Although her affair ended pretty quickly (after just about 3 months), it took a couple of years of hard work at reconciliation before our marriage was back on solid ground. Today I'm happy to report that it's very strong, and we have since celebrated our 25th wedding anniversary and the birth of our first granddaughter. This site -- and the people I met here who helped me -- saved my life . . . AND my marriage.
That is great to hear and gives me some hope going forward. My W was my high school sweet heart and after almost 30 years of marriage, I am going to fight and will certainly need and take all the help I can get.
Starsky, That is good to hear and gives me some hope after a very gloomy three months. Actually, the last 6 weeks after reading Michele made me feel better about myself and who I am.
I need all the help I can get and everyone's comments have been very helpul including your links!
I think the world of Retrouvaille, and got a lot out of it myself. But unless they've changed their rules, they don't accept couples where there is still an active affair going on.
And NO, you should NOT be paying for her personal trainer! That (cutting off $$$ for anything that enables her affair) needs to be #1 on your list, but -- as we are both saying above -- that list is NOT to be executed until you've got the whole plan fleshed out and you discuss it here (if you think we can help). It was several weeks before I gave my wife the "I have decided that I will no longer pay for you to conduct your affair" letter, which included completely firewalling our finances (having my paycheck directly deposited into a new account that she didn't have access to), and after meeting with a good family law attorney for a free consult to better understand my rights and responsibilities.
Is it wrong for me to stop paying for this trainer? That isn't a boundary and more of an action she will resent. This is a hard one but I do not see any other option.
I'd like you to start thinking about these types of things in a new way. Instead of asking "How will she respond if I do 'X'? Will she be angry? Livid?? How will her reaction make ME feel?"
and replace it with
"What is THE RIGHT THING TO DO in this situation? What is the thing that God Himself would have me do, if He were standing right in front of me?"
And then steel yourself for any blowback from your wife (and you will get it -- in spades -- on some of this stuff, at least initially) and rest in the fact that you know you did The Right Thing.
If you go by that standard, your decision becomes very simple (not easy, but simple): Why on earth would you PAY for her to meet with her affair partner?
I'll try to find a copy of it, but if you search back on my old links to June of 2007, I think that's when I gave my wife the financial "I have decided that I will no longer pay for you to conduct your affair" letter. I stopped paying for her tummy tuck payments, lingerie, hair coloring (still paid for basic cuts) -- ANYTHING she was doing to make herself more attractive for someone other than her husband.
You need to do this very calmly, and not from a place of spite or punishment, but rather from a place of "Why would I use family finances to help you conduct an affair that could destroy our family?"
I don't see how E can do this without also confronting. I mean, is he going to suggest they "now see a new trainer" he's heard is better? I guess it's possible.
All I mean here is that if you think of making ONE step and it's cutting off the trainer money, It will lead elsewhere in the conversation.
IMO, and I believe in Starsky's, It's part of the whole confrontation thing. (And fwiw, I'm NOT a fan of involving others. I think it makes it much much harder for a wayward spouse to return. Keep others out of your marriage problems for now, b/c like you said, you want to keep the road home, paved and smooth.)
Meanwhile, as Starsky suggested --what can YOU work on, or learn from this before/While you go off and figure out how to set the boundaries?
(Also, I'm going to assume this behavior is out of character for your wife, correct?)
So that means to me, she'll have to believe that marriage to you can be better/different than before
OR she won't return to it.
It's what she left, for an affair with a... trainer.
So while you make your plans for financial protection and (I'd strongly suggest a coaching session with a DB coach as They're excellent for boundary setting) you ALSO work on some changes in you.
So your w can be told that "from this day forward", things in the m will be better.
She'll have to meet some transparency rules the DB coach can assist you with, but you will also need to show your w that you will/Can work to get past this. That you won't hold it over her head forever, or throw it in her face everytime you have a fight.
Also, do you think it's possible your w felt attractive to the trainer in a way she does not feel with you? I'm NOT BLAMING you, I just want to give you something to work on.
My guess, and that's all it is at this point, is that you want her to have a trainer b/c... her body needs work? She thinks so or you thinks so or both? Could she have interpreted that to mean you are not as attracted to her?
Next...
SOME WASs won't come home, if they think the LBS won't ever get past this.
Sometimes they're right, (b/c some LBSers won't ever let it go or want to make it so hard for the WAS to return it's virtually impossible)
but the saddest times to me, are when they're wrong. The LBSer reacted in pain, and at the time believed that punishing or kicking out a spouse in an affair "forever!", was the "Right" thing to do.
Later, the LBSer realizes maybe they could have gotten past it, maybe the WAS would have tried hard enough to restore trust, if they had believed forgiveness was possible.
The worst choice possible, in MY opinion, (based on what I saw growing up w/my neighbors), is a couple who stays married AND stays miserable...punishing, making snide remarks, giving looks that could kill, NEVER getting past it, ETC. You get the picture.
IF you believe this affair is possibly something you can get past, then there's hope. But you will need to act with your head and not your pain. You will need support to manage your emotions.
See a lawyer, make an appointment with a DB coach, and go from there.
As for Retrovaille's "no other person" approach, it's true but it's handled discreetly. They speak privately with each person BEFORE the weekend. They ask for commitments from each and then Each person is asked to rid themself of any 3rd person "in" the marriage. At our workshop, two couples had "quite recently" given up affairs.
My take on it then, was that the cheating spouses were not "madly in love" with their OPs, and also wanted to 'check off' Retrovaille on their list to show that they had "tried everything" to make the marriage work. They did not expect much to happen at the weekend retreat.
I had low hopes for them but for awhile both couples tried harder, and one of those two couples did make it. (Well, all I know is that 4 years later, they still come to our follow ups).
There were 25 couples at our Retrovaille and my estimate is that 8 were actively pursuing divorce when they attended, and another 10 were seriously considering it. I mean, it's FOR marriages in trouble. It's not a "marriage encounter".
At our last session, 4 years after our "weekend jumpstart", I think 20 couples are still married. (Maybe 19) But Considering where we were when we attended it, that's a darn good statistic.
The personal growth workshop I attended and now do "team" for, is the one called EE. A tenet of EE (="Essential Experience") is that "Breaking agreements always causes damage. If you must or you do break an agreement
(this includes things like missing your d's dance recital, for instance, not always breaking a m vow) then you ACKNOWLEDGE the damage caused, AND you do your best to minimize it. Obviously it's bigger damage when it's a vow.
You can go to a workshop alone, and learn boundaries and healing, or she can, and she can gain clarity too. You both can. If you attend one separately, it can benefit b/c you'd be less inhibited talking than if your spouse attends.
I went long ago, on my own. My h was not "into" workshops. And I had reasons unrelated to my m for going. But darn if I didn't become a better wife and mother for going.
The changes my h saw in me, caused HIM to go a few months later on his own. He's not the type to do a "workshop" either, trust me. But he got a lot out of it and later on, we went together and did team.
(Navyguy, AutumnLeaves, INshock and Power of Now have also gone to EE. Last week I did team and met PON in person. It's heartwarming to see a man work so hard on his marriage. It's a good lesson to learn that HE has his own painful childhood stories & his own stuff he overcame to become the man he is today. A lot of renewed confidence and self respect comes out of EE and that always helps a marriage that needs boundaries...anyhow, all I'll say about EE now is that my h and I did team, and that brought us very close, closer than anything else in our 31 year marriage. It's very consistent with DBing.
I sense you want a truly deep connection with your wife. Do you believe you ever had one together, even temporarily?
If so, that's more hopeful, b/c you'd be talking about you two getting back on track to where you once were,
rather than asking her to imagine a marriage you've never had. IF you've never had a deep connection with your wife, figure out why.
So you need to dig deep, figure out what you want, & need, and how best to attain it.
Then get yourself a PLAN.
Make sense?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I don't see how E can do this without also confronting. I mean, is he going to suggest they "now see a new trainer" he's heard is better? I guess it's possible.
No, I said he SHOULD (and needs to) confront, but ONLY after he's put together a PLAN.
Starsky, I am going to reply to each of your post individually. I agree, there is no reason for me to continue to pay for her trainer, her tanning and her gym membership.
