He's Just Not That Into You

[mamabird]

Breakdown, you are absolutely right. Forgiveness is definitely a decision that you have to come to on your own and you can't force anyone else into it. The ironic thing is once you let go and decide to truly forgive someone it lifts a burden and everything becomes that much easier.

So how did I respond about the A? I told her the truth about what happened. When she asked me, I said, what's your definition of an A? She asked if we had had sex. This is what I get angry about, because when you hear the word A, you automatically assume sex, and my H knows that too. Some people would say it doesn't matter, an A is an A, but not everyone feels that way and I think there's a level of "severity" that's very different between an EA and a PA.

H has not forgiven his mom, although he thinks he has. In fact, I just this second asked him if he'd invited his mom to Thanksgiving and he still hasn't. I have asked him to do this 50 times already, out of courtesy to HER. This morning he said he was procrastinating because of the whole situation between us and he thought it might be weird, to which my response was, "Well I'm sure everyone can put that aside for one day." He said that was a mature way of looking at it. Anyway, I think that may be down the line in MC, although, it is a real problem, as evidenced by the fact that he can't get his act together and call her.

I do need to get better at dropping the rope - he is continually doing this suspicious sh!t and it makes me bananas. Just now, he stopped what he was doing and said, "I'm going out to get some cash." Again, he never does this. He was back very quickly but I'm sure he was making some phone call or something along the way. I did say to him "what are you really doing?" but regretted that and tried to remember to drop the rope.

He also just told me he's going up to his dad's house the day after Thanksgiving, which means maybe they were talking on the phone in the car, I don't know. I said, is this for all of us? He said we could discuss it. I don't like feeling cut off from his family but on the other hand, they are the kind of people who would stand behind H 100% and never question any of it (I really have an issue with people who don't challenge or question). Therefore, I'll be wearing the scarlet letter there too, and maybe I shouldn't go. His sister will be in town, and I haven't seen her in ages, but we are not close. In fact one time H said that his family "warned" him about me so I don't think they've liked me much from the beginning. But if I stay away, that just reinforces all of it. So I don't know what to do.

[Breakdown]

In fact one time H said that his family "warned" him about me so I don't think they've liked me much from the beginning. But if I stay away, that just reinforces all of it. So I don't know what to do.

LOL...you could "warn" anyone about their choice in a spouse and rest assured, your odds of being right are better than 50%!

If H invites you, then I would go and act as if. Enjoy every moment....enjoy the time with your kids and your extended family. Don't worry about what some of them might think about you....be true to yourself! Don't let them control what you do.

[mamabird]

Thanks Breakdown. That is good advice. I do want to go, so I think I will try to "man up" and just go and have a good time.

I have the feeling this holiday is going to be a nightmare.

I finally asked H if he wanted me to call his mother, and he said, "If you want to." So, I did, and had a nice conversation with her. For all her issues and problems, she is not judgmental and has always treated me very nicely, nicer than his dad and his side of the family.

MIL said she had been trying to get in touch with H and he hadn't been returning her calls. So when I invited her, of course she was hesitant, saying to me, "Well, if H can't call me himself, then there must be some sort of problem and it doesn't sound like I'm really welcome." Of course I tried to tell her that she's welcome but in the end she declined the invitation.

I know this is really not about me, and that I didn't cause this rift with my H and MIL, but I feel terrible that she's not coming. I told H that she wasn't and he said, "Ok" without asking why. I told him that she didn't feel comfortable because HE hadn't called her. I suggested that he call her but I know he won't. He said he wasn't angry with her, he "just didn't feel like talking to her." Uh... I'm not even sure what to make of that. What kind of grown up person says that?

Had an appt with my IC today and we agreed that until H resolves the mother issue, none of our issues will really get resolved. IC also said that if H doesn't start moving forward in some way that I would probably want to get on with it and D him. He said that while all those meds can be good, they can dull a person just enough to keep them stuck.

I told my IC that I feel really sorry for my H, which I do. I feel sorry that he's so lost and feels like he can't deal with any of it. I also feel sorry that he's apparently flushing $150 down the toilet each week since I can't see that IC is working very well for him.

[Breakdown]

I told my IC that I feel really sorry for my H, which I do. I feel sorry that he's so lost and feels like he can't deal with any of it. I also feel sorry that he's apparently flushing $150 down the toilet each week since I can't see that IC is working very well for him.

Is your H seeing an IC? I thought he was just doing the MC with you. How long's he been going? Has he shared anything with you about it?

[labug]

My counseling took much longer than I would have liked to see real lasting progress but eventually, with patience and perseverance, I started turning things around. There were times I wanted to quit because it was a painful process but I stuck with it and now am happier than I've been in a long time (years).

I still go every week and don't know where I'd bee without it. At some point I look forward to not going so often.

My H ran out of patience about a year too early.

I'm not suggesting that you see this as a sign of hope but just an understanding that counseling is sometimes a slow process.

[Wendylon]

[quote=RegretfulLA]

There are definite similarities between our Hs. Some aspects are very familiar.

Like you H's mother, my H's mother was very volatile and pretty nuts. She had good reason to be unstable and neurotic though because she left a concentration camp to work in the UK as a domestic when she was 17 and never saw any of her family again. They were all gassed. My H never knew his father who died when he was 4. His mother was the OW so I'm not sure H's father ever lived with them anyway. His father had a family and a son who didn't want to meet H until a few years ago because he felt loyal to his own mother who had suffered a lot because of the existence of H's mother and H in their father's life.

H was raised by his mother and by a Christian nanny whom he was very fond of. H definitely had a terrible R with his mother. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that he hated her. He had his PA just after his mother died 8 years ago. Weirdly, OW is Jewish and I'm not. He was back to having 2 women in his life: one Jewish and one Christian. Neither I nor OW is religious and neither were his mother and nanny.

Like your H, mine is bright (in a slightly absent-minded professor way) and can be funny. He is also loyal and loves his kids.

Like yours, he has huge issues with self-deprecation and feeling inadequate, and often turning that into an attack on me for disrespecting him. The other day he even went as far as to ask me whether I thought S17 was not focused on his future because he had a father who is a loser as his model. I was appalled that he could think that and say it.

H has definitely under-achieved relative to how bright and talented he is. He was a bit of a musical prodigy as a child. He was also brilliant in chemistry. He wanted to go to med school but got into drugs instead and got kicked out of uni for manufacturing drugs.

Right now (in the last couple of weeks), he seems to have got his drinking under control but he is on 2 meds (Zyban and Duloxetine--I'm sure they are called something else in the US).

Also, like yours, my H is incredibly withdrawn emotionally a lot of the time.

[Wendylon]

I do need to get better at dropping the rope - he is continually doing this suspicious sh!t and it makes me bananas. Just now, he stopped what he was doing and said, "I'm going out to get some cash." Again, he never does this. He was back very quickly but I'm sure he was making some phone call or something along the way. I did say to him "what are you really doing?" but regretted that and tried to remember to drop the rope.

Now that could be my H! He comes up with the weirdest reasons to go off and do something. It drives me absolutely bananas too but less so since visiting this board. I still hate the way he never lets me see what's on his screen. I used to catch him out or question him but I've let go of doing that. While it was really hard work at first, it feels easier now. I don't care as much. It's great that you realised (even though it was after) that asking him what he was really doing wasn't productive.

I agree that it makes sense for you to go to his dad's house the day after Thanksgiving if you can.

I know that when my H tried to leave 8 years ago, he wavered when he would see me and the kids getting on well and he worried that they wouldn't be as happy with him if I wasn't in the picture. He also told me once that one of his greatest pleasures was watching me with S13. S13 is very affectionate with me in a way he isn't with anyone else. H knew he'd miss out on witnessing that if he left for OW. It was pretty much guaranteed that S13 was not going to be affectionate with OW. All this to say that I'm sure your H won't be indifferent to seeing his family together happily.

[mamabird]

Is your H seeing an IC? I thought he was just doing the MC with you. How long's he been going? Has he shared anything with you about it?

H has been seeing an IC for some time. I'm not sure how long - on and off for 2 or 3 years probably. He really seems to like her. Doesn't share much, but I know the that the reason he started going was because he was specifically unhappy with ME. Not our R, not our M, ME. However, never in 3 years has he sat down with me and said, "I'm unhappy with you and these are the things that need to change." It all came out as complaints and attacks, not very effective for getting anyone to change.

I'm not suggesting that you see this as a sign of hope but just an understanding that counseling is sometimes a slow process.

I know Bug, it can take a long time, but I don't really know what his goals are, what he's trying to achieve through therapy, and I've seen very little change so far. My feeling is that he just wants someone to listen to him say what a horrible wife I am and how much I've wronged him over the years. That certainly seems to be the theme, and he chooses people who will listen to that without challenging.

All this to say that I'm sure your H won't be indifferent to seeing his family together happily.

This is very important to H. He is very devoted to the boys and wants the best for them. I'm sure this is a big deterrent to D right now. Neither of us wants to break up the family, and there is no pull of OP to complicate that. Certainly the boys are my motivation to keeping it together and improving the M vs walking away.

Wendy, I don't know if this is true for your H but it's rare that my H ever puts any real work or effort into anything. Now he did put a lot of heart and soul into renovating this house, but at the end of a day it's a showpiece. He graduated from a great college but never went to grad school. Not that it's made a difference, he does very well in his career. I just feel like he walks around with a dark cloud around him that prevents him from really living his life.

[JuneReN]

Okay...so if he wants someone to listen about what a horrible wife you were, I am glad it is a therapist

Some people just take longer to get to where they need to be and sadly, some people never get there at all. It sounds as if he still has a LOT of forgiving to do.

Hopefully IC helps him to look a little more objectively at his own life and how he lives it every day.

Depression is such a big black hole and if this is what it is, he will benefit from his C to begin to get out.

[MKB23]

He sounds very depressed. Sorry you have to keep dealing with that. Please know you cannot fix it. For me, I used to sort of badger my H - What's wrong? Tell me what's wrong? On and on. It aggravated him to death and the more I asked the less he talked. I would 180 that. Seriously. I think Michele even discusses a similar situation in the book.

Also, maybe encourage some hobbies. My H would be much better if he had something he enjoyed and could immerse himself in. Walks are good too. :-)