New Here - The Practicalities of Being A Friend

[job]

Portia,
I see he questioned you about the song and you finally told him no. Notice how the subject was dropped?

How do you know that he's not already moved in w/the GF? You do realize that he could be telling you what he thinks you want to hear? I still believe he's using you for an emotional and ego fix. He's still got one toe in your pond and one toe in hers.

You'll know more about where his heart is at when you visit w/him. When you do visit, sit quietly and listen, observe his body language that should be a good indicator as to what is going on w/him. His eyes are the windows to his soul. If they appear dead, i.e., no twinkle, or he can't look at you...there may be guilt going on.

Portia, I hope that you can finally get some answers on this visit. But, I do think you need to let him go and allow God to work on him. He is using you as an emotional crutch and he will not grow up until the crutch has been taken away and comes to realize that you are a very special woman.

[Portia]

Thanks, Snodderly,

How do you know that he's not already moved in w/the GF? You do realize that he could be telling you what he thinks you want to hear? I still believe he's using you for an emotional and ego fix. He's still got one toe in your pond and one toe in hers.

He is still answering his land line, getting his mail and his apartment would be too small for her and her kids, so I do not think he has moved yet. Having said that...you picked up my biggest fear right now - the move is coming. And although I can do nothing about it, that will be a very hard moment for me.

And you are right, he is absolutely emotionally attached to me. I am trying to control my emotional attachment to him. We've been through so much together (as I am sure everyone on this board has with their SO).

Thank you for your kindness. I am trying not to have expectations for the visit which is tough. The thought that he is using me makes me a bit ill. This was a person I would have trusted with my life. I have read enough from others in the trenches that we may never understand WHY.

I am envious of those who have realized that after a few months, they weren't sure that they would take their SO back. My GAL goal right now is to try to unstuck me from this ruminating. I thought I would be doing much better by now.

[Hopefull2]

It was the first thing that seemed like the right thing to do, but honestly, I am just not sure. Themore I read and the more advice I get or read, I go around in more circles.

Detaching seems like a fabulous concept to me right now. I am working on it. It is hard work.

Portia, thanks for the link. Turns out i had read this early on and this has been one of my "goals" that changed how i was dealing with my sitch. But I am not naive, and I understand that my first priority was to protect my heart and my emotional stability. Thus the importance of detaching and going dim (limiting contact). While I am trying to build and nurture my friendship with my W I am constantly evaluating my emotional health and my detachment. That is important for all of us in this sitch. If the contact and or conversations are only tearing one down what is the point? Stay focused on yourself and become the better person.

[Portia]

Thanks for your post, Hopeful. Seems we are trekking the same mountain.

While I am trying to build and nurture my friendship with my W I am constantly evaluating my emotional health and my detachment. That is important for all of us in this sitch. If the contact and or conversations are only tearing one down what is the point?

This struck a chord with me and I intend to remember that question. Strangely, I am the one that I think is cycling the most and I have to stop that for my own sake. I am a fierce planner and organizer by nature (not at all the wish-wash I appear from my posts!) and not planning for all contingencies is not normally my style. But I can see that it is hurting me in this situation. I am borrowing trouble as my Grandmother says.

Journalling:

I am really having a bit of a hard morning. Mornings always seem so rough, but I seem particularly anxious today. One of my biggest challenges right now is to improve my concentration at work and to stop thinking of SO. I never dreamed that I would still feel this way after four months.

I just realized it is four months exactly.

In any event, I am working on getting a grip.

We are seeing each other in three days. Is it odd that I am not at all excited? I feel more stressed than any other emotion. I feel like it is a goodbye. It has finally occurred to me that WE really are over, that there is a new woman in his life that has priority over me. Certainly, he has not given me the impression that terrible news is coming, but then again, I did not see BD coming either.

Since Sunday night there has been some texting, but always very brief. I initiated them both (inside jokes) and seriously could have kicked myslef later. But as I sit here, he has just sent one to me. I wonder if his ears were ringing.

It is taking tons of self-control not to answer but I really need to stop pursuing even in the smallest of ways.

I really need to find my PMA - or the visit will be a disaster for sure. And my goal was to make this a great visit no matter what. So, sticking to it and will re-evaluate after the visit.

I am also going to find that girl, that me, that he met so long ago. She would have kicked his rear end to the curb and spit in his face for this.

For now, I need to convince myself that work is not boring and that it needs to be done.

Thanks for listening.

[mizjjd]

Hi Portia.

It sounds like you are moving in the right direction.

He may not think there's terrible news because possibly in his mind its all already settled. He may very well see your visit as just that, a visit with an old flame. Remember to have no expectations - something I find hard to do myself.

Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

And btw, you don't come across to me as wishy washy. Stunned, shocked, dismayed, but not wishy washy or weak. You, like many of us, have simply been blind sided. That's bound to be disorienting.

[kml]

Portia - just a few random thoughts:

I have seen here, several times, where they guy who "didn't want kids" suddenly remembers "oh wait, I forgot to have kids" once they hit a certain age. Often this is really problematic for the LBS, especially if she had given up her own dreams of having children in order to be with her partner.

On the other hand, your SO may simply be caught up in an affair of opportunity (after all, you weren't there and she was - and let's face it, phone s*x just isn't the same as the real thing), in which case, it may be a GOOD thing if he moves in with her. Raising OTHER people's kids is not NEARLY as much fun as raising your own. And if her kids are over 5, odds are they might resent this new intruder and may make life difficult for him. Instant reality check.

I think you also have to ask yourself - IF he were to wake up and want to come back to you, what would the new parameters of the relationship be? Obviously long distance isn't working - would either of you be willing to make the career sacrifices necessary to move together?

Also - a practical question about finances. Since you've been together for such a long time, I assume there may be joint assets (a home, investments of any type?). If so, you should get immediate legal counsel about how best to protect your share of your joint assets, since you don't have the legal protection of marriage.

[Portia]

Hi Mrs.

Thank you for your kind words.

I read through your thread as well. Wow, at the beginning of all of this I wondered if trying to DB with the "spouse in the house" would be easier. Now I realize that none of this is easy!

He may not think there's terrible news because possibly in his mind its all already settled. He may very well see your visit as just that, a visit with an old flame. Remember to have no expectations - something I find hard to do myself.

Even though we are not supposed to mind read, I think you are exactly right. I am trying to have no expectations - good or bad - but the "bad" just keep creeping in. I am really just trying to enjoy the day with someone who I really used to enjoy so much. Except my guts are hanging out.

I will let you know how it goes.

[mizjjd]

Maybe we should invent some sort of "gut keeping in girdle".

Good luck with your day, "Live in the Moment" as Jason Mraz sings.

I'll check in with you later.

[Portia]

KML, thank you so much for your thoughts and for stopping by.

I have seen here, several times, where they guy who "didn't want kids" suddenly remembers "oh wait, I forgot to have kids" once they hit a certain age. Often this is really problematic for the LBS, especially if she had given up her own dreams of having children in order to be with her partner.

Really? I have actually not found any - always the other way around. The truth is, I have never wanted children. We discussed this eons ago and he knew where I stood. He said he did not want children either. I knew this was an important topic, having talked many family members and friends through the decision. Because many times I saw that women were willing to settle for a comfortable partner in order to have children. I am not saying this is right or wrong, just to say I know how important children are to some people and if he had said they were years ago, I would have let him go. Not without difficulty, but for many children are a dealbreaker.

I have read in different MLC sources that the MLCer becomes a mirror of what he once was. In my experience so far, I would say that this is true. Everything he once valued is no longer valued. But once was not, now is. So from no children to wanting children.

On the other hand, your SO may simply be caught up in an affair of opportunity (after all, you weren't there and she was - and let's face it, phone s*x just isn't the same as the real thing), in which case, it may be a GOOD thing if he moves in with her. Raising OTHER people's kids is not NEARLY as much fun as raising your own. And if her kids are over 5, odds are they might resent this new intruder and may make life difficult for him. Instant reality check.

My understanding of how the relationship started is that she was going through her own separation and he was the shoulder she leaned on. She is not yet divorced - two kids, 2 and 6 and an apparently "awful" H. He once said to me that since he wants a "white picket fence family" that she was a good candidate as "she already had that" and so would want it again. I kept myself from saying - and yes, she did a bang up job of it, too! So, I think it may be a combination of factors which drew him to her, including Knight in Shining Armour syndrome.

And yes, absolutely, the biggest advantage by far that she has over me is that she is physically present all of the time and not just some of the time. When I think of that, my stomach falls into my feet and I realize that maybe he just is happier living a full life in one place with a person who is physically there.

I often think of the reality check he would get if he moved in with her. I understand there may be a sick parent involved as well that the OW cares for. But I come back to how that would affect the progress that we were sort of making. At this moment (and I have learned never to pre-judge my actions through this! So true you never know how you are going to react in any situation.) I think that if he moves in with her, all contact with me must stop. I do not want to phone "thier" house and try to have a casual conversation. So, in a way, I would be dropping the rope.

I guess I feel that as long as he is not moving in with her, there is a larger chance (not much larger) that there is still hope for us. Although maybe a move like that would finally force me to put my hope on a shelf and keep it there.

I think you also have to ask yourself - IF he were to wake up and want to come back to you, what would the new parameters of the relationship be? Obviously long distance isn't working - would either of you be willing to make the career sacrifices necessary to move together?

That was the original plan. Then a family member who quite depends upon him became ill. We (I?) just did not feel any real urgency. We saw each other when we could and were in constant contact. I never wanted to pressure him to move when he was dealing with those troubles, so I didn't. I guess I should have started to notice when he stopped talking of it entirely. Right around meeting OW time.

I found out later (the first and last time I was able to snoop his e-mail) that all of the applications and information I was sending him were deleted unread.

So, yes is the answer. But it makes no difference now. He does not want to move and is now glad that I am so far away. Or at least that is what I think.

Also - a practical question about finances. Since you've been together for such a long time, I assume there may be joint assets (a home, investments of any type?).

Thanks, there are no financial issues to worry about. We kept much of that separate for all kinds of reasons.

[Portia]

Maybe we should invent some sort of "gut keeping in girdle".

I bet it would be a success!

Ever since this mess started I feel like my whole chest is unravelling, mummy-style.

Have yourself a good day. Me, my goal is to get my work done!