Is this cake eating? 10

[NLW]

My last thread:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...231#Post2310231

Well, I always thought my stbx was a classic mlcer - and Snodderly maintains that the holidays are the time when mlcers go out of control.

Mine has thrown his biggest tantrum yet, and it seems to be retaliation for not seeing the kids on Xmas day.

I have been told to take his behaviour at face value - not to speculate about his motivation, but i need some sort of explanation for the complete turn-around that he displayed between Xmas Eve and 27th Dec when we saw him again.

Here's how events unfolded.

Xmas Eve he arrived unannounced (strange) to drop off 2 gift bags for the kids. D16 was at work so he didn't see her.

Unprompted, he apologised for not having transferred his half of the kids' school book order money to my account as he'd promised a week ago. Said he'd go straight home and do it.

Said he would come back to see the kids for Xmas on Boxing Day. I (stupidly) asked if he would like to see them Xmas Day.

He said "When?" and I, stupidly again, said "When would suit you?".

He then nominated 2 times that he knew my family would be here for our traditional breakfast and lunch. I knew that the kids would not go with him at those times, so I asked if he could see them in the evening instead.
He erupted in anger and left.

Phoned back a minute later to spew about how i'd made him look as if he chose not to see the kids on Xmas Day.

He called in the evening on Xmas day and i said that his parents were coming over in 10 mins and would he like to come over too to see everyone. He did not reply but asked to speak to kids.
He didn't show.

Boxing Day, he didn't show either. Kids and i got invited by MIL to a family BBQ and we went. Had a good time with FIL, MIL, BIL, SIL, and their kids.

On 27th, when D16 and I returned from shopping, stbx is at our house with S14 (again, strange as he doesn't come over unannounced).
He leaves as soon as we walk in, but asks to speak to me outside first.
Announces that he is not going to pay his half of the kids' school books.

Big argument ensues, I say i will no longer discuss things while we are so upset, and go inside. He knocks on door one min later and asks to speak to kids.
I feel as if I can't refuse to let him, so allow him to come in. He starts a rant about how i 'abused' OW 3 months ago when she turned up at D16's music concert. I deny 'abusing' her and he insists on asking kids if i did. They confirm that i did not.
I ask him to leave again, and tell him not to come over unannounced again. He says I am denying him access to the children.
Lots of emailing that night. Gist is, he claims he is paying too much for the kids' support and will not pay half of the book fees.

He has been paying a minimal weekly amount since mid Nov 2012. Nothing else, even though he has been 'gone' for almost 18 months and I pay all of the mortgage and credit card debt that he amassed. He has not paid half of the kids' school fees either.

I let it go, reasoning to myself that i will ask MIL to cover stbx's half of book fees for the kids.

28th, stbx arrives on our doorstep (again unannounced) at 12 noon. Says he has come to collect the rest of his clothes (he's never bothered to take most of his clothing).
I tell him that I am about to take D16 to work and so timing is not convenient. He gets apoplectic and demands that he drive D16 to work after coming in to get his things.
I calmly say "no", that we have plans to visit my parents who live close to D16's work, and we will drop her off. He storms off and, for the first time, i feel afraid of what he will do next. He seems like a coiled spring, taut and ready to unwind explosively.

Emailing again ensues that night.

Here's some of what he said:

"You ignored my continued requests for a settlement and you denied me access to the kids while portraying it as my choice not to see them.

All of which you continue to do. Eg this email interaction and your effort in front of the children yesterday."

and
"I will consider anything that brings this closer to a settlement but I will not entertain your continued stalling and manipulation. I urge you to reconsider my generous offer or make a counter offer as soon as possible. Once this goes to court I will not be in a position to be so generous and it is unlikely that you will be able to afford to remain in the house. I am not trying to threaten you - just point out the facts. The situation is similar to the car - you ignored my solution and now everyone is worse off."

and
"I disagree with everything you have stated here so the only possible way I can get a resolution is to go to court.

Should you wish to avoid this expensive action make an offer.

You will no longer be the beneficiary of my goodwill if you continue to manipulate the children to the detriment of my relationship with them."

In the end it involved a series of one-line emails from him each about one min apart. Seemed like a sort of email 'hysteria'.
I had stopped replying by this time.

I know, from phone calls I receive at his home address, that several companies and banks are chasing him for unpaid accounts. I also know that he has not paid last terms' school fees for S14. Goodness knows how many other demands there are on him for payments. How he imagines he will pay for lawyers' fees is anybody's guess.
He seems desperate for a 'quick' settlement - presumably because he needs money NOW. But a) there is no money to be had from me - the assets are all gone, and b) divorce settlements even when uncomplicated (i.e. no business involved) take time. Further, he OWES the children and my parents significant amounts of money that he has taken from their accounts without authority.

It all just seems too weird to cope with. I am beginning to be afraid to think what he will do next. It's unsettling trying to manage this.

We were attending mediation to try to work out a settlement but he has refused to return after the first session. It looks now as if we will be back to lawyers, but i'm not sure how i will pay.
Here we go again....

Would appreciate any comments/viewpoints.

I should point out that prior to Xmas, I had been going dark. School was over so there had been no need to see stbx (when school is on, he comes into house every day to drop off kids). The NC seems to have made things worse, although perhaps this is just coincidental.

[tori2012]

Wow. This is a lot to take in. Sorry you're going through it...but I think you've handled him as well as you can.

He's a kid throwing a tantrum, so walk away. The more reaction he gets from you, the worse it'll get.

He's attacking out of fear--maybe fear that he will collapse financially. His spiritual health/love is at the bottom of his list now.

Don't be afraid. But seek legal counsel. Talk to the children about their needs to see their dad--always in a positive way.

Don't badmouth him to your in-laws. Assume everything will go to him.

Can you have NC for at least a week? I hope so. You might write him a note to say you need a week to think things through and that you will get back to him. Then, NC.

Don't know what else to suggest. Prayers for comfort going your way.

[littleGTO]

HI, NLW,
I agree w Tori. LEss is best. Try to continue your amazing calmness and limit contact at all costs.

Also, it is important that the kids be kept out of the chaos he is ensuing w his madness. In the end it is important that they have as good of a R w his kids as they will allow.

Of course kids are so perceptive, so I'm sure they feel the stress eminating from him when he interacts w them.

Stay strong. YOu are amazing!

[NLW]

Tori, tg,

Thanks for your take on this. And for your support. It helps me keep going.

I am limiting contact with him.

Interestingly, I had a few hours last night where I felt so sorry for him that I was almost crying.

This is a really new feeling for me. Usually, I feel sorry for myself and have cried over my own sad situation. Last night I was overwhelmed by feelings of how awful this must be for him.

One thing I need some help with at the moment concerns his request to come over and get the rest of his clothes from our house.

It's going to happen on Wed.

Kinda sad about this as it represents the last physical connection with our home.
He's left almost all of his clothes here for almost 18 months, so it's a harsh reality check to finally hear that he's coming to take them. Another blow to my dwindling store of hope.

I'm wondering how to handle it.

His clothes are in a big wardrobe that is in S14's room.

There are lots of them and he will need to make multiple trips to the car to carry them all out.

His shoes are in a shoe closet in D16's room.

So, both kids will see him going into their rooms and taking the last of his things out of our home.
I feel as if I need to be present to check that he doesn't take anything else away - so no making myself scarce when he comes to do this.

I don't feel that I want to bundle up his clothes for him.

1. Why should I do the work?
2. It will give him a taste of consequences to do this himself (i.e., I assume it will be hard emotionally).

Any ideas on how to handle this.
Has anyone had any advice from a DB coach about this phase of the process?

My goal is to re-establish a friendly R with him. At the moment he is full of anger and resentment about the way i am 'manipulating' the children to want nothing to do with him.

[tori2012]

Hey. I dealt with something similar. Per my coach, and DB rules, you must convey you understand he's done. So make it okay for him to pick up his stuff. I would personally leave with the kids and do some GALing, but if you don't want to do this, then put all the stuff together in the garage or something like that. That's what I did. My H was surprised when I did this, but he actually came closer to me after that. The main message is: "I get it. I know you don't want me or our M." I know it's not what you want, NLW, and that it hurts terribly, but this is what you must convey.

[bustorama]

yeah, I helped my W pack her stuff up when she first moved out. After about 7 months when she had not removed the last of some of her stuff despite my mentioning it to her, I packed it up myself and brought it out to her car when she came to pick up our kids (took like 5 trips -- she had left alot). I told her I needed the space because I was moving some of my stuff into that closet (what used to be her closet). She looked at me pretty sideways before driving off.

[bustorama]

tori is right btw that you are still not in the db mindset. you uneed to get where you not only accept that he does not want the R but as a matter of fact that you also see that as the best thing for you. that you are happy as a clam without him in your life and you have had an awakening and hope he is just as happy as you are. And you are happy to facilitate co-parenting in your new separate lives.

It feels wrong. It is how you will prevail.

Not by pitying yourself or him.

[bustorama]

regarding the kids, you also need to convey to them that you are more than ok with this and, especially, that it is not a source of conflict or animosity between you and stbx. nothing that needs to be tiptoed around, dreaded or feared. Ideally, you will get there yourself.

my kids saw me carrying the boxes out but I was smiling and being very friendly with my w while I was doing it. She had just come from a halloween party that I was asking her about. gave them a kiss and went back inside after loading the last box. she kept staring at me looking a bit shellshocked.

[subguy]

I would not leave him in your house alone. You need a brother, cousin, uncle, father or off duty police officer with you. Maybe pack his stuff up put it in a corner and have the cop hand it to him. I would not be there alone with him or leave him to your house. Good luck and keep yourself safe if your afraid of his outbursts.

[NLW]

Busto,
"Happy as a clam" - now that's hard; I can act 'as if' but h-a-a-c will take some doing!

I take your point on showing him that I am happy to facilitate co-parenting in our new separate lives.

And I will do likewise with the clothes..

I had a rehearsal today.
He came over unannounced, again, and I was happy and smiling, but going out elsewhere.