profusely and made some comment about how nice it was and probably would have even then asked for him to do something else again.

Now I see it for what it is. A coffee with someone I know.

And I observe. More for me than anything. My behaviours and actions while I figure out what it is that I really want as I navigate through this. I think I can really be ok.

[keep_going]

(((((Busting)))))


You sound so good today and I am so happy for you! It's amazing how much we can learn from our situations and about ourselves even after so much time has passed since DB. It just goes to show that we can always continue growing and learning - just like you are doing.

I was thinking about something re. your GAL. You mentioned that it's been years since you slept 8hrs. I have noticed that sleeping has become such an important GAL thing for me. Like most of us, when DB happened I barely slept. Then as my pregnancy progressed, I was too uncomfortable and still depressed and anxious to sleep. Finally after S1 was born, I just didn't have time to sleep (lol...)

I realize now what a HUGE factor the lack of sleep was in my mood, PMA efforts and overall interactions with everyone - including my kids. Now, even if I don't want to, I force myself to sleep 6-8hrs. every night. No matter what. The differences have been HUGE. Perhaps it will help in your case as well... A seemingly small thing can help a lot!

((((((((busting)))))))

[Valeska19]

I think you can really be okay too.

It's hard not to have expectations... but I think if we can think rationally, validating our emotions but not letting them control our actions, we can learn to not have them.

For example - you say that the boundaries aren't hard core (implying that it shouldn't be hard for H to respect them - expectation).. but if you had a relationship with your H where there were no boundaries.. EVERY boundary is hard.

My x and I both set NC boundaries for very different reasons, but in the end to protect ourselves and I think deep down each other.. At first it was difficult to accept... but now it's easier. We both actually set new boundaries last week, and I feel fine with it overall.

That took us almost 2 years to learn. First as individuals and I guess now together.

I think we are so willing to give us the time and grace to change - but we tend to forget to do that with WAS. Maybe this is out of pain or fear... actually no maybe's about it - it is.

But in actuality it really should be US who are the most understanding. I mean we spend all this time looking in the mirror, pushing ourselves to grow, understanding the importance of failures and showing grace in them.

How can we NOT understand??

Yet still we struggle to show the same to the WAS. I think if we can push through this stumbling block - that's when we allow the real change happen.

Okay - starting to ramble now.. but if you can see every little thing as a positive step with your H.. not necessarily towards you - but just a positive moment...

you will be able to build upon it. You won't just be telling yourself you are okay - you really will be.

((( )))