Another dollar in my one-man show

[Big Bruce]

Easy, easy on the replies,
Those were just thoughts. I won't act on it.
I guess this type of fantasies come easy to me for three reasons :

- I am not really home here. I already worked in different countries in the past, and I know you can re-start from 0 when you change places. Thus the temptation.

- The amounts asked of me every month (until June) are ridiculous, and, check that, W is now pursuing 50% of the assets in France! Now that's dishonest, because she knows very well that I brought the downpayment for the mortgage. This is debatable, but I made every payment. If the two parties should part ways, why should she get out of it richer than she ever brought in or earned ? Especially after three years of marriage?

- My older cousin got Ded a couple of years ago. Same thing, W left him. He changed countries, and guess what, he met a kind girl, and they're expecting a baby now. So happy for him, all is good that ends good.

Mentally, I'm being tumbled to every side, like a dirty rag in a washing machine, and even my driving has worsened. People honk at me because they're mad, and I don't even care. I don't look at who is honking or swearing or why, I just keep doing my thing.. it's so asocial.

Maybe 25yearsmic is right, I don't have any coping ability. In truth my life has been so good until now that I don't know what to do in the face of adversity or contrariety. This one has knocked me off.

So I go to C today, and she tells me that I can't control W, and I can only control me. Duh, I know... I'm so disappointed.

Oh Lord, please help me...
Pretty please..

[25yearsmlc]

Easy, easy on the replies,
Those were just thoughts. I won't act on it.

Why not? You just justified it in your last post and again here.

I guess this type of fantasies come easy to me for three reasons :

- I am not really home here. I already worked in different countries in the past, and I know you can re-start from 0 when you change places. Thus the temptation.

Translation: It would be easy for me.

- The amounts asked of me every month (until June) are ridiculous, and, check that, W is now pursuing 50% of the assets in France! Now that's dishonest, because she knows very well that I brought the downpayment for the mortgage. This is debatable, but I made every payment. If the two parties should part ways, why should she get out of it richer than she ever brought in or earned ? Especially after three years of marriage?

TRANSLATION: Money & I'm angry.


- My older cousin got Ded a couple of years ago. Same thing, W left him. He changed countries, and guess what, he met a kind girl, and they're expecting a baby now. So happy for him, all is good that ends good.

TRANSLATION: I know someone else who abandoned his family and HE SAYS he's happy and that's all that matters. (No one asks about the abandoned child b/c that child is being replaced. No problem.)


Mentally, I'm being tumbled to every side, like a dirty rag in a washing machine, and even my driving has worsened. People honk at me because they're mad, and I don't even care. I don't look at who is honking or swearing or why, I just keep doing my thing.. it's so asocial.

Maybe 25yearsmic is right, I don't have any coping ability. In truth my life has been so good until now that I don't know what to do in the face of adversity or contrariety. This one has knocked me off.

Well yes it has. We've all been there and for all of us, THIS type of experience is among the worst. Only the death of a child seem worse than the death of a marriage. I think

It's fair to say you are having more trouble than most, sticking to a MOOD for a week, let alone a course of action.

You seem to need coping tools & skills for handling anger & setbacks and just not getting your way. There's no shame in needing help IF you avail yourself of it.

Bruce I already gave you the sources of help out there b/c I don't think a weekly meeting with a therapist is going to be enough for you. Sounds to me like you feel that way too.

Anyhow, Weren't you suggesting just LAST WEEK, your "total surrender and giving her everything" and the whole being a martyr thing?

See, this is where I get worried about you.

Your plans and mood swings go to such extremes, and are so frequent, that You need more help than you are getting, Bruce.

You have to get that help NOW or you'll do something you very much regret. And you'll get hurt and you will hurt others too. IT's preventable.

Don't keep reverting back to the "it's hopeless if it's hard!!" routine.

Did that really work for you in your past? It's not working here.





So I go to C today, and she tells me that I can't control W, and I can only control me. Duh, I know... I'm so disappointed.

Oh Lord, please help me...
Pretty please..

I'm trying very hard to help you. But when someone throws you a lifeline, you can't toss it back b/c it's not the one you want.

You'll just keep drowning. Bruce, are you interested in changing YOU or just your wife or just the situation?

B/c if you are here to change your wife, we cannot help you.

If you are here to get the TEMPORARY legal orders changed, we cannot help you.

If you here to change anyone or anyting but yourself, then we cannot help you.

But if YOU are willing to change YOU, then maybe we can get somewhere.

It's not hopeless UNLESS YOU DECIDE TO GIVE UP. Then it is.

I've tried to warn you about what will happen with your son if you keep on in this mindset. Please don't pass on the negativity or hopeless feelings to your son. They're not healthy and surely you want better for him...right?

Please tell me, when I write these posts to you, Am I wasting my time?

[PatientMan]

I am just saying to love your kid(s) fiercely forever and any woman that doesn't respect that isn't worth your energy.

-tmd

[dbmod]

Not sure of the potential toll status here...but the sentiment isn't unusual.and neither is the play out, except for continent. Many men have left in this type of situation and moved on as if they were in a new continent (not sure how many actually move that far away). Many move on to successfully parent the new spouses children or to have more children and ignore the first set.


Divorcebusting retains a set of active posters that often has a certain culture. To be outside of the norm of the online culture doesn't make it unusual.

I am of the mindset of the responses here. His mindset doesn't make Big Bruce a troll.

[25yearsmlc]

Dbmod,

this isn't my thread so maybe it's out of line to ask. If so, my apologies.

But can you clarify this a bit more?

[Big Bruce]

Hi,
Dbmod, I'm interested in knowing as well. Is this reaction a normal one (wanting to flee, pretending all of this never happened)?

Journal : W continues her policy of 0 contact with me. Last time I saw her was in court. She is nowhere to be seen, and does not communicate with me. In return I do not communicate with her, respecting her wish to be left alone. Also we know that any unecessary contact at this point is pursuing, which we don't want. It'll only make her want to make it clear that she separated, rejecting me even more.

Exception to the rule, she wrote an email saying : "thank you for the cheque." on the 1st of March (after receiving what the court asked me to give her every month).(I have not paid the arrears yet).
I know it's just a way of acknowledging the passing of money, but still, she could have said :"I got your cheque".

Our wedding anniversary is coming up next week, and I still haven't made up my mind about what to do or not to do. I sincerly hope it's not our last one, so really, I don't want to blow it. I want W to keep a good memory of what I did on 14th March 2013 despite what was the situation.

I don't know, I may only be a dreamer, but if she were to D, I want to be so excellent that it'll cause her to remember every 14th March of what it could have been if...

Also, S's birthday is the 20th of March. Again, giving him a big gift might be seen as trying to earn points... suggestions on what to do?

And one last thing, W's sister has or will very shortly, give birth. Should I send a card, go see her in her city, write an email, call her? Or is it a faux-pas, might appear as trying to be nice to get to W ?

Man, all these questions would be so simple to answer if W didn't destroy the whole family. I don't know anymore what is normal to do or not do, to feel or not feel. Yes, I may be a goblin or troll like someone called me after all, my heart swings from wanting to leave the country out of anger towards W to the other extreme wanting to forgive her all and wipe the slate clean.

And yes, 25yearsmic is right, life is unfair, look at Africa, they have it so good there. Man, I wish I could escape to South Africa some days, it's so beautiful their landscapes, weather so nice, fruits so abundant, people so nice... and I'm stuck here.

[MrBond]

Everything was fine until your last two paragraphs. Unbelievable.

[25yearsmlc]

Dbmod said:
Not sure of the potential toll status here (I believe she meant "tRoll" here)


...but the sentiment isn't unusual.and neither is the play out, except for continent. Many men have left in this type of situation and moved on as if they were in a new continent (not sure how many actually move that far away). Many move on to successfully parent the new spouses children or to have more children and ignore the first set.


Yes it has happened. But Bruce, what may happen on occasion does NOT make it right or healthy, even if it seems to "work". DBMOD, what are you trying to tell him? Though I too, have seen it happen...btw. But it's hardly a good idea.

Bruce, feeling violent rage can be a "normal" reaction to offensive conduct, but Acting on it, is not normal.

Are you asking the DB moderator for approval (I think he is, btw, asking exactly that and w/all due respect, I hope whatever answer comes, is a very clear one).


FWIW, I do know one man who left his then pregnant wife back home when he moved out to California to find a home for them and start a new job. I guess he met OW or got into drugs or trouble, I don't know. All I know is he told his pregnant wife and toddler son NOT TO COME b/c "they deserved better" and they never heard from him again.

That was 26 years ago. That h missed A LOT. He'll never know the fine young men his ex w raised, mostly alone. "Mostly alone" b/c she met a great guy who became their stepfather. They love HIM.

They have NO interest in knowing or meeting their biological father.

They were not raised by a biological father but by the man who helped their mother raise them.

They're a very close family, although there is always that wound in the backdrop.

At the oldest son's wedding, he toasted his mother for being the "greatest woman he'd ever known", and the similarities between HER and his bride were what made him choose that bride. The bride beamed as she was not threatened by this. She too, admires Vicky.

Everyone cried as he thanked his mom for being the greatest PARENT he could hope for, and I swear, the whole wedding crowd stood to toast and cheer her and everyone cried. Best toast I've heard at ANY wedding...

The abandoning xh saw none of this^^.

Of course he didn't see his sons mulitple graduations, their awards for leadership or sports, he didn't see the doctor graduate from med school or his other son get his MBA from Princeton.

He did not see his sons work together to invent a medical device that has made millions for them AND helped save lives...he's just not a part of any of that. It's as if he died when he abandoned them.

He'll never meet his grandchildren...the oldest grandchildren of his two older children...didn't dance at their weddings and won't dance at the grandkids...& wasn't at the baptisms...
alas he'll never know what he's missed...he can try to replace it but it's not the same.

Finally, turns out his "new" family learned of the first family and his "new" kids were furious they had half siblings they never knew of. They did NOT respect his choice. I think he's lost both families in effect.

Bruce, Does this^^ appeal to you?


Divorcebusting retains a set of active posters that often has a certain culture. To be outside of the norm of the online culture doesn't make it unusual.

I am of the mindset of the responses here. His mindset doesn't make Big Bruce a troll.

Okay DbMod, you are saying you believe Bruce is real? We're all amazed b/c we are pro marriage and cannot wrap our brain around his proposal.

I accept that it is possible he's real, b/c I sure am posting a lot if he's not. The question remains though...

am I wasting my time posting to him?

Hi,
Dbmod, I'm interested in knowing as well. Is this reaction a normal one (wanting to flee, pretending all of this never happened)?

"wanting to flee" might be normal to think but so few actually do it, I hope you see the difference. Plus, like I said, you wanted to give her everyting last week. What happened to that "Plan"??

Journal : W continues her policy of 0 contact with me. Last time I saw her was in court. She is nowhere to be seen, and does not communicate with me. In return I do not communicate with her, respecting her wish to be left alone. Also we know that any unecessary contact at this point is pursuing, which we don't want. It'll only make her want to make it clear that she separated, rejecting me even more.

True^^

How long has this been now...a month (or 2) of little to no contact?

Exception to the rule, she wrote an email saying : "thank you for the cheque." on the 1st of March (after receiving what the court asked me to give her every month).(I have not paid the arrears yet).
I know it's just a way of acknowledging the passing of money, but still, she could have said :"I got your cheque".

baby step, yes. Do NOT push forward b/c of it, b/c what you were doing, backing off, was helping. So do what works, don't jump ahead b/c you want more NOW...make sense?.

Our wedding anniversary is coming up next week, and I still haven't made up my mind about what to do or not to do. I sincerly hope it's not our last one, so really, I don't want to blow it.

See previously made comments....I gave you maybe 3 or 5 ideas......


I want W to keep a good memory of what I did on 14th March 2013 despite what was the situation.

I don't know, I may only be a dreamer, but if she were to D, I want to be so excellent that it'll cause her to remember every 14th March of what it could have been if...

it's a fantasy we all have and it's not insane. We want to give them something positive to MISS. NOT PURSUIT, but a pleasant feeling or memory resurfacing.

No one misses the anger or defensiveness.

Also, S's birthday is the 20th of March. Again, giving him a big gift might be seen as trying to earn points... suggestions on what to do?


So, it's HIS birthday? Give him a nice gift. It's not about her. Not about how she interprets a gift you give HIM unless you are trying to do something manipulative. What would that be, Bruce? Unless you have an odd thing in mind or a very very pricey gift, why would it be about her or you pursuing HER? I am confused by that. What are you worried about?


I say it's his day. Do what is safe and reasonable & generous FOR HIM...and YES discuss it with your wife. Tell her your 2-3 ideas for gifts to make sure no one else is giving it to him OR that she does not object to it (like a certain type of trike she might think is unsafe, for instance)


And one last thing, W's sister has or will very shortly, give birth. Should I send a card, go see her in her city, write an email, call her? Or is it a faux-pas, might appear as trying to be nice to get to W ?


Sending a card is fine. Don't worry so much about how your w will interpret acts of kindness. Just do them.

Worry more about how she'll see acts of anger or selfishness.

Of course, when you send a card, do not invite yourself over when you think w will be there, etc. Do not actually pursue, and I think you'll be fine.


Man, all these questions would be so simple to answer if W didn't destroy the whole family.

Again?? She did NOT destroy your family. Do you read what we write to you? Please, swear that you do NOT read them. B/c if you do read them, you must think we are all lying OR we're all fools.

Yes Bruce it feels insulting as heck to read something like that statement...



I don't know anymore what is normal to do or not do, to feel or not feel. Yes, I may be a goblin or troll like someone called me after all,

the term "troll" here, means someone who makes up their stories and tries to shock readers with outlandish claims that seem so selfish and self pitying and show extreme changes and stubborness too, that it's not believable that you are real person.

I'm going to trust, a little longer, that you are a real person who is really out of his element. You seem to keep wanting to believe more than anything, that you did not do anything bad, of significance, to get youself here. You seem to believe that if only your wife would wake up, all would be well.

Since we have ALL asked and showed you a number of times how you created A LOT of your situation and only by changing YOU, can you get through this, it's hard to believe you still repeat the same things you said when you first got here....and you really do.

That is why some posters think you are not real & that you are "trolling" the internet to upset people on purpose by being so stubborn. I have to admit I'm having trouble believing you are real.

I'd have to ask the DbModerator to check out what Bruce writes about Africa below and then tell us what you think DBmod...b/c I'm about to resign from this. Clearly I am not getting through. Maybe you can?


my heart swings from wanting to leave the country out of anger towards W to the other extreme wanting to forgive her all and wipe the slate clean.

And yes, 25yearsmic is right, life is unfair, look at Africa, they have it so good there. Man, I wish I could escape to South Africa some days, it's so beautiful their landscapes, weather so nice, fruits so abundant, people so nice... and I'm stuck here.

Check out Darfur, Sudan's Civil War, Nigeria's, Botwana, all of East Africa's food crisis, violence against women, Mali's civil war, massive droughs, Libya and Chad are doing GREAT with their sectarian violence, Tunisia is in turmoil...actually nearly every other country in that continent has seriously huge problems...

SOUTH AFRICA?? Racism is still rampant. Their judicial system is among the most corrupt in the world. LOW literacy rates and the HIGH HIV & AIDS affected population is among the highest in the world. Very high crime, high inflation, low manufacturing, lots of bombings, & water sewage problems leading to outbreaks of dysentery and cholera... The leading cause of death for pregnant women is homicide by their h's.

What South Africa are you talking about? IS there a brochure you're reading from? My brother was just there.

The "Whites Only" areas closed down. Oh, sure the weather is nice when there's no drought..& it does have good fruit. Poor YOU Bruce, stuck in wacky dangerous Canada...

you said you never complained about that place? Yes you have. You have a very negative view of it.. In my MANY posts to you I list tools for you to get help so if you are real, please avail youself of them.

What's the worst that can happen? You won't get your wife back, but you'll have better ways of communication? The way you do it here is not winning you friends so I think it's a great idea for you.

And if there is a chance of getting your wife and life back, it has to be by you truly changing at a deeper core level than you are aware of.

Like the counselor you said you'd see INSTEAD of attending an intensive workshop, "you don't control your w". After all this time I can't believe that surprised/disappointed you...


And with that, I say ADIEU BRUCE...

(Btw, for a Frenchman, your name sure is not Francais...where'd you get that first name?)

[movingon-1968]

The post above ^^^ is why this forum needs a ratings system.

And maybe an awards system for people as wise as 25yearsmlc. Your example of the WAH is golden. If that doesn't wake Bruce up to the (possible) reality and effects of leaving his child, NOTHING WILL.

[Big Bruce]

Hello all,
I know, I had exactly the same reaction when W dropped the bomb: "this can't be real". Does that make me a troll?
And when W claimed wanting 100% of our S. Outlandish, I know... oh, don't get me started.

You have to understand that I come from what one can call a "conservative" christian family. Being angry at spouses is not even mentionned, D is unthinkable, "people of the world" do it.
After all I still am a christian, and also was supposed to be W. It's bigger a shock than many of you will ever understand.
It seems in America, that D is very common. Since I arrived, and shared my story with people in church, etc... nearly 1 out of 2 has gone through something similar. I'm shocked, this can't be real. People here marry or divorce as if it was nothing.

And people here in this forum seem to think it's okay for W to D if she is not satisfied about the way I treated her, and she is justified!
I don't know what to say, in my view of marriage, and I think I made it clear, you stick to one another NO MATTER WHAT .
All the rest is bla bla to excuse the sin of Divorce.

Having said that, I learned here many things, including how to be in W's shoes to feel what she felt, and have empathy. And of course, to change my ways, to not repeat the grief I caused.

I also learned to back off, and stop pursuing, and let W sort out what she thinks and feels and what not.

I also now have more interest in S, making it my number 1 priority, Not getting W back (for the moment), but my relationship to my son above all else.

And, most important, I see that not everybody thinks like me or my family, or my friends, and therefore, I have to open my mind, and accept the ideas and advice, even when I don't necessarily agree or understand.
I realized also that my life had been pretty seamless until now, and that I absolutely don't know what to do when things get rough.

-->For this, I am thankful to ALL OF YOU.
I will never find the right words in English to express my gratitude.

As for the Africa comment, because I mentionned in a previous post my desire to escape to S. Africa or Australia, first thing that came to mind was how nice a vacation I had in S. Africa. I visited in 1995 after the rugby world cup, and I only seen the good side of it, apparently.

Pour ce qui est de mon prénom, sachez que bien qu'il soit écossais, sa vraie origine est de Normandie, donc de France. Une autre explication moins répandue prétend que Bruce proviendrait de "brousse" qui comme chacun sait, signifie "bush".
Quoi qu'il en soit, je ne l'ai pas choisi, et si on devait décréter la nationalité des gens par leur prénom...

Sur ce,
Bien le bonsoir,
Bruce.