When tapestries of life get tangled in the loom.

[adinva]

That sounds harsh, and it is harsh.

But so did I, Bruce, and so did a lot of people here who haven't faced it yet.

We thought being married was forever whether we made that a good thing or a bad thing, and we're outraged that the response we got when it became a bad thing wasn't what we wanted it to be.

You didn't know before, that being negligent and a jerk might give her enough reason to leave you. But you know it now, and so you shouldn't waste anymore time defending your right to have been negligent and a jerk, unless that is what you hope to continue being.

[25yearsmlc]

Bruce,

nothing to add to what's been said. But I hope you take this in.

We do want your son to have both his parents in his life. And I know it's hard for you to live in a country where you don't know many people.

I think if you start to GAL (=Get A Life) you'll find things get a lot easier. Check the Div Remedy books for ideas.

Personally, I got in great shape, saw a T, took language classes & cooking classes,
I joined a writer's club, auditioned for local theater and did stand up comedy,

I took flying lessons, went skydiving (use caution here, b/c of your history) and
I learned to hunt and deep sea fish. Also learned to cross country ski, and even took a pottery class. (I was desparate to GAL but man, I made some life long friends!)

There's more to this list^^ but I think you get the point. Meet new people.

We have not spoken much about your GAL Things but we urge you to start GAL.

I say that b/c I know it works.

Hang in there.

[Big Bruce]

I read and re-read your posts,
They're absolut gold for me.

So, a little bit of background : I wanted the baby because I am a family man at heart. W was not feeling well in her head back in France, young, immature, away from her family, not her language, not her culture, she got depressed mildly. We got the baby, and she dove into it, become so over protective she wouldn't anyone carry him, and barely touch him.

I was kinda glad my W was so commited to taking care of him in a way. I thought it was maternal love, when it was unbalanced obsession.
To the point of rejecting the husband and going back ten years in time, to the security of the home country, at mommy and dad's house, and now trying to sever the marriage knot.

My playing too much sports? In reality I went twice a week in the evening for two hours. That was my negligence.
Her other reproaches? I sincerly try to accuse myself, and search fault on me, but all who I talk to, say that ok I wasn't perfect but it is really minor. I try to convince myself I was the vilain, but darn, if that was being a bad husband, then I don't know anymore.
Maybe her spiel about negligence is not what really bothers her, that's only trying to justify herself.

Anyway, I have two questions :
- What is S supposed to write in the Valentine's card? "I love you mommy"?
- When I pick or drop S up, I get to see W for 5 seconds to 5 minutes (depends). If I act talkative, smiley and nice, it might be considered as pursuing, right? If I am silent and cold, she'll think I'm mad at her, revengeful or something. So, how do I appear?

Bonsoir,
Bruce.

[Soul.Searching]

Act talkative, smile and be nice. Avoid starting any R talk. Don't hang on her every word and try to keep her talking. Talk for a few mins about S and then head off.

[25yearsmlc]

Bruce, I was so disappoointed to read your post and see how little you have truly changed. It's as if you have amnesia, or believe we do.

Now you're playing the victim card, HERE?

You claim to have discussed this with others. And they ALL agree that you were a fine husband. But Bruce, that's not true.

When you come HERE and tell us your story -- you get feedback about YOU NOT being a great husband.


Your w was in a foreign country (which depresses YOU when it's you, but was a mentally imbalanced condition when it's HER)...as usual, you paint HER as a nut case and yourself as a great guy who did "minor negligence"...wow...

You neglected her when the baby was born and left her alone ALL day, with a newborn infant and no help. When you were done at work all day, leaving her at home in a country you admit she didn't speak the language or have friends in.

Never mind the hormone changes (I've mentioned this before)--
Never mind the exhaustion she must have felt caring for a newborn 24/7...(I've mentioned THIS before)

NEVER mind the resentful "immature" h, who showed no interest in your son, OR HER,

but did manage to complain about HIS OWN NEEDS not being met...and you sulked.

Then some nights you went out to do your hobbies, instead of rushing home to help her or check on his progress.

You NEVER changed a diaper. You NEVER put him to sleep or read him a book or took him for a walk

and you never gave her a break..

YOU NEVER did a damn thing until months after she left you.

I cannot believe what I'm reading here. Below, is your version of what happened. Reading it, it's as if you have never posted here...

or read or believed a single word from any of us.

I read and re-read your posts,
They're absolut gold for me.


Really? I doubt that.

Your post here below, is a post written from someone who thinks all of what We've said is WRONG. You are still a victim. That's unbelievable, literally.

You still want to portray HER as being unreasonable/mentally ill and vindictive.

Why not just tell us facts and see what we think? Your spin on things is so extreme at THIS POINT in time, you now lack credibility to me.

Sometimes I think you are not real & you're here trolling...




So, a little bit of background : I wanted the baby because I am a family man at heart. W was not feeling well in her head back in France, young, immature, away from her family, not her language, not her culture, she got depressed mildly.

Even if all this^^ were true, what did YOU you to help her? Well, YOU wanted a baby! Not HER, YOU...There's a helpful suggestion for your wife's happiness...but hey, as long as YOU got what you wanted, all was well, right?

We got the baby, and she dove into it, become so over protective she wouldn't anyone carry him, and barely touch him.

I was kinda glad my W was so commited to taking care of him in a way. I thought it was maternal love,


AND.... she wouldn't bother you so much OR ask anything of You...


when it was unbalanced obsession.

Yeah, a woman with nothing loving in her life but a child, would have to be UNBALANCED to focus on the baby...

To the point of rejecting the husband and going back ten years in time, to the security of the home country, at mommy and dad's house, and now trying to sever the marriage knot.

Considering the reaction I have to this post, I think her choice to leave you and go home to a real family, makes sense.

Your own family was cold to her, but you only mention HER family not attending the wedding in YOUR country.

You see nothing one sided about your marriage or your sense of the world, and what you feel "entitled" to, which is a lot. It amazes me that you're so much older than she is.

Her letter to you was the letter of a mature woman, trying to survive with her baby. She discussed the issues you two had very much like someone who has discussed them many times -- with a man who isn't hearing her.

And now, I don't think you hear me, Bruce. Despite your claim that you read our posts over and over again, your memory is very selective.

THIS post below, shows me that you do not hear me.


My playing too much sports? In reality I went twice a week in the evening for two hours. That was my negligence.
Her other reproaches? I sincerly try to accuse myself, and search fault on me, but all who I talk to, say that ok I wasn't perfect but it is really minor. I try to convince myself I was the vilain, but darn, if that was being a bad husband, then I don't know anymore.
Maybe her spiel about negligence is not what really bothers her, that's only trying to justify herself.

Anyway, I have two questions :
- What is S supposed to write in the Valentine's card? "I love you mommy"?
- When I pick or drop S up, I get to see W for 5 seconds to 5 minutes (depends). If I act talkative, smiley and nice, it might be considered as pursuing, right? If I am silent and cold, she'll think I'm mad at her, revengeful or something. So, how do I appear?

Bonsoir,
Bruce.

[hotwheelsaust]

That sounds harsh, and it is harsh.

But so did I, Bruce, and so did a lot of people here who haven't faced it yet.

We thought being married was forever whether we made that a good thing or a bad thing, and we're outraged that the response we got when it became a bad thing wasn't what we wanted it to be.

You didn't know before, that being negligent and a jerk might give her enough reason to leave you. But you know it now, and so you shouldn't waste anymore time defending your right to have been negligent and a jerk, unless that is what you hope to continue being.

I was certainly with the understanding of the marriage vows as being for better and for worse, but quickly learnt as Adinva says it doesn't cover me for being a negligent jerk to my wife.

[MrBond]

"So, how do I appear?"

How about NOT appearing like a sanctimonious jerk?
25yearsmlc is right. You haven't learned anything. You're still trying to justify your bad behavior.

It's why your W isn't coming back. Why would she want to go back to a jerk?

[Big Bruce]

Well,
It's not that I don't listen to what you say but I speak with other people too, and what they say is literally the opposite of what you guys say to me.
Contradictory messages. I try to tell them I was the vilain, but then my friends prove to me that I really was not.

In fact, I think that yes I carry most of the responsibility, but her reaction for 7 months now is as bad if not worse as my previous behaviour.
I loved life. Now I don't love life anymore, nothing is left.

And my family was very friendly to her. My parents invited us every Sunday after church for the Sunday family meal. And they let us live in the first floor of the house for free for a year.
And one day, after we had our own place, W kicked them out of our house (!)
They are very kind people, and they are now praying that W would change her mind and come back.

Anyway, what am I supposed to write on the Valentine's card?
If I have my S write "Mommy I love you, Bruce" It might be mis-interpreted as me trying to pass a message, and still pursuing...

Another guidance needed : W sometimes ends her emails by "have a nice evening", or "hope you have fun", etc... whereas my emails as instructed by you are very short, one or two sentences max to the point and without any such things as "good bye", and even less "have a good day".
Should I keep sending my "short shaved style" emails, or also respond with "have a nice evening" type of things at the end?

Thank you for your advice.
B

[Crimson]

Your friends are just that - your friends. They are not going to say anything negative to you - especially when you are going through a hard time like this. People here aren't looking to make you feel good about yourself. Rather, they are here to help you save yourself and your marriage.

I know how you feel, Bruce. My pain is still fresh and lingering - but don't say there is nothing left in life. There is. Live your life for your son right now...mine pulled me through the darkest days and gave me more love than I could have asked for.

[25yearsmlc]

Bruce,

Please stop the justifications. They do NOT help you or serve your cause at all.
They prevent you from growing or becoming a truly changed man. I don't sense anything deeply different in you. Yes some superficial gestures and comments but when it comes down to it, you DO see yourself as the wronged party here.


When she says the slightest thing to you, you take offense and portray yourself as a long suffering martyr. Take the hair shirt off. Make some friends.

I'm telling you that your position of being a victim will keep you stuck more than anything else. Take Crimson's advice and dig way way deeper. Be brave.

Your wife's behavior the past 7 months pales in comparison to yours when she had the baby you wanted, in your country and you ignored her and him...

all she has done is leave what she saw as a one sided marriage that had no hope of repair, in the hope of finding family support to help her raise HER son...(b/c she did not believe YOU would be there for him, or her). And you had not been there for them before she left.

Since then, she's seen little interest in him from you, other than your repeated requests for "more time with" him...but until very recently you were not aware or informed about the medications or treatments he gets for his conditions.
There was no reason for her to trust you with him as you had never before had him alone for any length of time NOR had you asked for him overnight and you had not changed a diaper or put him to sleep yet...

You only just asked her about the medical issues, and then you minimized those conditions, to us. It's dismissive.


What has she "done to you" the past 7 months?

She told you not to come to her country, but you did anyhow. She said she would not greet you or house you. Then you complain here that you "had to get a place b/c she would not house me"...as if she broke her word.

But it's just like she told you it would be, and what she would not do.

Anything about this^^ strike you as you playing the victim, even now, after all of us have said it?

As for the Valentine Card I suggested, first, you are over analyzing it. There is no one thing, no one act and no one gesture that will fix this.

My suggestion was to outline his hand and date the card. Maybe let him "color in" part of it (draw a heart maybe) if that is possible or do it on the other side. But let her have a card with his handprint traced, on a card with the date.

It does not have to be "signed" by him at all.