Hello! 20 year marriage teetering... (part II)

[theUF]

Hi AnotherStander.

Sorry to hijack your thread but I have something I want to run by you.

You mentioned your W moved out 3 months ago, which is pretty close to my sitchs timeline. You also mentioned almost dropping the rope, which I've considered a couple of times myself.

In retrospect I realize I kind off dropped the rope already before BD, at least I presume that is what she felt.

The thing is, when I spend time with my X I can look at her and a lot of the time I wonder "do I truly love her enough?". Quite often I feel no strong need to hug or kiss her.

It makes me wonder if my feelings for her are strong enough.
I have a strong sense of loss and I miss her, but b/c of what I mention above I wonder

-do I miss her spesifically
or
-do I miss the package deal. Being a family. Being with someone. More so now, when christmas is coming up.

My question is, do you feel the same way with your W from time to time? Is it a common feeling to have in this situation.

I guess you and your W have a somewhat platonic R as well, and maybe that contributes to feeling detached, even though the feelings are still there. Makes sense?

[Desperate man]

AnotherStander,
Just wanted to say thank you for your support to all of us LBS on here.

So strange how so many of us on here are going through the same "cutting the rope" feelings. I to wander if I have the same love feelings for W. After all the pain and suffering that you go through, and of course all the comments the WAS says. I do not know if I want to expose my heart to be ripped out again.

Maybe its the dark, wet winter season blues. DM

[AnotherStander]

Journal update- I can't remember if I mentioned this but when W and I had our R talk I did mention to her that I felt she had been treating me pretty coldly since moving out. We talked about that a bit and ever since then she has been much kinder towards me. She even called before coming to pick up the kids yesterday and asked if I wanted her to bring me dinner. We ate at the table together for the first time in I-don't-know-how-long. Beyond that nothing much to report, we haven't talked again about Retrouvaille although I'm going to have to bring it up again soon so that we can sign up in time if she wants to go.

D16 performed in a parade Saturday, so W and I went to see her along with S9 and MIL. It was a madhouse, but we enjoyed it.

I took S9 and D16 Christmas shopping yesterday, we had a blast! D16 is VERY fashion-conscious and her tastes are starting to wear off on me. I ended up buying an Affliction t-shirt (over 60 bucks for a t-shirt, that is a 180 for me, LOL!!!!) as well as another very cool shirt with her input. Bought her some Rock Revival jeans for Christmas (140 bucks for crying out loud). S9 saw us enjoying ourselves so much that suddenly HE wanted to go clothes shopping, a 180 for him So we went to Macy's and found some cool stuff for him too.

I have problems with impatience also. Living with the unknown is difficult but it's an illusion that we ever really know what is in store for us day to day.

Absolutely! That's one thing I've learned in all of this is we simply do not control our destinies. We're just along for the ride. That's not to say we shouldn't try our hardest, but we just have to accept that things are unpredictable and we need to adapt when the unexpected happens.

I think the important lesson here for all of us LBS's is that no matter what the WAS says, no matter what they do, there is always a bit of ambivalence in their mind. It's just not that easy to make the decision to end a marriage, especially when the LBS is doing such a fine job of DB.

To me, this means time is on the side of those who hope to reconcile. Anything that buys the marriage more time is a good thing.

Time really is the most important factor, like Cadet always posts on new threads it's a "gift" to be used wisely. I really wish I had more patience, that's what is working against me.

Another thing to point out is that you should still not be believing anything she says or 50% of what she does.

Always a good reminder! I really think all I took away from our convo is that she's still confused though. I had convinced myself she was 100% done because that's what most of her actions said to me. I was surprised that she was still confused, and really surprised when she cried about it as she has shown almost no emotions for months.

It was a couple stories of people you personally knew and the amount of time it took for the WAW to want to R. Without putting a exact timeline on it, the possible R seemed to happen from 6 months to 2 years. So we are all pretty early into this, and if we truly want to save our M, patience, patience, patience.

Yes, quite right. Maybe I should get it tattooed someplace prominent, I've been wanting to get a tattoo anyway

The thing is, when I spend time with my X I can look at her and a lot of the time I wonder "do I truly love her enough?". Quite often I feel no strong need to hug or kiss her.

It's the same for me, in fact a couple of weeks ago I posted that I saw her in the grocery store and felt nothing at all. It was like seeing a neighbor, like I knew her, but felt nothing towards her. Then last week I looked at her at my house and her eyes just looked so beautiful. So I'm not consistent on that I guess!

-do I miss her spesifically
or
-do I miss the package deal. Being a family. Being with someone. More so now, when christmas is coming up.

To be completely honest I don't even think about missing her or why I miss her. Personally it's easier to detach if I don't think about those things. I do have feelings of missing her, but I don't dwell on them. But if I were to try to verbalize it, I'd say mostly I just miss her always being there. She was the rock I leaned on for so long, to have that gone is a very difficult transition. For much (or nearly all) of that 25 years I was her rock too, and it really feels bad to know that I'm not her rock anymore.

I guess you and your W have a somewhat platonic R as well, and maybe that contributes to feeling detached, even though the feelings are still there. Makes sense?

Yes, that is definitely a factor. It's hard to feel "in love" with someone who basically just acts like a casual friend. Some people can, but I guess I'm not wired that way. PT is my PLL and that's what really lights up my emotional attachment to someone. That said, I'm confident that if W decided to R then that would return pretty quickly. But the willingness isn't there.

AnotherStander,
Just wanted to say thank you for your support to all of us LBS on here.

It truly is my pleasure, and it helps me as much as anyone else

So strange how so many of us on here are going through the same "cutting the rope" feelings. I to wander if I have the same love feelings for W. After all the pain and suffering that you go through, and of course all the comments the WAS says. I do not know if I want to expose my heart to be ripped out again.

I think that is a huge part of it, it's self-defense! We drop the rope to close the door on the pain we're going through and to stop more pain from coming our way in the future. But as far as future pain goes, whose to say that if we hook up with another woman we won't go through it all over again? Now there's a thought

[Spartan]

I took S9 and D16 Christmas shopping yesterday, we had a blast! D16 is VERY fashion-conscious and her tastes are starting to wear off on me. I ended up buying an Affliction t-shirt (over 60 bucks for a t-shirt, that is a 180 for me, LOL!!!!) as well as another very cool shirt with her input. Bought her some Rock Revival jeans for Christmas (140 bucks for crying out loud).

I'm guessing you guys were at The Buckle. Reason is I just did same thing. Majority of my T-shirts have either Under Armor or Nike logo so 180 for me was to buy nicer T-shirts. My Affliction shirts came off clearance rack though because I just couldn't make it through the line with $50 T-shirt.

She was the rock I leaned on for so long, to have that gone is a very difficult transition. For much (or nearly all) of that 25 years I was her rock too, and it really feels bad to know that I'm not her rock anymore.

My W is still in house but I relate to this completely. I feel like I'm alone in the house even when she's there. It's hard to explain and I can't imagine how it feels for you guys separated.

AnotherStander,
Just wanted to say thank you for your support to all of us LBS on here.

I 100% second this. There are quite a few of you guys on here that have helped me more then you will ever know and I really do appreciate it. Being so new to this (not quite 2 months) I really admire you guys for sticking with it for as long as you have. You may not think you have patience but I'm truly impressed that you guys have as much as you do and it inspires me to keep on fighting.

[theUF]

I think that is a huge part of it, it's self-defense! We drop the rope to close the door on the pain we're going through and to stop more pain from coming our way in the future.

For sure.
I've been pretty much straight forward about my sitch towards friends. I could have gone self-defensive, sugar coating it and trying to save face, and although sometimes it annoys me that they know so much, in the end it feels good knowing I'm true to myself.

And the same thing I think can apply to the decision of dropping the rope or not. If we hang in there just a bit longer instead of giving up, if we are true to ourself and our feelings, I think we will easier find closure if one day there is no reconciliation.

In the future, if no R, I would rather be left with
"I gave it a good shot"
than
"D@mn, did I give up to soon?"

[AnotherStander]

I'm guessing you guys were at The Buckle.

Yup, I'm impressed you knew from that little bit of info I have another Affliction and a couple of Xzaviers, love the foil on those! Hey, I've been working hard on buffing up my body, might as well hang something halfway decent on it

My W is still in house but I relate to this completely. I feel like I'm alone in the house even when she's there. It's hard to explain and I can't imagine how it feels for you guys separated.

It's actually easier for me than when she was there. Seemed like there was a lot of tension and that I was walking on eggshells all the time.

I 100% second this. There are quite a few of you guys on here that have helped me more then you will ever know and I really do appreciate it. Being so new to this (not quite 2 months) I really admire you guys for sticking with it for as long as you have. You may not think you have patience but I'm truly impressed that you guys have as much as you do and it inspires me to keep on fighting.

Thank you! I can scarcely believe it's been almost 6 months since this started, I never would have thought I could make it this long. And now it's looking like there are at least several more months of limbo ahead!

[complicated]

AS and the UF it does take a lot of patience and I have none. The books and everyone on here has taught me you have to be patient or you hurt your sitch. My marital issues started well over 3 years ago but H didn't file until last year. I had high hopes when he stopped D but they soon faded when he moved out.

I always had the mindset that I would fight for my entire family but we kept having the same arguments. I did not know tht he was ready to start "dating" but I found that out last week. I read the DB and DR books and had renewed hope when I realized I was doing everything wrong.

Thank God I didn't know he was thinking about dating because I don't know how I would have reacted. My H was big on you'll never change but the 180's really helped. The kids telling him that things seemed better certainly didn't hurt.

Keep it up you guys. My situation seemed hopeless just 6 weeks ago and now we're talking about him moving back in. It hasn't happened yet and I'm being cautious but there is light. If I would have given up I'm convinced we would be D right now.

One thing that really kept me going were the kids and what D does to them. The way he treated me sometimes was really hard to keep going. I didn't want the kids to think you give up that easily on things, especially someone you love.

[7720]

sometimes I feel like I have dropped the rope and then something brings me back like a laser. So even though there may be a week where you feel nothing ...there might be another that brings you back in a hurry...I too daydream about starting over with someone new the excitement etc...and then I think about the complications ...not seeing my kids very much and I decide to wait and continue to work on myself. I am 42 and in much better shape than when I was 32...I too feel so fortunate to have all these people here...it helps me feel much stronger to hear the stories and advice...

[AnotherStander]

And the same thing I think can apply to the decision of dropping the rope or not. If we hang in there just a bit longer instead of giving up, if we are true to ourself and our feelings, I think we will easier find closure if one day there is no reconciliation.

Well the irony is that it's usually when the LBS totally gives up on the R that the WAS finally decides to consider returning. It seems like people who wait indefinitely never get closure. Their WAS is content to just keep stringing them along while they wallow in uncertainty. So in a way dropping the rope is a win-win, because if we well and truly do drop the rope then if the WAS returns we're in a better position to negotiate reconciliation terms (since our heart isn't invested anymore), and if they don't return then we're moving on anyway. That said, I am giving it more time because my W requested that, but I'm not going to just hang myself out there forever.

Keep it up you guys. My situation seemed hopeless just 6 weeks ago and now we're talking about him moving back in. It hasn't happened yet and I'm being cautious but there is light. If I would have given up I'm convinced we would be D right now.

Wow, that's an amazing story, thanks for sharing!

sometimes I feel like I have dropped the rope and then something brings me back like a laser. So even though there may be a week where you feel nothing ...there might be another that brings you back in a hurry

I have seen that too, although as time goes on I find myself feeling less towards her even on those "rebounds". But the sad thing is I know I will always feel something towards her, I just don't think you can spend half your life with someone, raise 3 kids with them and then turn off all feelings no matter how much time goes by. Although she seems to have done that pretty easily, LOL!

[theUF]

Well the irony is that it's usually when the LBS totally gives up on the R that the WAS finally decides to consider returning. It seems like people who wait indefinitely never get closure. Their WAS is content to just keep stringing them along while they wallow in uncertainty. So in a way dropping the rope is a win-win, because if we well and truly do drop the rope then if the WAS returns we're in a better position to negotiate reconciliation terms (since our heart isn't invested anymore), and if they don't return then we're moving on anyway. That said, I am giving it more time because my W requested that, but I'm not going to just hang myself out there forever.

You make a good point. Although it might not bring them back it will force them to think over what they really want.
I don't mean to wait indefinitely, but I do struggle with knowing if my wish to drop the rope is real. Always when I get to that state of mind something happens which throws me off balance again.

Today was one of those days actually, I will update my thread on it, you're welcome to stop by.

I guess I'm just afraid that if I drop the rope I will regret it.

I mean how do you really know when the time is right? M
Maybe it never feels quite right and you just have to go for it at some point?

I do hope your W gets her head around the whole situation and that it takes a turn for the better. At least she want's time, so that's a sign she hasn't completely dropped the rope.

You seem like a well-balanced individual, and it's quite sobering reading your thread.