At the end of that thread, I got many good pieces of advice that i would really like to address. Please read my next post.
I answered you on your old thread. Please see it b/c it's a long reply and I don't feel like reposting.
But that's what I get for seeing a post on your thread that screamed for a direct response and then reading the rest of the thread!
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Oh one more thing I forgot to mention. Wife told me, and her mom, that she thought I should be giving her money because she still cleans the house and cooks and cleans. =)
Like paying for a maid service? If she mentions that again I am going to tell her that she does those things because she wants to and feels obligated to do for our marital home to be guy for D3. Like I provide a roof over W head, and food for her to eat, etc because she us the mother of my child. But you don't clean for affair money. How would you guys word this argument?
SM--I have some random comments...but If what I say conflicts with what your DB coach Laurie says, then by all means follow HER advice but here are my views and they are mostly taught from Vernetta, my former DB coach (a Godsend if ever there was one)...
On a DB site, we ought to go by what the trained DB coaches advise. Yes we have OUR experiences and we may have saved our m's, or saved ourselves or both, but the DB coaches have had the benefit of seeing/helping MANY save their m's ---
1) Per my coach, (who taught me many things I had to digest b/c they were not intuitively obvious to me) LIFE "teaches the WAS the lessons" their choices provide. Life shows them the consequences. It's NOT a spouse's job to do that. (That's punitive behavior looking for an excuse).
So I strongly suggest you stop all that mind game stuff you seem to be entertaining & mixing up with the MB sites..but besides
2) in YOUR situation, which is an extreme one, there's not much danger of YOU "teaching her a lesson".
SM, You enable more than anyone I've seen here I think. You certainly make the top 5...and that's saying something. You must stop it, first for YOU and second, for the m, if there is a chance of saving it.
3) you need do nothing about what your wife tells HER mother.
She has said nothing to YOU...and may not ever ask you. So all this mind reading and worrying & prepping may be for nothing. I say- Let HER come to you and ask for a paycheck so she & OM (you know, the guy getting the SECOND job so he can take care of her - but still needs your gas money...)
can see each other to have sex again... Then charge her rent for room & board...
and then when she's stunned by this, you say "Wow, w. You are not the woman I married..." and then start acting like that is true, b/c it is.
Also, her conversations with another "male friend" about his & his wife's sex life, was wildly inappropriate. He "vented" to her.
Then she shared intimate details with him about your sex life. They did some comparisons...(I think they were both complaining about their inadequate satisfaction levels). How does that feel to you?
What do you think their goal is with those "chats"? You think this "male friend" was really asking for advice? Your comment about her telling him that "mc might have saved" your m, was a sign of her believing it was/is salvageable, made me sad.
To me it read More like "it's too late now" but see, mind reading gets us nowhere b/c it's got too many sides to it. Don't bother with it.
I thought Another Stander raised some good points about your attitude towards her (maybe the show was a good thing?) but you need to make sure you balance it with SOME boundary. "No talking about OM in your presence" is not much of one when you pay for her to go sleep with him...
on another note, and without discussing OM for a minute, why is it so hard for you to compliment your w?
You said you'd "try" to compliment her ONCE a week and now you say you'll compliment her "within reason"? WTH?
Why is this hard for you (aside from OM)? You think You can't do it without pursuing her? Yes you can... I gave you examples on the other thread.
This behavior of with holding positive feedback was a complaint of hers and from your comments I can see there was validity to it.
Compliments seem like a real effort for you and that's too bad. They don't cost a thing and they mean a lot to the recipient.
One of her LLs was words of affirmation and you say it was also one of yours, so there is a disconnect there. You have a double standard b/c you felt justified in not expressing the same sexual desire for her, and you blamed HER for not complimenting you enough when your business was not doing well...
I have to think that when you didn't "agree" with her needs, you didn't meet them....b/c you saw her as "wrong" for having them.
I'd hope you change that soon, especially w/your D. See compliments as expressions of compassion or love. Not "rewards".
Good luck deciphering all this. Whatever approach you take, stick with it long enough to really give it a shot. THEN monitor. (That's Not a weekly thing...)
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
25, you have many great points as usual. Let digest them until later today and then write a response. These points are very important to expand on because they will make or break the recovery effort. Laurie had advice that is VERY counter to what is given on this board, and my next post will contain all the details so that we can all try to expand on what she recommended.
As far as the comment that W made about marriage counseling saving our marriage, yes it makes me very sad and angry. Her mother is also very frustrated about this because W has said it numerous times to MIL too.
She has told me twice, her mom more than twice, and a married friend of ours on FB and her childhood best friend (big marriage advocate) the same thing. This is the exact word for word of what she had told me and everyone else :
"if we had gone to counseling even a week or two before I started talking to OM, I am sure I would have been more than happy in our M and none of this would have happened."
In other conversations she has said now that OM got into her mind, (and heart) she is confused and thinks she cannot pass up the chance at what seems to her like a relationship that would not require counseling.
Laurie believes my W had no intention of leaving our M and had not been planning an exit. She was simply pursued and complimented on her looks in a time of disconnected between us. The affair chemistry was too much for her to control. Those are laurie's words... But watch for my next post about the details of the one hour convo.
Me, H-34 now 38 W-32 now 35 T-13 now 18 years M-6 now 9 Daughter 3 years now 7 Bomb 11/27/12 - OM 1 year in house separation Reconciliation 12/2013. Healed now 2017
"She was simply pursued and complimented on her looks in a time of disconnected between us. "
That is true to a certain degree. But you detailed here exactly what you did to push her away. That is a big issue that needed to be addressed. Has your DB coach read any of your posts?
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
I haven't had a chance today to write the post that explains all that was said during the phone session. But yes guy are right there were things in our M that definerely needed to be addressed. And W was certainly not happy or it would have taken a date drug to get her interested...for 14 hears she has been happy and fulfilled with being married to the only man she has known.
The thing laurie was noting is that W really had no exit plan so doesn't seem like divorce was actually an option for her prior to OM. Also, W is not displaying the typical anger that is usual when waw finally make an exit after a.long.period of planning. Also the fact that she admits counseling would have solved it, at least for the time being, shows she didn't see it as a hopeless cause. Typical waw definitely feel hopeless.
She chatted with the guy for 9 days and dropped the.gov. I have a screen shot of the first fb message that set this off! The guy said 'love to the miss in blue' on one of her pics. He referred to her as miss not mrs and completely disregarded that she was married, but also I think he made her wonder a little by those choice.of.words.
Then as soon as she confided in him that she needs sex more than once or twice a week, he launches into how he is an animal and it has been 4 months for him. Follows it up with pics of his penis. That was all it took to set off a EA with no prior planning, no thinking, no.plan, no income, nowhere to stay, etc etc..
There have bean several signs that W is at the minimum beginning to.see that.either OM is not who she thought, or that their R is waning. I will explain in my detailed.post soon.
Me, H-34 now 38 W-32 now 35 T-13 now 18 years M-6 now 9 Daughter 3 years now 7 Bomb 11/27/12 - OM 1 year in house separation Reconciliation 12/2013. Healed now 2017
Also I have been 'brutally honest' with laurie, as 25 advised me to be a long time ago. There is no point in with holding.information or misconstruing events. I paid good money for good advice and I know there has to be the honest truth.
As nochi as laurie was telling me things I was glad to hear, I questioned them several times. I.told her some folks on the board are questioning my sanity when I say certain things, and definitely when I suggest there may already be a.small change of.heart showing through from W.
Laurie says it is only when the relationship was caused by temporary laos of judgment that she sees positives so quickly. She said don't go and throw a R party or anything, but she.thinks it is turning now towards me.
Again I will explain in.jpeg detail soon. W is here and I.look suspect typing away on my phone. She said W is still probably weighing her.options.but seems to be back tracking.a little. And not to.expect any admissions of error..time soon. She will likely not give me the satisfaction of being able to say 'I told you so' about her failed relationship with the loser I knew him to be.
Gotta go. Most likely the detailed.post will be tomorrow morning I write down.everything we said, so I just need to organize it into a more readable text.
Me, H-34 now 38 W-32 now 35 T-13 now 18 years M-6 now 9 Daughter 3 years now 7 Bomb 11/27/12 - OM 1 year in house separation Reconciliation 12/2013. Healed now 2017
whatever happens, if she even looks your way OR wants to come home, or iF you ever reconcile-- do NOT ever say "I told you so" to a WAS. Ever.
The most loving thing to say at times, is NOTHING.
Trust me on that and if you don't, ask Laurie how "smart" or "right" that would be of you to say.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Mr bond I meant waw feel hopeless in their marriages and so if we assume W thought/thinks counseling would fix it, she can't have felt hopeless about the M enough to be planning an exist.
It's all deducing at this point. I still have to work at an actual R effort from W. If she broke down and said it was all a big mistake I would never say I told you so. I live her and just knowing she knew it was a big mistake on her behalf would be sufficient.
To early still. Much work and waiting is yet to come... But happy laurie agrees things are positive for me at this point. Details coming tomorrow morning.
Me, H-34 now 38 W-32 now 35 T-13 now 18 years M-6 now 9 Daughter 3 years now 7 Bomb 11/27/12 - OM 1 year in house separation Reconciliation 12/2013. Healed now 2017
Am I the only one here thi king she is putting kind of a sad excuse to her affair?
You missed the boat by a week in for counseling else everything would be different?! There must have been a butt load of other things going on if one week was the deal breaker between saving her marriage with the father of her child and some OM who " wooed her". And she just couldn't resist.
Something is very fishy to me.
I by no means mean to challenge a DB coach, but do they think it's ok to let a cheating spouse cake eat with no boundaries as long as they see the WAW give some positive attention to the LBS? let an affair carry on the way it does, and then she comes home to you and you act like a sexless husband and wife?
What does Laurie think about that one? I'm curious.
No, you're not the only one, gm23. I was thinking the exact same thing.
Perhaps I shouldn't say this, but I just don't think the DB approach is sufficient in cases of blatant, unrepentant infidelity. Other skills and techniques need to be brought to the table, to be used in conjunction with it. I'm sure that response will elicit criticism from the usual suspects, but it was my experience in my own sitch and also what I've observed on here studying literally thousands of affairs.
