she's a wonderful person but...

[25yearsmlc]

I've lost a parent, and my h has lost one, too. So I've been on both sides of the tragedy. Let me share some observations.

Thank you for sharing your story. It helps me understand a bit more of what W must be going through (since she's not talking to me about it - and that's okay! ). It also illustrates how difficult it can be supporting your spouse through a prolonged crisis.

I'd never heard of this Retrouvaille thing you mentioned. I've looked it up now, and maybe that'd be something to suggest down the road. W is Catholic, not me.

my h is not Catholic and I was a tad nervous that someone might try to convert. That SOOO did NOT happen!

Fwiw, ours was not dogmatic at all. There are team couples there who are the conductors of the retreat, and a retired priest stood up and said two things: he said he'd be around if anyone wanted to talk to him OR if they had problems with the Church, he'd listen. (He also apologized for any damage anyone suffered from clergy, which I thought was gutsy). Also, twice he lead us in prayer. My h didn't seem fazed or freaked. it was not a "Catholic" prayer but a generic one. After the whole thing was over, there was a Mass you could attend if you wanted to and most of the Catholics did, including me and my h came too. We were feeling pretty close.

I suspect if you are an adamant atheist, you could be turned off by any Retrovaille weekend b/c they do believe in having a spiritual connection in marriage. But there were no conversion talks at ours. Call ahead if you;re nervous.

BTW*** Retrovaille is NOT an "encounter weekend"; Retrovaille means "rediscover" in French, and is specifically for couples who have marriages in crisis. Many of our 25 couples were contemplating divorce at the time they attended. 4 years later 20 or 21 are still together. Retrovaille claims a better than 80% success rate and---

given why the couples are there, that's impressive.


So the "team couples" each told us their stories in pieces we could handle. Their problems made ours pale in comparison...(some had lost a child, several had affairs, addictions, bankruptcy, etc) and
yet there they were, a few years later, still married, and there to tell us "it's worth it."

It's hard not to be inspired.



Reading some of these relationship books, I was thinking I'd look up some marriage retreats as a way to kickstart our relationship reboot whenever she's ready to do that. But I was a little concerned that many of these authors, if they have a religious bent, are from the evangelical Protestant side of the Christian spectrum. W might be more open to a Catholic version. Anyway, I'm glad you mentioned it. And that you went in the middle of your crises.

We went when we felt we were in piecing, but I knew we were backsliding and I had low reserves for that. And the dying parent (my mil) was in full swing but little did I know it'd be over another year before she'd pass on. I am not complaining that she lived too long; just saying we didn't plan out things well b/c we had no timeline for it.

I'm Catholic, but not a great one. I try to be religious but feel there are many paths to God. So I probably would not feel comfortable with an evangelical approach IF

1) Catholics got bashed (b/c suddenly I get defensive when someone ELSE criticizes my church) and OR 2) I'd be freaked out if someone said "wives obey h's"...b/c it feels wrong to me.



Unfortunately, Retrouvaille doesn't seem to be operating in our city, even though the Diocese has it on their website. Maybe it's just not scheduled yet.

CALL and find out when and where the next one is. They are all around but not consistently in one place.

Ours was in our city..ON our anniversary just 2 weeks later. I felt the universe was pretty much supporting us in going...

SO....my suggestions...simple compliments.

Let them take the lead on intimacy.

I think I've finally settled on backing off. I find myself thinking, surprisingly, that I'm okay with no sex for months if that's what she needs. Not sure how many. I'm telling myself over and over that it's not rejection, it's grieving space.

absolutely


Same goes with non-sexual touching as well.

you can try to touch her IF you make sure she knows it's just about a back rub and it's not meant to be foreplay, but just you giving HER some affection or comfort, etc.

Have you asked her to tell you when and how you can best comfort her? If she says "leave me alone', do not take that as a permanent request. It's not. (IF she says "get a divorce" that would be very different. But I'm not getting that from her).

Although I also realize certain kindnesses can trigger grief bouts. Not all of that is unhealthy though.


I'll try sticking to the parting/greeting kiss as my lifeline. I'll try to keep up the simple compliments, the little gifts, and the increased chores since that shouldn't lead to any breaks in that wall she's trying to maintain. Yet I hope it's still noticed and seen as acts of love and support.

Express your love and support in as many ways possible and she'll know. Don't hope to get noticed or it'll be a tactical choice, not a gift of love. Make sense?

It's only a short-term plan. It can't go on indefinitely. And it can't simply return to our pattern of recent years. I just hope she's willing to tackle it, too.


Stop borrowing trouble from tomorrow. First of all, you both have work to do but for now, it's NOT HER time for that work. Sukk it up for now.


That doesn't mean you don't have work to do ---which you CAN do now. What issues are you working on so you can become the best man YOU can become?

stepping up to the plate AND doing it with love, not a martyr's sigh

Yeah, I think I've had a few of those martyr sighs, and worse. Got to keep them in check. I'm starting to remember some from long ago that probably helped establish our pattern. Doing some dishes yesterday, I had a flash of scrubbing the sinks and counters with bleach in a rage once, prompted by some complaint or request from W about helping out more. Yeah, that probably didn't come across as an expression of love.

Good insight^^...change those behaviors b/c they're very noticed and very resented and she probably lacked the energy to complain then, but I bet she recalls them....maybe all is not forgotten by her.

She probably has her own "Scorecard" and on that one, you're way behind.
Think about it. You see yourself as the victim here but I don't and I bet your w does not either.

See, as she more than steps up to the plate for her parents, and the kids, and gets the martyr routine from YOU, oh my, I bet she rolled her eyes and thought "wow he really doesn't get it" (that would be my best case scenario of how she saw it, btw)

Of course I don't think scorecards are good in ANY marriage. B/c we measure things differently and

we're supposed to live "from this day forward" and "not keep a record of wrongs", correct?

Good luck