I am feeling MUCH better today! Bag is packed. Flight to friend's is in 4.5hrs. I am catching up with 2 other friends in different towns so this is a little CG adventure for me.
I reread all my threads this morning and I see I was doing very well until he kissed me. GAL was taking root, headstate was positive, focus was on CG. I just couldn't stay dim and wait and see where H might take us. I jumped into being the managerial wife that I used to be (the me I don't like)
I see that I took my eye off Tumbling's ball and tried to play with H's (so to speak). I have no business trying to control him (or anyone for that matter). I can only manage my Self so back to focusing on my ball. I think I was a dog in a past life...
H knows that I still have feelings for him and want to reconcile but from now on I am not going to do the work for us.
CG is back on her horse (actually I gonna ride a whale instead). It's difficult to ride on the back of a humpback whale so I have to keep centred. I will respond to H actions/texts but I will not initiate. And when strong waves of emotion take hold, the whale will take me to deep waters where the disturbance isn't felt (this board).
PS They acknowledged my job application this morning Still not sure how I feel about what this position might mean but it needs exploring.
ME41 H39 T12 M9 Ilybinilwy 10/2010 H moves out 11/2010 H moves in 09/2011 out 11/2011 Try to fix it alone, give up 07/2012 Tumbling to file 02/01/2013 :-) "Strong on the inside, soft on the outside"
Tumbling, I agree w scaredsilly. The classic recipe for driving ourselves crazy!
And, I understand about the knowing what the "right DBing thing to do it" and yet NOT doing just that. Nobody is "perfect" at this and there actually is no such thing anyway... as we are dealing w people w feelings and every sitch is unique.
Don't send the text. It sounds like an ultimatim & I don't think you are AT ALL in that place yet.
I'm sure there will be lots of advice about the holidays on this forum. I agree to make plans w/o H & have NO EXPECTATIONS from him.
YOu already put the "getaway idea" out there for him to consider, so let him consider and BACK WAY OFF. Otherwise it's just pressure and pursuing.
I am a pursuer too...blargh...but everyone is right. A) Do not send text, he knows how you feel. I am same way, but I have not brought it up in three weeks, even though I want to say "What do you feel now? How about now?" :P
B) Make your plans, don't mention it again. For better or worse our plans are set simply because of the kids-we decided a schedule 2 weeks ago. If he asks, then say I am doing xyz...
Do you look back at this convo and see everytime you try to pin him down he evades, is non committal?
I too have fear of losing the connection w/H if I do not text etc., and even though I am letting go of that, I do backslide...made it five days w/out contact-a new record lol.
yes i see everytime i try to pin him down, he evades i need to give him the space to come to me as someone else said it's like handfeeding squirrels
i AM a pursuer and i recognise that it's the "fear of losing the connection" or how far we had come recently that makes me put my hand in the fire but i am going to leanback on the whale now.
this will probably be my last post until i am back on Sunday.
PLANS - respond w similar words to any texts from H - no initiating - focus on ME - no texts w hooks - no R talk/texts
Accuray posted this to me a long time ago and this is our exact scenario - it's not pursue/distance dance, it's something else
I'm putting it here to remind me
Originally Posted By: Accuray
Here are my observations if they help:
You have a great need for connection and reassurance, as I'm sure you've realized.
H does not feel "safe" around you, because unintentional missteps on his behalf cause you to go off, get sad, and make him feel badly for what he has "done to you".
He probably feels he's walking on eggshells, and he outright tells you that he's scared to tell you when he makes plans that don't involve you because of how you are going to react.
It's very important to men to make their wives happy, proud of them, and to be good providers. When you react the way you do, he interprets that he has upset you and it makes him feel shame, and that physically releases cortisol in his brain which makes him feel badly -- physically and emotionally.
Just as you protect yourself by "going dark", he protects himself by caving and not responding, he is trying to avoid feeling shame for coming up short against your expectations.
What often happens in these situations is that he will come to view you as insatiable -- that nothing he does is ever enough, and for anything he gives, more will be expected. In that context, the only rational solution is to withdraw, because otherwise you'll be consumed.
The truth of the matter, however, is that you are NOT insatiable.
Think of it like hunger -- if you're a little hungry, it doesn't matter much in terms of how you act. Someone would be happy to share their snack with you. If, on the other hand, you haven't eaten anything in 4 days, your behavior is going to be radically altered -- you're going to be ravenous, and will be doing anything you can to find food and eat. Someone who encounters you in that state would be less likely to want to share their snack because your hunger may scare them, and they'd be pretty sure you'd eat it all and shake them upside down to get more. What they don't realize, however, is that if they just feed you a little bit with enough frequency, then you won't be a hungry person at all, your behavior will be different because you won't have this hole to fill.
In your case, you are literally starved for H's attention and reassurance, so you are tempted to pursue getting it with a vengeance. When he gives you the slightest bit, you see hope of satisfying your hunger and will push for more. This scares him and he runs away because he doesn't realize that your hunger has an end, it's not infinite as it appears to him.
This is a relationship trap, but it's not quite the same as "pursuer/distancer" like Labug referenced (either that or it is the same, but very extreme).
In any case, the only way that I have found out of this trap is that you both need to take a leap of faith. You have to believe that if you temporarily suspend your hunger, that over time you will be fed. H has to believe that if he feeds you a little now, that you can be totally and completely satisfied with that, and will not instantly parlay it into more demands.
So the way it starts is that you need to temporarily lower your expectations / needs such that any effort he makes with you is "good enough", and he needs to temporarily try to pay more attention to you than he would otherwise (as he was trying to do before his sailing trip). The goal for both of you is to keep it "low key" for now, be forgiving, and don't either of you let your emotions begin to spiral.
If he's texting you every day and then skips three days, he's going to be scared to death that if he texts you again, you're going to unload on him. You need to make it "safe" for him to text you on the 4th day, that you will be happy with that contact, and that you will not mention or be bothered by the gap *for now*.
It will NOT work to try to lower your expectations longer term -- your needs are your needs, but if this is going to work, you need to work into a new equilibrium with fewer consequences. If you can get into a mode where your "attention tank" is 80% full most of the time versus 10% full most of the time, H will think he's living with a different woman and everything will be easier for him too. The road to get there, however, is littered with Catch-22's and peril.
That's what I've learned about the sitch and it is NOT easy to navigate, it will take commitment and discipline on both your parts if you want it to work.
Tumbling, have a great trip. It sounds like you're doing a lot of thinking about the reason behind your behavior--that's a great thing. Great advice from Accuray. I think it applies to most of us on this board.
Journalling Having a great time w friend I haven't seen for 12yrs. She has been a huge help in confirming where I am right now.
I haven't txt H for over 48hrs I haven't heard from H since the phonecall
I haven't wanted to reach for him nor feel disappointed that I haven't heard from him. Of course I've noticed his absence but its not upsetting me.
Amazing how triggered I got from his coolness Amazing how desperate I was for more Amazing what a difference a day makes I am definitely on the blanket again
Staying on the blanket didn't last long When I was staying with gf we talked alot about sitch. She recognised that this can't go on. I agree We drafted a letter to H. Stating that we can't go on like this. That we need to agree a way forward. My proposal EITHER Commit to >spending time together weekly with a view to living under one roof; >sharing what we both want from our marriage (w professional help) >agreeing how we can both be satisfied in this relationship OR >start divorce proceedings on the gorunds that we have been separated for 2 years. Asked for to hear his thoughts/alternative suggestions. Stated that I didn't want an ansa now but by January so next year will be different.
I felt very strong and sure of my path when I left there. That I would show H, I respected my Self and my life and if nothing else he would see I respected my Self more than he did.
Met another friend (a man who had left his wife twice and returned twice and is now in counselling and sorted and very happy). He said being direct may not work with H that you have to touch the heart strings.
I got train to another friend's - thursday There I text H an update of my trip. No ansa. Friday I text - not heard from you - are you ok? He replied - I'm fine, extremely busy, glad you are having a good trip. I liked the photos.
Today I felt unsettled earlier today. I don't want to send the letter. What's the point? He hasn't wanted to work on this for 2 years. He is who he is. I reread my list of sorrys that I wrote on my previous threads and made myself cry for the things I did wrong.
I rewrote the letter and added "I am not saying this to control you. I am stating to you that I want a man who is physically in my life and spends time with me. You are free to choose if this is what you want to be."
I haven't sent letter.
I got train to London Text H - hello, fancy a bit of texting? H - I can't really. I'm in the pub with some mates watching the rugby x Me - understood. enjoy the game x
I arrived in London Me: We talked last week about you maybe meeting my train and going for dinner tonight. I figure you have other plans but can you confirm so I can make alternative arrangements
Nothing An hour later Me: It's ok H. I'm not cross. It was only a maybe. I've made arrangements.
Nothing I cried most of the way on the train. I just keep thinking - it's over, it's over, it's over. And - he doesn't want me And - this is so sad when i wanted it to work And - it's all my fault that he left And - why did i let him back in when I was so strong?
A real pity party - in public!
I got home and read my sorry list again And I realised I've stood for my marriage for 2 years and accepted all this crap because: I believe I deserve this treatment for what I did wrong I am punishing my Self I don't judge people (as I don't wish to be judged) and I believe he's broken but can be mended.
And I sobbed my heart out for an hour
And then I txt H (I did this because I was totally on the floor) - I'm scared H. My head's fkd. I've really enjoyed hearing from you and spending time with you recently. And now I feel you're pushing me away. I'm losing it. I cried on the train tonight. I love you so much. It hurts that we are apart. I want you in my life but I fear you want to let me go. If that's true pls tell me and I'll leave you alone. I just want you to be happy and if you're happier without me, then so be it x
And then I cried some more
And another reason I am such a mess is because of EAguy I told my gf about him and she said he sounded like a nice guy and on the last night she made me write a list of all the things we have in common and it was far more than me and H.
He text me when I was away to find out how my trip was going and to ask if i wanted to see something at the theatre and that that just highlighted what H is not giving me.
Anyways I've realised I have to forgive my Self for the things I think I did wrong and MOVE PAST IT.
I have also decided that I deserve far more than I am getting from H and I know that if H was just some guy I'd met I wouldn't put up w this deal but because he is H and that I know his history I forgive him.
In writing that I realise that I forgive my H more than I forgive me.
I want to be glued to the blanket.
There's still a piece of me that wishes it was different... but I am learning that I can not make it so.
Keep on pushing through
Thanks for reading
ME41 H39 T12 M9 Ilybinilwy 10/2010 H moves out 11/2010 H moves in 09/2011 out 11/2011 Try to fix it alone, give up 07/2012 Tumbling to file 02/01/2013 :-) "Strong on the inside, soft on the outside"
Tumbling, sorry to hear what you've gone through. I thought this trip was going to be really good for you :-(
Yes, you slipped and dumped DBing in the trash, but that's what you felt you had to do. I've felt that way before, and releasing my real thoughts and feelings made all the difference.
Two years is a long time. You've been very patient. Michelle Weiner talks about a point in which the DBing spouse just had enough, and that only she knows when she's reached that point. Maybe you're there?
Anyway, big hug, and prayers for peace and comfort to you ((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))
