TheUF - Changing gears - Dropping the rope?

[theUF]

Link to my first thread here - (clicky)

Sidenotes :
-Big love to those who helped me and provided advice and thoughts in my first thread.
-My sitch hasn't been that bad when comparing to what some others go trough on this board. But for me it's still bad.

A couple of days ago I made a decision that today I would try to decide if I would drop the rope or not.

What is power? In short - the ability to affect others.

However, sometimes we see power where there is none.

SS's uncle said people can only make you feel a certain way if you let them.

I work with a guy who wants to climb the ladder, he wants people to do things his way. He screams, yells and argues. Often he gets his way, but only with the people who are to afraid to confront him, this is not power. They don't even respect him, they just don't want the confrontation.

Another guy often gets his way, but mostly by making people listen and think. They do it out of free will. Guy nr.2 knows this is power, guy nr.1 would believe he is weak if he did the same.

Lately my X has been playing some kind of mind game.
She would call me, but not answer when I returned her call. She would suddenly stop answering on important topics(like S).
We had an appointment with S today, but she didn't answer my txt and made no contact until 1 hour before.

Not typical her, and it started burrowing into my head. It started affecting my mood around others.

(FLASHBACK: when things went down the drain, I had found out she was flirting with a guy. No PA, but still heavy flirting. She says she is not seeing anyone, but I think she has him in the crosshair.)

When we meet up today it turns out she has started on a new big tattoo, made and being done by this very guy.

Needless to say, seeing S IN her arms, and that tattoo ON her arm was a major kick to the groin.

Like with the mind game, it affected me, I wanted to just take S and leave. But I remembered that it only affects me if I let it.
I worked through it and actually had a good time. No thanks to her lol.

She has also stated she need no help from no one.
Couple weeks ago though she was getting a "too good to be true" kind of deal, and was going to spend a months salary on it. Hard earned money. Of course I warned her(without interfering too much). She would hear none of it.

Well turns out it was a scam, and she is now back living at parents place, even deeper in chit(financially).


So where does this leave me?

FIRST : After this short of a time I am of course not completely ready to drop the rope, but I can give it my best.
I think it may be what's best for me.
Even if nothing is going on between them, and this may sound stupid, the tattoo will forever remind me of this situation.
If something is going on between them, even more so.

I might be reading too much into it, but it's none the less how I feel right now.

SECOND : She has low self-esteem issues. She has minor anger issues. She is one of the most stubborn people I know. She has also been charming, caring, loyal and good to me. But I always see this other side of her shining through sometimes.

Right now I'm asking myself, "If we only had been together 1 years, with no son. Would I consider her? H3LL NO!"
It seems the only thing telling me to keep her in my life is that we have been together for so long and have a son together.

Still;

I deserve better than this.



(I am very grateful for anyones advice, 2x4's, thoughts etc.
I haven't thought about how to drop the rope yet, but I will think about it this weekend)

[subguy]

Link to my first thread here - (clicky)

Sidenotes :
-Big love to those who helped me and provided advice and thoughts in my first thread.
-My sitch hasn't been that bad when comparing to what some others go trough on this board. But for me it's still bad.

A couple of days ago I made a decision that today I would try to decide if I would drop the rope or not.

What is power? In short - the ability to affect others.

However, sometimes we see power where there is none.

SS's uncle said people can only make you feel a certain way if you let them.

I work with a guy who wants to climb the ladder, he wants people to do things his way. He screams, yells and argues. Often he gets his way, but only with the people who are to afraid to confront him, this is not power. They don't even respect him, they just don't want the confrontation.

Another guy often gets his way, but mostly by making people listen and think. They do it out of free will. Guy nr.2 knows this is power, guy nr.1 would believe he is weak if he did the same.

Lately my X has been playing some kind of mind game.
She would call me, but not answer when I returned her call. She would suddenly stop answering on important topics(like S).
We had an appointment with S today, but she didn't answer my txt and made no contact until 1 hour before.

Not typical her, and it started burrowing into my head. It started affecting my mood around others.

(FLASHBACK: when things went down the drain, I had found out she was flirting with a guy. No PA, but still heavy flirting. She says she is not seeing anyone, but I think she has him in the crosshair.)

When we meet up today it turns out she has started on a new big tattoo, made and being done by this very guy.

Needless to say, seeing S IN her arms, and that tattoo ON her arm was a major kick to the groin.

Like with the mind game, it affected me, I wanted to just take S and leave. But I remembered that it only affects me if I let it.
I worked through it and actually had a good time. No thanks to her lol.

She has also stated she need no help from no one.
Couple weeks ago though she was getting a "too good to be true" kind of deal, and was going to spend a months salary on it. Hard earned money. Of course I warned her(without interfering too much). She would hear none of it.

Well turns out it was a scam, and she is now back living at parents place, even deeper in chit(financially).


So where does this leave me?

FIRST : After this short of a time I am of course not completely ready to drop the rope, but I can give it my best.
I think it may be what's best for me.
Even if nothing is going on between them, and this may sound stupid, the tattoo will forever remind me of this situation.
If something is going on between them, even more so.

I might be reading too much into it, but it's none the less how I feel right now.

SECOND : She has low self-esteem issues. She has minor anger issues. She is one of the most stubborn people I know. She has also been charming, caring, loyal and good to me. But I always see this other side of her shining through sometimes.

Right now I'm asking myself, "If we only had been together 1 years, with no son. Would I consider her? H3LL NO!"
It seems the only thing telling me to keep her in my life is that we have been together for so long and have a son together.

Still;

I deserve better than this.



(I am very grateful for anyones advice, 2x4's, thoughts etc.
I haven't thought about how to drop the rope yet, but I will think about it this weekend)

Sounds like you have already decided to drop the rope. Be true to your feelings and what you want. I will give the same advice someone else gave me, slow down and make sure this is exactly what you want. Time is your friend, you can always drop that rope later, you may not be able to pick it up again if you decide to. Waiting a few days or weeks does not mean giving in to her, it means you give yourself time to heal and decide what is right for YOU.

[theUF]

People CAN change, but will she?

Sounds like you have already decided to drop the rope.

Well, I decided to -try my best- at dropping the rope.
I know I'm not genuinly there yet, so I'm aware that tomorrow or a week from now, or even today, I might change my mind.

you can always drop that rope later, you may not be able to pick it up again if you decide to

You make a good point here. I will consider that statement for sure.

As a person, I can be a bit undecisive at times, but often feel the need to make a decision as fast as possible. I think this applies in this case as well.

Be true to your feelings and what you want.

What I want is for us to be together IF we can sort things out and be happy. We had plans laid out for the future, and it hurts to miss out on them.
That is what I want.
It seems she does not.
And even if she did/does, I'm having strong doubts if it would work.

HOWEVER

That is the exact attitude my X had towards me when she left. Disbelief. She didn't think I would change at all, but I believe I have learned from all of this. It has changed my frame of mind.

I want her to keep an open mind towards me, so I guess I should try to do the same towards her.

What makes me uneasy about the whole situation is :

*In the time leading up to BD, I was mentally exhausted.
*Now, even though all these bad and hurtful things are happening, I feel more mentally strong and balanced.

That makes me think "wow, was our R THAT bad?"
"Did her actions make it so? or did mine?"
"Would it be the same if we got back together?"
In general, "what caused this?"

Some time before BD, I went on a vacation with friends. The first day I could suddenly feel all the stress I had endured fall down on me. It took a couple of days just to get back into gear.

[Soul.Searching]

See that's where I think a lot of WAS get confused too. If you have been working, looking after you S now and just dealing with everyday situations now and you go on a holiday, Would you not get that same de-stressing feelings and relaxation?

Yes, I really do wish I could talk to my Uncle about it all now. The hardest part is I missed out by around two weeks. I find it really has helped me a lot though. Right now I really have to work on it each time but I think it's already starting to work quicker. I hope one day I can just do it right away, without needing to really try so hard.

Your W is sounding a lot like my H right now. I have decided to drop the rope. He calls and talks for ages when he wants to. He asks me questions and even pushes for details. Where I have been, who with ect but yet gets angry if I ask him a question. Then other times he wont answer my call or message. Then he will call, now even say hello, just ask to talk to the kids. He then hangs up as soon as he is done.
Ive decided that I do not put up with one sided friendships from anybody else, do why should I do it with H?
What is it telling him if I continue to do so?
That it's okay to treat me like that?
Well it's not okay to treat me like that and I'm going to let him know. That's a boundary I'm not letting him continue to cross any longer.

Only you can decided to drop the rope but I think in order to be able to drop the rope, you first need to drop the fear.

[theUF]

I would probably get the same feeling. Although I don't think to the same extent. I felt quite bad the months before BD.

I see you're frustration for sure, your H seems to be stuck going nowhere.

At the beginning my X would initiate a lot of contact and come by all the time. I remember wondering if going dim/dark would wake her up.

It didn't, it just drove her more away. Ever since there has been little contact and no stopping by.

I know I am supposed to do what works, and skip what doesnt. So maybe I shouldn't be going dim/dark?

It doesn't matter though, right now I need the time and space.

[theUF]

So I've noticed my X has been really short and mean tempered towards me. For no apperant reason.

She was nice in the beginning after BD, but the more I detach or distance myself, the more she does too.

So I asked her straight out why. She says b/c I've been short and mean tempered/angry towards her.
Well yeah..I've been short, down to business and distant(detaching), and sometimes I need my time and space. But I havent been giving her an attitude. On occasion I have been in bad mood and even a bit angry, but no arguing.
I don't really get why her anger surfaces time and time again?


Before we broke up she ordered tickets for a concert(two days), and next week she is going there. I don't know with who.

Unfortunantly there is a project coming up at work, and they really need me for it(b/c of qualifications). If I skip work those two days, I will make troubles for everyone and will have to skip the whole project.

So I told her sorry, I'm complete swamped, and will have to turn everything upside down if I'm gonna have S those two days of the concert. I could try but would really doubt I could arrange anything. I also said that I would not turn everything upside down if she was planning to go with some other man. Not for the sake of sabotaging, but b/c I couldn't respect myself I turn life upside down for myself just so she could be with someone else.

Of course she tried the guilt game, by saying I didn't really care about spending time with S. That my time with him was conditional for me.

She said it's not any of my business, and that sooner or later she could be in a situation with another man and then I would sooner or later have to have S while she spends time with OM.

I tried again to make my point about it not being to sabotage, but not sure if she believed it. She said she wasn't going with other man, but didn't want to say it at first b/c when she asked I wasn't clear if -I- had found someone new.

My god the drama!
Why can't we just behave like adults?
Why can't we put things aside and do what's best for S?
Why does it have to be a game with a winner and a loser?

I know...it's not my business who she spends time with, and I realise she is free. I have no wish to sabotage. But considering how this affects my work I can't really help her. I would feel especially bad if it was for the sake of her spending time with some other guy. Is this unreasonable? B/c I really don't see it that way.

I really am trying my best to put all my negative emotions aside and focus on how we can do what is best for S. And I try to get through to her about my wish; that we can communicate properly.

I feel I'm not having any luck though...
I want her to feel free, b/c well, she is. But I have to look out for ME as well.

I would appreciate the thoughts of someone neutral here;

Am I letting my emotions take control?
How can I get through to her about my intentions and wishes?(Guess me being consistent and showing I'm genuin will be part of it)

[chatterbug]

When you going to stop with the OR talks?

Who is scheduled to have your son then?

Who was going to look after your son when the tickets was originally ordered?

You need to stop with the making excuses. It comes across as passive aggressive. It comes across as you reacting and doing a tit-for-tat.

You could have easily said.

"X. I know we ordered those tickets before. I have forgotten about them. Next week I am very busy at work and have made commitments that I cannot back out of. I will not be able to look after our son the whole time of the concert. So let me see what I can do with work. You will have to find arrangements as well. I will ask at work tomorrow and let you know the answer. Please keep me in the loop as well. Talk to you later."


End conversation.

Think about who was going to look after son in the first place.

Go to work. Ask. Get answer. Send answer in text or email.

Carry on.

Work towards this.

As this is what detachment is about.

[theUF]

This is why I like this forum, you get the truth. Many friends and family try to sugar coat things.

We didn't discuss who would have S as we were still together and living at her parents. I think we just had a silent understanding that either I would have him or her mother. Her mother has been great at helping out with S and she really cares for him.

Now we are not living together anymore.

She reminded me that we even briefly mentioned the concert when arranging when/who/where with S. I told her "yes now that you mention it I do remember we briefly talked about it. Unfortunantly I forgot, and now I don't see a way to arrange for me to have him"

So to be fair, her frustration is justified. I'm the one who forgot.

We've talked about it before, that sooner or later some appointmets would crash. We will see how it plays out when it actually does.


I make excuses b/c I'm sure if I don't explain she will make up her own reasons in her mind. "oh it's just bc he X or X or X"
Or maybe that's just what I tell myself to justify it

BUT

I can see what you mean!
It does come across as passive agressive.
I can see it coming across, in this instance, as me going "hey I don't like this and I'm gonna do X and X to stop it, but these are my excuses for doing it, so you can't get mad at me for it", doesn't it?

Maybe I should give it a long hard thought, do I want to stop it? Would I want to sabotage? Of course, in this case my hands are tied anyway, but if not...would I choose differently?

I will read your post again tomorrow, as well as you other posts. I will reflect some more and try to get it to sink in. I've got to stop slipping. I will update tomorrow-ish about how I handled the situation.

[chatterbug]

there is only one way to handle all situations. Stop thinking of them as situations.

Think of everything as communication.

Handle it with Respect, grace and fairness. Fairness to yourself. Fairness to your son. Fairness to the mother of your child.

Live in those thoughts. You control yourself. This is detachment.

Far to many people here think detachment means taking your time to answer based on some 24 hour rule. Being aloof and hindering communication to by time. Becoming some emotionless shell as soon as the 'FAKE SMILES' and upbeat 'your the best person in the world' hello get you nowhere.

That is not detachment.

Detachment is the ability to communicate effectively on important communications between the two people without emotion and the ability to skip the conversations that are just pounding sand or feeling fact finding missions.

Detachment is the ability to learn that only you control yourself.

We used to call it the smile and wave theory.

Practice it until it becomes you.

Detachment is protection from yourself as much as the craziness of the walkaway's life.

[Valeska19]

Chatterbug,
Love what you wrote above, but I want to give me thoughts on one thing... because I think it's important.

Far to many people here think detachment means taking your time to answer based on some 24 hour rule. Being aloof and hindering communication to by time. Becoming some emotionless shell as soon as the 'FAKE SMILES' and upbeat 'your the best person in the world' hello get you nowhere.

I always recommend the 24/48 hr rule to responding to your spouse. This was recommended to me by Kaffe Diem and it saved me from saying alot of stupid things and making decisions that I would regret later.

You're right that one shouldn't be aloof and hinder communication... but especially in the beginning.. newcomers are often VERY emotional. They spend 99% of their time on an emotional rollercoaster reacting to almost everything the WAS does and says.

The 24 hour rule allows the LBS to make sure they are not reacting.. and give themselves a chance to ACT.

It gives them time to go process their feelings and allows them the opportunity to figure out HOW to effectively communicate to their spouse on whatever the topic.

Of course this can not always be done - especially face to face conversations.. but when texts, emails, voicemails.. it's not a bad idea to take a moment and think.

And as for being upbeat - that is for the LBS not for the WAS. Where the head goes, the heart will follow. At first, it was d@mn hard to be positive around xw but I did it (honestly - caz I didn't want her to know I was hurting)

The more I did it - the more happier I became till one day... I was positive w/o even trying..

... WIN!

Yes - I think some of new LBS can use these as tactics... but there are folks that will reflect in that 24 hr time period or will learn to be positive just for positive sake...

... and IMO - UF will be one of those people.