Moving Forward

[BC39]

Could use some help with communication today.

Before I start, things have been going VERY well lately.

We had another disagreement over her yelling at our kids. Last night our S4 was complaining about his dinner W made him so W was getting frustrated (understandably so). He started to complain about something else and W started to YELL. As she started I calmly but assertively said "okay, okay", trying to calm the situation. Those were the only 2 words that came out of my mouth. W got upset, left us at the dinner table and went upstairs. (I understand when she gets upset over me "taking sides" in front of the kids, but I feel like I didn't do that here. I'm sure she would disagree.) After she came back down she was quiet and she was like that for the rest of the night. We didn't talk about it.

It REALLY bothers me when she screams at our kids. It's embarrassing. She goes from zero to livid in the blink of an eye. W freely admits I have much more patience with our kids than she does (I would never point this out or use it against her). We have excellent kids. Our son can be whiny and bratty at times but he's 4 years old. W ADORES our kids, but her patience with them, at times, is a big problem.

Were now at work together and she's obviously still upset. She just came into my office to show me a cool commercial she just saw that featured a car similar to the one we own. At the end I said "cool commercial, the cars pretty much the same as ours". She said "ya, thanks" sarcastically and walked out. I was confused so I went to talk to her. I said "I don't understand why you just got upset, I just mentioned the car was similar to ours". She said she took it as me saying "ya so what, the car is similar to ours" then pointed out it was 2 years newer. I was so obviously confused that I went to go shut her office door so I could talk to her. Before I could shut it she said "I don't need another lecture". I shut the door and asked her what was wrong. She said she's just in a bad mood. I asked her if she wanted to talk about it but she said no, so I told her if/when she wanted to to let me know, and I left it at that.

Her behavior has admittedly made me VERY uneasy inside although I'm trying not to show it.

I'm terrible at writing my thoughts and explaining circumstances so I hope I'm painting the appropriate picture here.

Thoughts would be appreciated...

[scaredsilly]

I think you just expressed yourself very well. I can see how she thought your comments to her when she was yelling at your S could be taken as you overruling her and shaming her in front of the kids.

That being said, I think you and your kids have a right not to be yelled at. It makes people uncomfortable and/ or scared, especially, kids.

It might help if you let her know how her yelling makes you FEEL. She may not understand the true effect it has on you. She may not understand what your fears are about the effects her yelling and impatience may have on the mental health of your children.

Sometimes it's easier to say these things in writing so you can make sure there's no blaming. I think you write well.

[BC39]

Thanks SS, I appreciate your feedback

"Filling their love bank" and "speaking their love language," while there is OM/OW contact, is "pursuing." When you're piecing, it's REQUIRED, and you gotta have the patience of Job with it. That's just one example -- there are many, many more.

I've read many of your past posts, your opinion is greatly valued, thanks for getting back to me.

"That's just one example -- there are many, many more" If you ever get the time I'd really like to know what these are. There are days when I wish I had a Piecing blueprint to work from

[BC39]

Think about boundaries like this:

Boundaries are not about controlling the other person, because boundaries are about drawing "circles" around *you* and determining what you will and won't allow inside that circle.

Your WxH can do whatever he wants OUTSIDE that circle. You are not telling him what to do.

But you will only let into that circle people who treat you with respect.

He's free to go on treating you with disrespect, but you won't know about it because he'll be outside your circle. He's free to go on and draw his own boundaries of no expectations and no responsibilities, outside your circle.

He can do WHATEVER he wants. He's a free person, free to make WHATEVER choices he wants.

BUT SO ARE YOU, and you are free to choose who to allow within your circle.

That's all. Not about trying to control him at all. Tell him he's totally free. He has the WHOLE WORLD, outside your circle, to go and do whatever he wants.

If he's saying you have to let him into your circle no matter what, then THAT is about HIM controlling YOU.

Brilliant

[BC39]

Many triggers lately. They get me spiraling into negative thoughts.

Just to name a couple:
What if W is still in communication with OM (she promised 4 months ago that all contact would be cut and we set up a transparency plan)and what would I do if I found out she was? Does she still feel the same now as she did 4 months ago when she said she was in this marriage 100%?

I think a lot of negative thinking stems from the fact that we haven't had a R talk since our Piecing really got started 4 months ago. Her actions are there but I feel like I need to be verbally reassured. I just don't know what she's thinking. However I don't want to bring it up in case I hear things I don't want to hear and I don't want to put any added pressure on her. If I had some sense of security I feel I wouldn't be as hypersensitive to her moods and my perceptions of her actions as I can still be at times.

In a perfect world I want her to come to me and tell me how happy she is now etc etc

I mentioned in a previous post that you could walk into my house at any given time in the last 4 months and you wouldn't even know we've had any problems. Its fantastic compared to after BD but it scares me at the same time.

Being insecure is a new thing for me. I know tomorrow is promised to no one, but it doesn't stop me from still wanting it. scaredsilly recently said she missed when her and her H took each other for granted, in a good way. I agree.

[Starsky309]

Thanks SS, I appreciate your feedback

"Filling their love bank" and "speaking their love language," while there is OM/OW contact, is "pursuing." When you're piecing, it's REQUIRED, and you gotta have the patience of Job with it. That's just one example -- there are many, many more.

I've read many of your past posts, your opinion is greatly valued, thanks for getting back to me.

"That's just one example -- there are many, many more" If you ever get the time I'd really like to know what these are. There are days when I wish I had a Piecing blueprint to work from

Any of the things suggested in The Love Dare (from the movie "Fireproof") would be more examples.

DBing requires you to use the "push/pull" dynamic, whereby if you pursue them, they will feel smothered and FLEE from you. It's also big-time enabling if you do it while they're rubbing your face in an affair, too.

However, once any infidelity has ended, no-contact is established and both spouses agree to work on reconciliation ("piecing"), many of these things are needed in order to build love back into the marriage. Betrayed (and left-behind) spouses always want to do these things while their spouse is RUNNING from them, and I have to encourage them by saying "There will be plenty of time for this . . . LATER."


Starsky

[Starsky309]

Many triggers lately. They get me spiraling into negative thoughts.

Just to name a couple:
What if W is still in communication with OM (she promised 4 months ago that all contact would be cut and we set up a transparency plan)and what would I do if I found out she was? Does she still feel the same now as she did 4 months ago when she said she was in this marriage 100%?

I'm confused, Cor -- is this hypothetical? She HAS agreed to no-contact, and you DO have a transparency plan in place . . . and this is just your brain running away on you?

I always encourage a THOROUGH transparency plan, with good intel at least one channel of which is NOT known by the formerly-cheating spouse. This gives you, the formerly betrayed spouse, the peace of mind necessary to quell your own doubts and begin to heal, and to begin reaching out to your wife again without fear.

Please tell me more about your no-contact (did she send OM a no-contact letter? Did you see it/deliver it?) And what is all included in your transparency plan, and what is your method for verifying no-contact?

Here's the thing: it's a physiological fact that people in affairs have their brains washed in PEAs (endorphines), and it's HIGHLY addictive. There is an actual chemical WITHDRAWAL phase they have to go thru (hard withdrawal usually takes 1-3 weeks, depending on the length an depth of the affair, and total withdrawal can take from 6-24 months). And the kicker?? ANY contact with their OM/OW . . . even NEGATIVE contact (say, talking krap about them with a girlfriend, or leaving the guy nasty notes on his FB page) . . . has the exact same effect on the brain, and that is to basically "re-set the withdrawal clock" to 0:00:00 again.

If she's still in contact with him, it's going to kill her desire to piece with you. If, however, it's just triggers and your own imagination, then more patience and grace is required on your part.

Starsky

[BC39]

Any of the things suggested in The Love Dare (from the movie "Fireproof") would be more examples.

Thanks, I will check that out.

I'm confused, Cor -- is this hypothetical? She HAS agreed to no-contact, and you DO have a transparency plan in place . . .

Yes, she agreed to no contact, we do have a transparency plan.

and this is just your brain running away on you?

Yes

I always encourage a THOROUGH transparency plan, with good intel at least one channel of which is NOT known by the formerly-cheating spouse. This gives you, the formerly betrayed spouse, the peace of mind necessary to quell your own doubts and begin to heal, and to begin reaching out to your wife again without fear.

We did agree on transparency. We are also together 98% of the time (we work together). I don't have a channel she doesn't know about-I'm not sure what I could do there.

Please tell me more about your no-contact (did she send OM a no-contact letter? Did you see it/deliver it?) And what is all included in your transparency plan, and what is your method for verifying no-contact?

She agreed to never speak to him again. She offered to send him a letter, I told her not to bother as long as she agreed to never contact him again. She also said she would tell me if he contacted her.
I don't have a method of verifying no contact. I have her email passwords and access to her phone, but is there really any way of verifying these days? She could set up a new web based email account in seconds that I would never know about.

Here's the thing: it's a physiological fact that people in affairs have their brains washed in PEAs (endorphines), and it's HIGHLY addictive. There is an actual chemical WITHDRAWAL phase they have to go thru (hard withdrawal usually takes 1-3 weeks, depending on the length an depth of the affair, and total withdrawal can take from 6-24 months). And the kicker?? ANY contact with their OM/OW . . . even NEGATIVE contact (say, talking krap about them with a girlfriend, or leaving the guy nasty notes on his FB page) . . . has the exact same effect on the brain, and that is to basically "re-set the withdrawal clock" to 0:00:00 again.

If she's still in contact with him, it's going to kill her desire to piece with you. If, however, it's just triggers and your own imagination, then more patience and grace is required on your part.

I understand completely. Again, this thought of her still being in contact with him is purely hypothetical and my mind running away on me, as you said.

What's your thoughts on having no R talk since we "really" started piecing 4 months ago, at the beginning of October? (Note: We actually started piecing in June, but I found out 4 months ago at the beginning of October that she still called him from time to time. When I found this out I told her I needed to step back from the M. Its at this point that she had an "awakening" and said she was fully committed to our M, I set boundaries and transparency etc) There's more details on my original thread). I feel because we haven't talked about R I'm coming up with my own conclusions on what she may or may not be thinking/feeling now compared to 4 months ago.

[BC39]

Quick update for me as I'm still on hear frequently but never really know what to say.

Things have still been very good with us

Last night W started to talk about my anxiety/panic disorder. (It has come back recently. Its been close to a year that I haven't had it).

W asked if she thought that "because our relationship is now back to being okay, do you think that's why it has come back?" (during our sitch MC asked me why she thought the anxiety had gone away-I told her the only thing I figure out was that I just had more important things to worry about).

This is the first time in 5 months (since W said she was committed 100% to M) that our R has come up in conversation.

I told her that I'd thought of reasons why it may have come back but just wasn't sure, and left it at that. I thought of using her question as an opening to talk further about our R but I didn't.

[BC39]

Had to change my name for privacy reasons.

Still on here daily but haven't updated my sitch. Always seem to have a hard time explaining things, so I figured I'd just start typing and see where it takes me...this may be all over the place so I apologize ahead of time.
All in all things have been going really well. In fact if you told me when our sitch/BD started in May that we'd be where we are now, I never would have believed it. I am so grateful to have another chance with the love of my life.
Saying that, I still struggle a lot. Not knowing what the future holds is something I have a hard time dealing with. We still haven't had a R talk since October. (We started piecing in June, but I found out in October that she still had "just friendly" contact with OM. When I found out I basically dropped the rope and she instantly had a change of heart and said she was committed to our M 100% . She wrote me a letter you can see in my first thread).
Although all her actions point to her still feeling the same way she felt when she wrote the letter, its been 6 months since then and I still feel like I want her to tell me. To confirm her actions.
I been tempted just to ask her but I guess I'm scared. I'm scared she told me everything I wanted to hear in the heat of the moment of me dropping the rope and that she may still not feel that way and just isnt telling me.
She told me so many hurtful things during BD in May (ILYBINILWY, hadn't been attracted to me in a long time, had 1 foot out the door, etc) and it still makes me second guess everything.
Although it has slowly seemed to get better, the trust still isn't 100% back. I've checked the phone bills a couple times over the last couple months and as soon as I open them up my stomach starts to go in knots.
I know all of this stuff is going to take time, but I'd be lying if I didn't say thoughts of my M don't consume much of my thoughts.
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Last week, for the first time in a long time, our sitch kind of came up. W came to me in the morning sobbing after she dropped the kids of at school. She said she saw our family friend that originally exposed her A. (Side note: This family friend saw her kissing OM in his car at the kids school, she then called to tell my sister and my brother. My brother then called my W to tell her she needed to tell me or he would. That started the ball rolling on sitch).
So when W saw this friend when she was dropping kids she started thinking about "what if our kids find out what she did". She said she didn't want to talk about it but she just wanted to tell me why she was upset. I validated and told her I'm here if she wants to talk about it.
To be honest it was nice to hear her feelings of guilt. I know that's sounds bad, but she never expressed that much guilt to me and the only time she apologized for A was during MC when she was kind of put on the spot. I was hoping this guilt, or whatever it was, would bring her closer to me, but it didn't really seem to.
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Sex has been pretty limited the last few weeks. Whenever this happens I find the many of the negative thoughts mentioned above ^^^^ building up. She denied many of my advances over this time but I've tried to remain compassionate and understanding. I finally asked her about it last night (after getting rejected again). She said she just hasn't been feeling sexual lately. She believes its from stress related to starting her new business and its potential impact on our finances and us.
I'm obviously understanding to this but I have a hard time wondering if anything else is bothering her. She said there isn't so I have to leave it at that.
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Sorry for the long post. I don't want to seem overly negative, I tend to come on here to vent