Man I feel for you, I know this totally svcks...from what you have written, your W thinks she is D, even if she hasn't filed, so here's what I did when W was in the same place doing the same crap as your W, oh, about a year ago...
I svcked it up, waited it out.
I worked on me.
I figured out why my ego was having such a hard time. I keep reading in your posts your EGO talking quite a bit. I would look into why that is. There is wisdom, maybe a bit of grace, there to be found. It's hard, but worth it, I promise.
I figured out how to detach. Your W is a free human being, no matter what. You cannot control her actions, only she can. Accept this. It is reality.
She wants some excitement, drama, validation that she's still got it right now? I mean, going for an engaged guy??? Really? Sounds like someone wants a notch in their gun, stealing attention from an engaged guy, must mean she's extra special, right? Oh, an since he's engaged and going for her, he must be quite the high quality dude....right! Or maybe she is going for him BECAUSE he is engaged, therefore not a real relationship threat so he'll never see the "real" her...who knows, man.
If you can step back from yourself on this and look at it like a scientist or something, what do you really see?
I waited my W's replay out, twice with a break in between from 2009 and now,though I did get to a point, maybe where you are at, where I did tell her "Fine, leave" in early spring this year. I think she is pretty much done with her OMs, based on her actions and some of what she says in a non-direct way. But I don't know for sure, and that's not bothering me anymore too much. Only when my ego feels threatened and wants to control something so it feels secure do I get bothered by it it seems.
Have you seen a lawyer yet, just to get info on your rights, etc?
If you choose to kick her out, be sure to see a L first, and then be ready to follow through or she will never respect you again....
Our spouses know us so well (hey, we trained them), she probably can tell that what she is doing is bothering you, and she is probably seeing your controlling side, as she expects it. Mlc'ers can be malicious, my W was sometimes.
I was at the end of my patience so many times, had I given in to my impatience, I wouldn't be where I am now, with W slowly finding that road I left out, paved and smooth.
Quote:
I hate my life right now !!!
Oh man, did I ever say that a lot! I don't say it anymore, and my W's actions, words, crisis or recovery has little to with why I don't say it anymore........
T^2
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
Man I feel for you, I know this totally svcks...from what you have written, your W thinks she is D, even if she hasn't filed, so here's what I did when W was in the same place doing the same crap as your W, oh, about a year ago...
I svcked it up, waited it out.
I worked on me.
I figured out why my ego was having such a hard time. I keep reading in your posts your EGO talking quite a bit. I would look into why that is. There is wisdom, maybe a bit of grace, there to be found. It's hard, but worth it, I promise.
I figured out how to detach. Your W is a free human being, no matter what. You cannot control her actions, only she can. Accept this. It is reality.
She wants some excitement, drama, validation that she's still got it right now? I mean, going for an engaged guy??? Really? Sounds like someone wants a notch in their gun, stealing attention from an engaged guy, must mean she's extra special, right? Oh, an since he's engaged and going for her, he must be quite the high quality dude....right! Or maybe she is going for him BECAUSE he is engaged, therefore not a real relationship threat so he'll never see the "real" her...who knows, man.
If you can step back from yourself on this and look at it like a scientist or something, what do you really see?
I waited my W's replay out, twice with a break in between from 2009 and now,though I did get to a point, maybe where you are at, where I did tell her "Fine, leave" in early spring this year. I think she is pretty much done with her OMs, based on her actions and some of what she says in a non-direct way. But I don't know for sure, and that's not bothering me anymore too much. Only when my ego feels threatened and wants to control something so it feels secure do I get bothered by it it seems.
Have you seen a lawyer yet, just to get info on your rights, etc?
If you choose to kick her out, be sure to see a L first, and then be ready to follow through or she will never respect you again....
Our spouses know us so well (hey, we trained them), she probably can tell that what she is doing is bothering you, and she is probably seeing your controlling side, as she expects it. Mlc'ers can be malicious, my W was sometimes.
I was at the end of my patience so many times, had I given in to my impatience, I wouldn't be where I am now, with W slowly finding that road I left out, paved and smooth.
Quote:
I hate my life right now !!!
Oh man, did I ever say that a lot! I don't say it anymore, and my W's actions, words, crisis or recovery has little to with why I don't say it anymore........
T^2
Yes I am to but I miss my wife terrible I am not egotistical but this guy is so ugly !!! But he is 7 feet tall maybe he has a huge ---- OMG - I don't get it !!! Ok I am trying !!!!
How long has your wifes MLC been going on ??? Yes he told me to let her make the 1st move. Nope can't it's both of ours house. I am just pissed that she knows that I know - I think the guy is a wimp he was shaking when I looked at him today - I can always send a copy of his texts to his Fiance I am thinking about telling her - to save her from marrying this a$$hole - they been together 5 years - her mother just lost her whole house and 2 cars in the storm and this is how he is acting while she is out taking care of her mom !!! Unreal
Like I said seeing this much mania and evil in someone who was so special is very sad -- what else can I tell you -- I won't get over it -- I also don't get her friend Genine supporting her so much but she has an open marriage sooo
A question - how have you forgiven all this behavior - do you know for a fact she has slept with someone else ???
Thanks a million T2 !!
Sunny
If someone decides there is no goodness in you they won't be able to see it. I'll take a BLT over a MLC anyday !!!
Sunny, Do not send the messages to the guy's fiance. If he is doing things behind her back, she will catch on quite quickly. As for your w, she may have been doing all of this flirting to see what your reaction would be or just to get you some gas. They love to jerk our chains and enjoy watching us twist and turn in the wind. Don't give her that pleasure. The less you react to her behavior, the better. They crave attention, whether it is positive or negative...they don't care.
What I would suggest is that if you still have the messages, print them off or store them in a safe place.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Sunny, Do not send the messages to the guy's fiance. If he is doing things behind her back, she will catch on quite quickly. As for your w, she may have been doing all of this flirting to see what your reaction would be or just to get you some gas. They love to jerk our chains and enjoy watching us twist and turn in the wind. Don't give her that pleasure. The less you react to her behavior, the better. They crave attention, whether it is positive or negative...they don't care. What I would suggest is that if you still have the messages, print them off or store them in a safe place.
I actually took pictures of the actual messages ON her phone - so that is better than just the words which I got totally wrong by the way.
Its gonna be hard I see them all the time - but I will keep my trap shut - did I make a mistake giving him my best "I know what you're up to" look ??
One thing Snod - I am having a hard time with my wife's immorality - why would she go after someone fiance - not like her I don't get it.
Thanks again !!
Sunny
If someone decides there is no goodness in you they won't be able to see it. I'll take a BLT over a MLC anyday !!!
I think I might have given you the wrong impression by my use of "ego"...I did not mean ego as in "That dude has an out of control ego", but rather this:
1. The self, especially as distinct from the world and other selves. 2. In psychoanalysis, the division of the psyche that is conscious, most immediately controls thought and behavior, and is most in touch with external reality.
The part of all of us that is wounded, embarrassed, fearful, tries to control external reality, that says "should". I hope that clears things up, and I apologize if you took my ramblings as I thought you were egotistical, I don't. I see in your writing that you still are trying to control things quite a bit, and I get that, I was there for a long time, and still slip and slide with that sometimes. I see improvement from your early posts, but it's tough, i know. Sort of like you still have God in the co-pilot seat a lot, when He needs to be in the pilot's seat full time, and you in the co-pilot's... I hope that conveys what I intend...
The ego work I was referring to was the part of me that was hurt, shamed, humiliated, emasculated, and crazy with needing to know what W was up to, and even getting paranoid....that when at work or whatever, that guys were looking at me like "Oh, you're T^2, I know all about YOUR wife, HA!" (W was really into the vidchat and phone sex on adult hookup sites, and went from safer long distance to local, based on the caller ID history when I still snooped)...anyway...came a point where I was so butthurt and paranoid that something woke up and said..."WTH am I allowing this person to control my feelings, my days, my experience??? I can't control a free human being, she is not my chattel, these are her, unfortunate, choices. And why is again I give a rip what other people think, I wasn't big on that through most of my life, so why now??? What is wrong with me?" This was the beginning of me taking back MY power, and my own journey. that's what I meant by ego and working with it, and what there is to find there.
My W's mlc started in 2008 when her father died, closing the door to resolving issues from her childhood (detailed in my first thread). of course, this is piecing things together in hindsight. Her first dive into replay was summer of 2009 to fall 2010. Yes, there was a brief PA, but the EA that went on and on hurt worse. I made a lot of changes and OM showed his true self (and yes, definitely affaired down...way down in quality of person). Things got better, but she was still troubled, and I didn't help by slipping in my changes, and we commenced phase 2...this round I do not know if anything went PA, but there were at least 3 EA type OMs, based on her behavior and the time she was flaunting it, and some of my own snooping then after my oldest discovered the "stuff" she left behind on his computer (which I took the blame for, she doesn't know he discovered it yet, as far as I know). This round she also went full bore with the wanting to leave ILYBNILWY, venomous spew, cutting me off, etc.
Forgiven her? Yes, FOR MY SAKE, and the kids' sake, then hers. It took a long time to find that within myself, and a lot of "ego" work, and faith in God, life, myself, her, "us". I had to look long and hard into the mirror, and a lot of self re-assessment, to truly find that within myself.
I hope that answers your questions some.
A couple of comments:
-I have known quite a few couples with an open marriage and Genine's behavior is unusual in my experience...usually open M/poly couples are VERY clear and adamant about keeping things above board, that the spouse knows and is okay with what will happen, before it happens. Just my experience.
-About her "toys"- If things were great between you and none of this was going on, what would you think of them then?
- STOP SNOOPING - For YOUR sanity!
T^2
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
Sunny, You have to remember that you wife is the exact opposite of who she was pre-crisis. She's going to do a lot of things that are out of character for her before her crisis is over. So, you need to learn to accept her for who she is today and not who she was long ago.
T's provided some very good advice and explanations.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Thanks T2 man is that a lot of GREAT information - I guess I gotta get myself ready for a LONG LONG trip - ok this is a couple more years !!!
Originally Posted By: TSquared2
A couple of comments: -I have known quite a few couples with an open marriage and Genine's behavior is unusual in my experience...usually open M/poly couples are VERY clear and adamant about keeping things above board, that the spouse knows and is okay with what will happen, before it happens. Just my experience.
That's cuz like you said in my wifes mind she is divorced and in Genines mind she is divorced as well.
[/quote}-About her "toys"- If things were great between you and none of this was going on, what would you think of them then? - STOP SNOOPING - For YOUR sanity! T^2 [/quote]
I don't mind the toys if I wasn't able to make love but why not have the real thing - you're right it's my ego !!! GOD IS THE PILOT - that's why I am letting this thing with my neighbor go !!
Can't thank you enough T2 !!
If someone decides there is no goodness in you they won't be able to see it. I'll take a BLT over a MLC anyday !!!
I saw where you are looking for Eric. Eric lives in CT and his area may have been hit by the storm. Also, if you are trying to PM from this site, it will not work because the PM capability has never been turned on.
I hope he is OK - I am starting to get concerned about him - maybe he is away with his HOT girlfriend LOL !!
I wish the PM worked I think this is kinda silly is there a suggestion box somewhere ??
[/quote] Sunny, You have to remember that you wife is the exact opposite of who she was pre-crisis. She's going to do a lot of things that are out of character for her before her crisis is over. So, you need to learn to accept her for who she is today and not who she was long ago. T's provided some very good advice and explanations. Thanks Snod !! Sunny [/quote] I get it but morality was a big part of her character.
If someone decides there is no goodness in you they won't be able to see it. I'll take a BLT over a MLC anyday !!!
I don't mind the toys if I wasn't able to make love but why not have the real thing - you're right it's my ego
Something for your consideration...the toys have been part of W and I's whole relationship...they really helped her learn about herself and how her "response" functions, etc (trying to keep this G-rated) so that she knew, and could communicate that, and a lover with self-knowledge is a better lover. She also used them to "keep the motor running" because after kids, we would go a while in between due to family, work, time and stress pressure.
Heck, us guys have it easy in that area, we're not as intricate, complicated and hidden.
All that said, I get how you feel right now about them, because I am not getting any, and she had new ones that we didn't buy together, and maybe from some OM, so yeah...they threatened my ego and p1ssed me off at first. That's when I had to look at the big picture and realize that they mean nothing, and are not a threat. And if this is something new for your W as far as you know, then it could just be her learning about herself if she never really did before.
Just a possibility...
T^2
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
I don't mind the toys if I wasn't able to make love but why not have the real thing - you're right it's my ego
Something for your consideration...the toys have been part of W and I's whole relationship...they really helped her learn about herself and how her "response" functions, etc (trying to keep this G-rated) so that she knew, and could communicate that, and a lover with self-knowledge is a better lover. She also used them to "keep the motor running" because after kids, we would go a while in between due to family, work, time and stress pressure. Heck, us guys have it easy in that area, we're not as intricate, complicated and hidden. All that said, I get how you feel right now about them, because I am not getting any, and she had new ones that we didn't buy together, and maybe from some OM, so yeah...they threatened my ego and p1ssed me off at first. That's when I had to look at the big picture and realize that they mean nothing, and are not a threat. And if this is something new for your W as far as you know, then it could just be her learning about herself if she never really did before. Just a possibility... T^2
Yeah we used toys to, we were having trouble before she asked me for the seperation and told me she didn't want to have sex till she was ready of course I acted like a baby. I noticed she was using them without me and I and threw them out - I know controlling right -- I am an a$$ - she always said they were fun but she like the real thing more - so another mistake.
I gotta say that as long as you have been doing this I kinda feel ashamed of myself for feeling so low after only 13 months since the ILYBIANILWY - but I gotta be honest at this point being as old as I am and desperately wanting more kids I don't see how I could hang in as long as you in fact on Saturday she told me our other neighbor was pregnant she told me she saw the little bump - I was silent - maybe I shoulda said let's get workin on our own !! -- cuz I think that's why she told me - but I am so unsure these days I am afraid to say anything --
For now I am just trying to get through today - I have to focus hard on ME not HER !! It is hard for me not to date seeing how she is trying hard to - oh well for now I am still able to be ok - though I am much worse than I have been in a while cuz of this a$$hole neighbor incident -- thanks for you're help.
Sunny
If someone decides there is no goodness in you they won't be able to see it. I'll take a BLT over a MLC anyday !!!
