Here we go loopty loo. Here we go loopty li.

[albamarie]

The MLCr has to figure it out for themselves. They may not. They might and never tell you. There are other options, but the point is letting them do it. On their own without your interference. You will get mad, angry, sad, etc as you go through this. There is no timeline. It's maddening. It's crazy. It's topsy-turvy. But it will continue on, until one of you end's it.

Funny how just when you think your strong, and you can handle anything they bring your way, you realize how easily you can be rocked! Letting them do it for themselves is maddening!

Where do we find the strength to keep going in the face of "letting them do it for themselves"? THis is definitely something to think about!

[AJM]

Where do we find the strength to keep going in the face of "letting them do it for themselves"?

By making a choice and sticking to it. I think your tag line says it all "Every day's a new day, don't quit before the miracle!"

AJ

[Raine]

Really good stuff AJ. Something T^2 said to me awhile back that has stuck in my mind constantly and what I said to H when he said i would never be able to forgive him is this:

"You can't determine for me what I can and can't forgive. I have been forgiving you all along this journey and I can't take that forgiveness back, because that forgiveness is for my sake." That convo was the first and only time he mentioned D since separation.

The story of Jonah has taught me something extremely valuable when it comes to forgiveness. All of us have sinned and none of us deserve forgiveness. It is a gift. I have no right to judge someone else's sins as greater than mine, or that I am somehow more worthy of forgiveness, because I have sinned differently. I want to be forgiven for my sins, shouldn't I then be willing to forgive? "Should not I spare Nineveh?" God forgives people who don't deserve forgiveness. We are all equally undeserving of mercy.

Having a spirit of forgiveness and compassion towards H has been keeping me strong. I think I would completely crumble if I wasn't trying my best to be understanding and trying not to focus on how I have been wronged. This experience has made me more compassionate not only towards him, but others. I don't know if I will ever have a relationship with H again, but I feel like I am being put through the fire, and I'm becoming a better person for it.

[Mtnman]

Thank you for those words. I continuously remind myself that I am required to love my wife as Christ loves the church (Ephesians 5:25). Lord knows it isn't always easy.

[reachingHigher]

Hi Raine,

I came across a great quote the other day on the piecing forum from 25 and I thought this would be a good place to share it in this discussion:

You know, It's NOT all about staying married...

This process, this thing we call 'growth through pain' and Div Busting, is about the hard, brave, scary work of digging deep within ourselves, when we are hurt most.

It's about forgiving way more than we ever thought we could,
recommitting more than we ever thought we would,
choosing to love more than we ever thought we SHOULD...
and growing into our best selves - b/c we were forged like steel,

forged steel is forged into one of the strongest of metals, in heat and cold. Like that metal, we are forged by the heat of hot tempers, washed in the cold "water" of a detached distanced spouse's treatment... we survive, we thrive.

Thinking of you today,
Hugs,
rH

[Raine]

rH you're the best. You really know how to build a person up. I'm so impressed with how long you've held in there and the patience you have. It's not easy and you have been through so much. I really admire you and I'm learning a lot from you.

Journaling:
So past few days have been a little weird for me, but holding it together. Okay holding it together when I'm not alone.

H came over to play games with the boys yesterday. Asked me if I wanted to play too, but I said I was feeling light headed and was going to take a break. I really was, but I'm also trying really hard not to do things with him either. I feel used. Him getting to spend time with me, then spends the rest of his time being single.

Friends of ours asked me if H and I could hang out last night. I let them know I'd rather not hang out with H right now, but it would be great if he did a guys night with H. He contacted H and they went back and forth. H didn't go out with them. He went over to OW.

Tonight H calls to wish S now 2 HB. I'm heading out the door to go to same friends for dinner. When I take the phone to let him know we are just heading out to friends, H sounds super down. I can barely understand him. He kept hemming and hawing and I said, do you want to come with? I felt bad and it was S's bday after all. He said yes.

He showed up, and like always, it's just like old times. One thing I noticed this time was he was really watching my reaction to him, his stories and jokes. I hadn't noticed him doing that before. It came up about him not going out last night, and he made some excuses, that he had already had dinner, and if they had just started planning earlier. I'm guessing he did set something up with OW last minute and didn't want to back out.

At one point it was just me, H, and other guy and H made a total sexual reference about me. I can't believe how embarrassed and uncomfortable I felt. Shocked to say the least.

It got super late and I needed to get the kids home to bed. I got them all in the car myself. The only one desperate to help me was other guy. H did have some interactions with the kids, but not much. He let me handle it all.

I decided to go ahead and play games with him on the phone. I know he feels like he has lost everything. He tells people he is lonely and depressed. I feel like I need to have some kind of light to him, that he doesn't feel like I want nothing to do with him and I hate him. I don't know. Maybe I'm totally wrong in this. I feel bad about ignoring the games. Is that just weird?

In other news, also found out that H is up for anything with any woman, but not interested in any kind of commitment. He is looking for women who want to have some fun, no strings attached. This includes talking about the possibility of a hook up with friend of SIL, but didn't do it, because he was worried she would want more than that. I can't believe he would even talk about it with her. Does he just want things to blow up in his face?

[albamarie]

Raine, this is some really good stuff too! Great read!

[AJM]

Raine, just because you can see things that are going to happen, doesn't mean they will and that others see it. Try to remember that. There is no gain in being right even if you are

AJ

[Raine]

AJ him hooking up with another person? I don't think it matters much anymore. What's throwing me off is it seems like he wants to get caught by others. I'm sure my reactions to him the past 3 months have thrown him off too. Right or wrong, it's all ugly.

[TSquared2]

There is a theory that they do sometimes indeed want to get caught, to have someone else "make" them change, because they can't do it themselves, at least easily, OR to prove how "bad" they are and should be tossed aside so they can continue their self-destruction....this is where the patience from us is required, to NOT be the one to force them, but to let them figure it out, and do the hard work, themselves...man, it is difficult, yes?

Having a spirit of forgiveness and compassion towards H has been keeping me strong. I think I would completely crumble if I wasn't trying my best to be understanding and trying not to focus on how I have been wronged. This experience has made me more compassionate not only towards him, but others. I don't know if I will ever have a relationship with H again, but I feel like I am being put through the fire, and I'm becoming a better person for it.

Do remember this ^^^^, always...you are a gem.


T^2