First Timer

[wolverine1997]

Thanks for all the positive comments, I really need them. This has been a long and tiring struggle. I'm constantly re-reading portions of the book that I didn't really get the first time that I read it. But answer this for me. Step #3 is asking for what you want. If I ask for something and she agrees to it, (such as doing some things together or talking more) is that still considered pursuing? I see it as a positive if we are able to talk more or spend some time together. Let me know if my thinking is off. It is really hard for me not to over think everything.

[wolverine1997]

Thanks for all the encouraging words. It is nice to hear something positive every once in a while. But here is a question for everyone. Step #3 is ask for what you want. If I ask to spend some time together and to talk more and she agrees to it is that still considered pursuing? I figure that talking and spending more time together will help to improve things. What are your thoughts? I know that my judgment is clouded and my thoughts are all over the place.

[adinva]

I was trying to figure out what step 3 you were talking about. Sandi's 37 rules #3 is don't try to get your spouse to read DB/DR, by the way. So I checked out the first chapter of DR posted here on the site and it says:

In the third step- Ask for What You Want- I will encourage you to approach your spouse with your newly developed goals. I will suggest ways for you to do this and strategies to use if your spouse isn't as receptive as you would like.

So, it's good that you're reading MWD again, but have you read more than the chapter title? Reread it and think about how the chapter addresses the WAY you ask for what you want, the EXPECTATIONS you should (not) have when you ask, and the PURPOSE of what you're asking for.

In my opinion, if you want to spend some time together where you can talk, that's not inherently a bad idea. If you ask for that, and give her every right not to want to do that, and have no expectations or hope of controlling what she says or how much she enjoys this time you plan, it's not inherently a bad idea. If you consider asking and spending time together a CHANGE from your normal behavior (since she doesn't want to be with how you have been), then it's a 180 and you observe whether it draws her closer or pushes her away, and decide for yourself whether it was good and should be done more, or ineffective or damaging to your cause and should not be done more.

I haven't heard anything yet in your new posts that indicates that you understand and accept where she is and how she's feeling. I only hear that you don't want her to do what she's doing, you don't want her to feel how she's feeling, and you want to talk and convince her to change. But unfortunately it does not work that way.

Can you read section three and come back with some ideas on your own about how "ask for what you want" might apply to you?

[wolverine1997]

Thanks for the insight, I really appreciate it. It helps to bounce things off of other people. Yes, I have re-read much of the book again, and am going through each of the steps. My goal right now is to rebuild a friendship. And the best way to do that is to talk and spend some time together. So far she has agreed to some extent to do this. Her responses have been either slightly positive, or neutral. I have not seen any negatives from it as of yet. She seems to be most receptive on the weekends. I just have to make sure that I don't ask for too much too fast.

I fully accept where she is right now and how she is feeling. Honestly though, I don't really understand it. She has never explained her feelings where I could understand them. Whenever I would ask she would get upset, scream, holler and call names. Most of her complaints always revert back to things that happened 10-20 years ago. Most of them were minor and usually were differences of opinion and/or philosophy. I fully believe that the root of most of this stems from our sons diagnosis of autism and then the sexual assualt that she suffered. She has never been the same since those incidents. I know that I can not change her, but I can help to change her opinion of me and our marriage by making changes to myself. That is my goal. Any changes that she makes will have to come from her, but hopefully I can help influence that by my actions and changes. I don't even talk to her about changes or our relationship, I just try to enjoy the moment and re-build a foundation.

I think that asking for what I want helps me to prioritize goals, let's me know where I am standing and gives me a path. She already knows my intentions and hopes are to stay married and rebuild our relationship. Every goal that I have and everything thing that I ask for is for that end. I just have to keep applying DB principles and learn to read signs.

I am trying to follow the two examples found in chapter #9 on pages163-190. Their situations seems similar to mine so I think that this is a good path to follow.

[Rick1963]

Are you guys getting help with your autistic child? Some respite? I have met hundreds of families with an autistic child. Usually one of the parents blames themselves for it. Or becomes a "helicopter parent". That one parent forgets about everything else and the autistic child becomes the focus of their life. It's hard place to be wol. EMDR is a therapy that is effective with trauma victims. Eye movement dysenzitation response.

[wolverine1997]

That would be my wife. She never admits it but she severely blames herself for our son having autism. She is obsessed with him and in my opinion she spends way too much time focusing on him. But of course if I say that it leads to a fight and I am a bad parent. Today is a perfect example of this. My son is 14 years old and he is a loving, wonderful child. Overall he is a good natured, mild child. But over the last few years he has become more and more agressive, especially towards me and my daughter. Today was a prime example of this. My son and I were at Walmart. He walked up to me and began to rub my hand. It was beginning to become annoying so I told him to stop (He likes physical contact and to touch in an innocent manner). I often tell him to stop because if he does this to someone who doesn't know him it could be misinterpreted. Well when I stopped him today he began to get upset and hit me. He soon got out of control and I found myself trying to restrain him. This was the worst that I had ever seen him. It was almost as if I were defending myself. After a few minutes I was able to calm him down and get him out of the store. I was very upset because he has down this before but this is the worst it has ever gotten. I had never seen him like this before. I reluctantly decided to call my wife at work and tell her about it. I didn't want to do it because I knew that she would somehow blame me for what happened as she has done in the past. But I called her anyway because I feel that she has a right to know. And we are trying to get him more help. As suspected, after I told her she said that "he never does that to me", and questioned why I didn't just let him keep rubbing my hand, as if I did something to drive him to this behavior. I quickly reminded her that he has done this multiple times with me and several times with his older sister. She continued to question me as if I did something to provoke this. I didn't get upset at her or say anything to start a fight. I just focused on his behaviour. After this we left to pick my daughter up from school. When she got into the car he began to pull and grab me again in front of my daughter. When we got home I called my wife again at work and had my daughter tell her what happened in the car. At this point she tried to contact the therapist at his school. But this is how it is with her. She is very obsessed with him and blames herself for his condition. She thinks that only she knows what is best for him and everyone else's opinion is worthless. It is very frustating at times but I can't allow it to become a bigger problem in my family.

[Rick1963]

Wol anything u do will be resisted by your W. I'm not an expert on autism but I'm gonna throw out some ideas. Maybe others will chime in. If you expect your W to change her ways regarding your son in wont happen. If you expect her to stop obssessing over your son and give u and the others attention it won't happen. If u compete with your son over her attention he will win always. If he acts out and you inform your W she will say that it doesn't happen to her. That's her guilt over your sons condition speaking. She blames herself for it. How I as your mother failed you, made you ill. This what she maybe telling herself.

Not to blame u but when your son does things that u know will annoy you is there anything you could do differently? To avoid him acting out and restraining him?
Is the school helping him? Have you looked into a Behaviorist? Just some thoughts

[adinva]

As the person who is currently being called at work every instant that my H doesn't like something my kids are doing, I felt annoyed on your wife's behalf. She does have a need to know. Does she have a need to know repetitively through the day while she is at work and you are with your son? What are you expecting her to do about it over the phone that you can't do right there in person?

As the person on the receiving end of this, I would love for my H to call me at a good time such as after dinner, or better yet face to face, and tell me how his day went, including good things about son and bad things about son, and other things, and ask me how my day went. And then together kick around ideas about Son. What good is achieved by, gee this seems to be getting worse, oh really it doesn't happen with me, ok.? You might achieve more by choosing an effective time rather than interrupting her at work, and bringing some ideas to the table. If she doesn't agree and doesn't find there to be a problem, then it's up to you to solve the problem you are experiencing.

I feel for you. My H got into a mindset that I was the kid-person and he was not, and now that we are apart he is simply pelting me with complaints any time he notices them, whether I'm at work, pushing a grocery cart, working on my laptop in the kitchen, whenever. It's inconsiderate, frustrating, and ineffective. And I tend to respond with I don't agree, what are you doing in my house, and I can't possibly do anything about that right now. Not my best parental thinking.

[wolverine1997]

Excellent insight and good thoughts, thanks. Here in MI we have recently passed new laws regarding autism training and programs being provided by the insurance companies. I am currently working with my insurance provider to get him additional training. But it is a slow process.

And you are right, I probably should not call her at work. I never really thought much about how she might feel getting this call at work. Just trying to let her know when it happens. But in the future I'll wait to she gets home to talk about it. Good point, thanks.

One thought that I have is that this my be an alpha dog thing. He is 14 years old and starting to get a little hair on his face. He may be starting to "go into must" as they call it on the animal shows. And with me being the male of the house, he may be starting to challenge for some authority. He also does some of these things with his sister but I think that may be due to him viewing her as a peer and not an authority figure. But it also could be that he acts this way with my daughter and me because we don't give in to or cater to him like his mom does. In my opinion she babies him waaaaaaay too much. So he probably gets less upset when he is with her because he gets his way more with her. She would never admit to this though.

But on a good note, we went to the movies as a family last night. She didn't talk to me much but we all went. Now we are about to go shopping together. I will let you all know how things went when we get back.

[adinva]

I think it makes a lot of sense that at his age he's getting a bit more challenging to you as his male parent. And you probably do have a point about mom catering to him more; based on her comment that you should have let him keep touching your hand in order to avoid him escalating. But moms parent differently from dads generally. You're not likely to get her to agree her way is wrong. You just need to deal effectively with the situation you are experiencing firsthand. Judging her for how she is when she's with him isn't going to help you much.