first time - need help still

[nero]

Nero-I don't think I will be ok until I am off this ride. I never like rides, they make me sick, and I am very sick of this one.

I'm sick of the analyzing the trial and error, the emphasis on someone else and how to treat them while they treat you like sh!t.

ta da- i just reread my last post to you - man, what a goofball i sound like. must have said three times "i'm done".

still stands. we've reached - or passed some important point here. i'm not sure what exactly it is- i feel it tho, do you?

i cannot seem to look forward and see anything at all- just busy not imploding or exploding today. i do not know what spring will bring- daffodils are coming up- little guys.

they don't apparently know they have a couple more months of winter to go. gotta love them for being there

i guess it's good that i notice them- last year i didn't even know garden existed. i see the improvement-

i'm sure the world does not. i'm tired of the ride too- i don't go on scary rides. i just got on this one by mistake (and misplaced trust mostly).

we will extricate ourselves "in the end". i do not know when that will be- i am impatient too- it does not change who we are deep inside i guess. i can "talk" to me til i'm blue in the face with good strategy & big jazzy plans. i am not buying it- i guess we all "gotta be who we gotta be". can't put it any better.

this would (apparently & sometimes dissappointingly) be who i am. CRIPES...

SO- NOW i'm getting another cup of coffee (it's so strong it's making my hair stand on end today) - and go roam around my messy messy garden- maybe cut a few raggy dead things away & tidy one tiny bit-

list more junk on ebay- maybe pay that stupid insurance premium( they sure are a drag aren't they? i resent like heck that i'm afraid to go without insurance- but it's awful and a blood sucker to have it. oh man...

wait- that wasn't very upbeat- FORCE myself to sit at computer and do some work that will generate some immediate(ish) income & be useful and productive.

and otherwise dread the arrival - or next phone call from this dreaded "mrs executive" (so she thinks) sister that is bugging me.

hide little feather- run & hide...

ta da!! HERE WE ARE TODAY- ALIVE, SANE, HEALTHY- HATE IT, BUT STILL STANDING- SO AREN'T WE SOMETHING?????? (won't comment on what - lets just say SOMETHING SPECIAL???

XXOO (((___)))

[Takevowsserious]

Hey girl-

Let's talk detachment!

Such a tricky thing to wrap your head around and understand... Really, truly understand.

I think earlier on, I did get that this was not about me, so that I shouldn't take what he said and did personally. Seeing his behavior with our children - cold and distant- really helped with that. I knew, without a shadow of a doubt, that he loved them. Yet, he could not show them love.

What was difficult for me was separating his actions from me being hurt. I still struggle with this.

It does still pain me when I see him dressed up in one of his date night outfits, knowing he is going to see her. Meanwhile, he will look me right in the face and lie about where he is going.

Remember, he thinks I have no idea about OW. He "thinks" he hides it so well. What cluelessness.

I think I viewed detachment before as pretending I didn't know what was going on, just keep sticking my head in the sand.

I thought I was detached, but I was wrong. I was still watching him, waiting for that little sign that he was coming around.

I realize now that as long as he lives here, I can not fully let go and detach. And he is not really free to heal himself.

A lose/lose situation, right?

While it still hurts to know he is with someone else, I have accepted that I can't control that or anything else about him. He is free to go. But he doesn't get me.

And if I can take a moment to think highly of myself, I believe I am the best he is ever going to get. I may not be perfect, but I'm pretty damn good. He bailed on me and our M - and that is something he will have to deal with and live with.

Don't sell yourself short Nero. We don't "have" to do anything. We don't have to put up with their nonsense. We don't have to be a part of their daily lives and madness. We don't have to stop loving/caring about them either.

And yes, our "real" H's would be a hard act to follow. But we don't know if/when they are coming back.

We get to decide what WE want in the end. I see that now.

My story is still being written, and so is yours. I personally would rather be the heroine instead of the damsel in distress... How about you?

[albamarie]

I realize now that as long as he lives here, I can not fully let go and detach. And he is not really free to heal himself.
I believe I am the best he is ever going to get. I may not be perfect, but I'm pretty damn good. He bailed on me and our M - and that is something he will have to deal with and live with

Very well written...and when I am having a good day I see this very clearly!

It's those other days that I need better control and the strength to keep moving forward! I am so wise yet so dumb at times I can hear myself getting ''more stupider''!

[nero]

Quote:

I realize now that as long as he lives here, I can not fully let go and detach. And he is not really free to heal himself.
I believe I am the best he is ever going to get. I may not be perfect, but I'm pretty damn good. He bailed on me and our M - and that is something he will have to deal with and live with

Very well written...and when I am having a good day I see this very clearly!

It's those other days that I need better control and the strength to keep moving forward! I am so wise yet so dumb at times I can hear myself getting ''more stupider''!
_______

__________________

you know guys -

I totally agree and feel myself echoing both sentiments. I was in SUCH an emotional tailspin yesterday. (my mom&sister crap) It's true- all of it.

I too feel that this guy - that i cared soo darn much for and am still somehow "attached" to - is making the biggest mistake of his life. well, our lives. he's taking me out with him- and i don't have the power to stop it- fix it - or change a darn thing.

it's just a shame- and sad. i just erased my usual bunch of "goop" - all the stupid soul-searching, analyzing, etc. i must sound crazy to all you guys alot of the time.

geez - and here was me thinking i'm a perfectly nice person- normal as apple pie. part of me still does- but when i look at what i say here & how i feel about my r's in life- i sound so wacked out.

BIG THOUGHT - maybe this whole mlc - end of life as i know it- end of love - END - END - END , is an end of me being the ole pollyanna i was always in life- and the beginning of a new and more realistic , hardened a bit - me. i hope that will be a better me- i do not want it to be a bitter icky me. I DON'T LIke this "getting hard" stuff- i guess you can't lay there and bleed forever tho. people are cruel & thoughtless- i guess i need to quit making excuses for the bad behavior and treatment of others & wake up and smell the coffee. BUT - WHAT IF when we look too hard everyone is self-serving and "small" and no one out there is worthwhile any more??? once one takes off the rose colored glasses.

we're afraid of that... waaaahhhhh -

what a drag i am with all this STUFF. This is what i do not like about me. this sense of obligation & duty & guilt & the continual internal dialog & analyzing. SO- YA THINK I'M CRAZY OR WHAT???

I want to take a shower- but INSTEAD i'll go over my mothers to make sure she's getting up & okay & steady on her feet. see what i mean- my other sisters merely have to go about their lives and assume i'll do it- and i'm such a dope - i DO!

with h too- he gets to go around doing whatever he wants and he THINKS I'LL always understand & 'GET used to it" - can you just die. what an arrogant bum - he said it in there somewhere - - his assumption that i'll love him no matter what apparently.

maybe yes, maybe no. people can kill love or change it. my mother is just like him- i mean creepily so- i've apparently picked her in a mate (OH GOD). they don't realize i may feel obligation & go thru the motions- but they chip away and damage one's heart - and it's never the same.

can't flesh that out- i'm different inside to both of them. they are so worried about themselves - they inflicT a bit too much pain & think good ole me will always absorb it.

OKAY- SORRY FOR THE ICKY POOR-ME CRAPPOLA - HERE'S ME JACKING UP MY SHORTS AND GETTING ON WITH IT ALL. what a pity-sponge i sound like. i hate that i even "get like" this- i know if my life was devoid of people i'd hate it- i feel unable to deal with the junk at this moment that seems to come with everyone.

boy- dawn - like you, i need to go off on a wonderful somehow fun filled vacation somewhere - have a great time with people i like that like me- no baggage - nothing below the surface - just enjoy life at face value.

HEY- I'M DOING JUST THAT TODAY- NOT ALLOWING MYS3LF TO HAVE EVEN ONE THOUGHT THAT IS "BELOW THE SURFACE" TYPE THING- JUST KEEP IT LITE-

OH GOD - PHONE

((( ))).

[albamarie]

Hi. Nero
I can't be in a tail spin anymore, I don't think I can mentally handle it. Yesterday I cried in the shower praying for God to get H far away from me.

He talked to me about work and I looked at him blankly, he said I don't know how to be human, I said I don't know how to be heartless. He said he knows and it's bad I am getting hurt by him.

Tonight he said goodby, and thank you for the computer, he feels guilty about how distant he is but needs to be distant..

So you see I can't be in a tailspin because he already is enough for both of us.

I really need the vacation though, I would love a beach about now or hiking in Nevada. I feel the need to be really active, you know that out of ordinary thing you only do on vacation.

Don't let family bring you down, they always feel so intitaled to be rude but I don't agree and have disowned a few members over time. Stick with who you know you are and don't let anyone tell you different.

[nero]

I really need the vacation though, I would love a beach about now or hiking in Nevada. I feel the need to be really active, you know that out of ordinary thing you only do on vacation.

me too- i'd kill for a great trip- they used to really bring us together and be such fun- what a mess now.

last one he ruined with his texting - I didn't know then what the heck was going on with him. stupid me-

fun, i think i remember that- i'll take some of that too. also the intense activity- i'd like to go backpack and hike the pennine way (is that the one?) down middle of england. it's such a beautiful countryside. wonder if i could do it without getting murdered or something drastic? i need a man protector to do it i think- i'm so used to it.

anyway- hope your day was good- i'm going to drink a gallon of nyquil tonite and sleep - last nite didn't go so well.

now i'm going to go work on a porcelain doll - something just pure pleasure- see if i can still do it... enjoy & not stress

take care- hang on- xxoo ((( )))

[nero]

hi takes vows -

What was difficult for me was separating his actions from me being hurt. I still struggle with this.

It does still pain me when I see him dressed up in one of his date night outfits, knowing he is going to see her. Meanwhile, he will look me right in the face and lie about where he is going.

you know- it's sooooo icky - all of this . it does hurt to know he's going to have a weekend with ow - it is awful. i am not laying here - in a fog and bleeding- but it still hurts and i suspect will forever. it's the boldfaced fact that he is "choosing her" over me.

would a person ever feel neutral about that?

i don't think so- my h just said so - rite out - on the phone. like i don't know when he doesn't call it's because he knows if he calls from his cellphone i know. well, i hate it- and a little bit maybe hate him when he does.

he may as well know- it's just not something "i'm used to" or am likely to ever get "used to". I don't or didn't rant and rave or do anything other than say - "well, goodbye then" and when he said he wasn't leaving now, i just said "there's nothing about my life i care to share with you" and got off phone. i'm soooo not one for theatrics. sometimes i wish i was- maybe i'd be wonderful and much sought-after and all that rubbish divas have. I don't march out the door- tho i wonder when/if he will. i wonder which of us is the bigger coward.

i feel your pain- it stinks to be lied to and it stinks to be told the truth. can he really believe in his pea brain that if he tells me the truth that it's "okay" on any level?

he wants to think he's a nice guy. he is soooo far from that.

what in the world - just what???? could go on in his brain??? to think it could ever be okay- and to ever stay knowing me.

oh well- i just say the same old junk over and over- how many years can i be amazed at the actions of other people. i live in some victorian novel mentality about manners and decency and niceness.

i'm going to go have a little glass of wine and try to not think about him at all. i'm doing better than ever before- but what i lack in violent reaction- i make up for in sad resignation and (maybe - defeat and withdrawal).

Don't sell yourself short Nero. We don't "have" to do anything. We don't have to put up with their nonsense. We don't have to be a part of their daily lives and madness. We don't have to stop loving/caring about them either.

honestly- i don't know what i have or don't have to do. i would like to achieve some sort of understanding here- i am tired of feeling confused and floating. i would like an answer- some stability and feel like i have a "future" looming out there. i cannot see it- i cannot see anyone to have it with- and that is my own neurosis. the pleasure i take in being anchored to & by someone. well, someone i want to be with. i guess i'll get lost and let you go - i'm just in my continual and endless loop here and i see it.

off to try and shut off mr brain so he lets me sleep- wish me luck

xxoo


i

[albamarie]

i live in some victorian novel mentality about manners and decency and niceness

Oh my goodness Nero, me too! I have been watching Jane Austin movies from her books lately. I swear I'm a revisiting soul of my great.....grandfather who came to New York from Staffordsh England, who by the way became Supreme Court Justice for NJ.

My mom carries the last name of the town there and though we've never been, I'm so drawn, especially to the older times.

Our men don't fit the picture of what I would consider a gentleman. Mine fits the profile more of Mr. Rochester from Jane Erye, a married man who keeps his wife locked up while he carries on as if single. And, then it turn out he's weak as well, to weak to fix his life. Yea, that's my h,

I still don't think you should do anything, don't move or go away, it's your home and you wouldn't want to be considered abandoning it. I think IMHO, you need to set some boundaries w/h because your not M, it's so easy for him to just flow in and out.

You two, IMHO, who am I but a listener, need to finally sit down and work out the fact that your R is over, he has a life you will never approve of, so are you friends, or roommates, either way, your not dating. I would want that on the table all ready, only because he calls you to tell you he's leaving for out of town, go tell a buddy dude.

He's hurting you, you get devastated, he has his fun. Why is he reporting to you? Guilt that he won't call and you'll guess anyways, are you buddies now, I don't think it's to rub it in, never the less, you should be on a need to know basis about his life to give you the space you need to heal.

When he is coming to NJ he could give you a heads up but he is coming for his own business and not to get into your. Your not a couple when he's there or when he's not so why do you have to be anything but cordial?

Maybe it me, just forget all of this if your not ready. I stay out of all my h business, his work, his hunger, his bathing habits, his cell phone, everything and it has been a load off. I don't want to know, we are not friends, lovers, or anything more than two people who used to know each other.

I didn't make it this way he did, and I have to enforce it and make some of my own rules in order to not be so f***ing hurt by him.

You can detach, even completely, and still love and miss the h he was, but don't look to him to be that man. Even if he does eventually come back to you, you have to first be won over, and second start a whole new relationship from scratch.

Meanwhile, get off the NyQuil and get started figuring out how and what your going to do to protect yourself from him. And no, he wouldn't see you detach even if he was with you, your suppose to do it for you. We don't really want to go into spring the same way, with the same pain.

Tell me to stuff it if I'm to harsh or your not ready, but at least you know your not alone.

[nero]

hey hi-

you were honest but not harsh. you have a kindly delivery so i am not in the least offended.

i avoid all discussion because mwd says don't even try to have r talk- that this will merely push him away immediately rather than allow him to wind his way thru his "thing".

i think both things- that db way is right sounding to me. and i think your comments are good too. i am still trying to apply it and "not go there" about the r and so forth. (discussions, demands, expectations, recriminations)

in past when we "discussed" all this- i did say-" i'm not his mother or friend - i'm not a pal- i'm either his mate or nothin (in my mind). I told him this ow between us will kill it all- (all calmly) - i don't know him anymore - don't know what i feel for him - and don't know what or if this r could be in future and don't know if this new "real" him is someone i even want to know".

beyond that, what is there left to say - really?. he's heard everything i think & feel about it.

i haven't brought it up since then (several months ago)

whatever our r is - totally objectively speaking - he is nicer in past year . so he has improved and i am feeling creative and interested - so i'm improved too. i don't think it "means" anything - don't know if we're growing more apart or more together. sounds dopey- nothing has changed really tho. like the book says- don't get excited over any "ups" - probably for him nothing has changed.

I have stupidly sacraficed instincts & desires of mine in life to be with him- my own choice. he has not- slimball. I made a bad choice - better women than me were seduced by feeling special, love, fun, etc. only a human being here..

total impasse

i am not banking on him being in my life forever anymore- i'm just riding it out in what i think is least intrusive and painful way. maybe i'm just lazy & weak . who the heck knows?

when i listen to and try to "embrace" the db philosophy- i come to the conclusion that nothing i do or think matters. keep clear - give him room - stfu and try to gal. whether he sees it or not- do it anyway.

i'm betwixt and between with thinking (still) that this is a mlc - then waiver - what if i'm mistaken). then i think i've invested soooolong in hanging on thru this awful awful period - it would be a shame to walk out before "the end". BUT THEN- I THINK, IF in fact i'm on the wrong trail- it's been for nothing - BUT THEN i think what difference does that make either? i do not have anything "better" to run to at this moment in time other than (alot more of) lonliness (& poverty (possibly) - the old "do you feel lucky punk?" i am not a gambler really.

I still don't think you should do anything, don't move or go away, it's your home and you wouldn't want to be considered abandoning it. I think IMHO, you need to set some boundaries w/h because your not M, it's so easy for him to just flow in and out.

i GET what you say- i think/thought that this inability of mine to "act like it's okay" and talk to him while he's in the arms of ow or on his way - was some kind of boundary. i know it's weak & small. i've said to him that " i hate it- i hate that he does it- i'm waiting to wake up and hate him enough to leave". (so that much he knows) he said "that's hard" wtf - he's deluded clearly about him and me and life and everything in the universe.. short of the "get out of my life if you're choosin her" boundary- what would i possibly say or do other than cut off communications if he's with her? he apparently doesn't think his actions are "hard" or he wouldn't have the shame to utter those words. he deserves worse than hard - like slow & painful torture maybe? too bad i'm not that kinda gal- revenge & torture motivated.


talk about life in a novel- he's living in his warped little brain -- even more unreal than me. at least i have you and jane eyre in my corner..!!.

he just sent a little e-mail reminder about a bill i have due - wtf - see, he somehow needs to keep attached before he goes off to be detached- i'm in a sick psycho novel here really- he's flyin over my cuckoo nest...

, I don't think it's to rub it in, never the less, you should be on a need to know basis about his life to give you the space you need to heal.

so - are you saying you think i should tell him stay away and we need to separate? or just that when he's down there we should have no communications at all? i've thought of it- but remind myself there may be big rammifications. he may hate it- he may love it- the ole crap shoot again that goes along with big actions of that sort. cluck cluck...scratch scratch...

re: sitting down & putting things on table - db says don't go repeating it all over and over. He continues to do what he does- i continue to tell myself to harden up and face the music. this will end sometime- one way or the other way- i cannot do this particular dance forever. i still try to stay away from any confrontation/conversation with him and work on me- my attitude- the things i want to change -

I have a notion if i continue to be who i am- the universe will wham me on the head and i will go off in a new direction. if i don't come to a big decision/action on my own because of a job or love or whatever - I think life will push me.

i know- i sound crazy don't I. even saying it out loud sounds wacky to put your life in the hands of fate (God?) whatever...

i like the dr. seuss quote of:

be who you are- and say what you feel...

those who matter won't mind and those who mind, don't matter.

keeping a good thought. i'm not as devastated as usual - i am wierdly in control of emotions this morning.

determined to do some work- balance a checkbook - see an old friend of fam. at mom's for lunch (this woman is always saving someone- perhaps she'll take over saving mom for a bit - it would be a welcome relief to know she had some company besides me.

so- thank you and drive thru please. i do appreciate your input and welcome it at any time. you don't make me feel judged and criticized- you just put forth your thoughts & kindly inquire. pleasee do so any time-

i know i rant & loop and probably have not said one new thing in the past year- thanks for participating with me-

i hope your day is a good one- how are you and what are yout hinking. are you still in crisis mode? have you managed to take a step back?

is the lite still on?????? or are we loading up our dinghies for a quick escape? curious - are ya okay?

xxoo ((( ))) some day- when this is allllover and we laugh about it - we need to meet up for that glass of wine - or maybe a bagel and coffee- whatever. a fun thought.
-

[albamarie]

Nero-
No, no, there is no right or wrong, rhyme or resone to any of this. You have definitely made some changes and your moving forward everyday, nothing about this is easy and your still here!

It was nice to hear you say some of the things you have done to make changes, you don't really write about the positives you made, so now that you wrote them, reread them and give yourself the credit you deserve.

I was surprised to hear some of the things you just wrote, if anything at least I got you talking about yourself a little more. We're here for Nero!

I will write again tonight, off to get b-day cake for now S26 and now D19, they share the week so they share the sheet cake!