About to separate....

[dorightman]

Stander, you make a strong point. I think was feeling weak in the moment. I Really appreciate the support! I'am not feeling strong today at all. Our therapist told me to just leave w alone, not to lean in at all, give space and only talk about R in therapy. That's my plan.

[Drew]

My W didn't call me names, but she did ask why she had to leave and not me. I told her firmly that I wanted to stay in the M and I wanted her to stay there in the house with me. I reminded her that she was the one that wanted to end the M and break up the family, not me. So if she was so convinced that this is really what she wanted, then I would support her decision but SHE was the one that would have to leave. It was a very calm conversation and she never brought the topic up again.

Yes.

OK, well we're all on record here telling you NOT to leave. Please explain why you think it's in anyone's best interest (other than W) for you to leave? Don't say it's for the kids, they will see YOU as the one breaking up the family because YOU left. You have to understand a kid's perspective, they are not going to understand anything about the S other than someone left, and that particular "someone" is going to appear to them as abandoning them. If your W leaves, even if she takes the kids they are going to feel displaced and will long to be home. They will see you as standing your ground and her as the one that broke things up WHICH SHE IS. If you're doing this just because your W called you names then ask yourself how that makes you look in her eyes when you're willing to capitulate every time she throws a bad word at you. Leaving is a total lose-lose proposition for you.

YES!!

[mamabird]

She's going to try to push you as far as you can. Do not give in to it!

Listen, back in July my H wrote me an email saying "Our marriage is over, period. Let me know when you can accept that."

Now things are 100% better because I stood my ground and just LOVED him. We still have a very long way to go, but at least he's not throwing the D word around.

Do NOT talk about your R, do NOT talk about your past. Focus on the "new you" and what changes you are going to make starting today. Someone on here said "be the change you want to see." If you can do that, you'll have a shot. But living in the past is not productive. Treat your M like it's a brand new relationship, with a brand new you.

[dorightman]

Thanks Regretful,I really appreciate the support from you and everyone else, especially, Stander & Bond, Hey, that sounds like a good name for a company. Anyways, I have alot of work for the next few days and a storm is about to hit the NE, so hopefully I'll be ok until our next therapy session Be well folks.

[AnotherStander]

Stander, you make a strong point. I think was feeling weak in the moment. I Really appreciate the support! I'am not feeling strong today at all. Our therapist told me to just leave w alone, not to lean in at all, give space and only talk about R in therapy. That's my plan.

You're quite welcome! I agree with your therapist and RegretfulLA, table all R talks. It's one of the DB tips too:

20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while).

You might consider giving MC a rest too. IC is fine, but it doesn't sound like the MC is going anywhere. Once we quit going to MC I totally dropped all R talk and things settled down a lot after that.

[dorightman]

Another sleepless night! It's SOOOOO HARD to DB while you live together. I feel like I've failed for the past two months. Nothing's changed, in fact, I feel like she's dug in harder. She tells me that if I would have reacted differently when she first layed this on me(two months ago)by saying "ok honey, I hear you and I will give you your space and move out) , she would have had a change of heart. Now, because I did the opposite,(not move out and fight), she's less interested in reconciliation. I'am getting tired of her coldness, lack of love for me. I feel so bad. The nights are definitely the hardest for me. Today she told me that she thinks I'm sticking around because I'am hollow inside, I'am nothing without defining myself as the husband and father in this family. That I'm afraid of being single, afraid of admitting my failure to my family/friends, etc.etc. It really hurt what she said. And it made me feel angry. I told her and she said that she can't tell me the truth anymore because I can't handle it.
I know I'm not supposed to talk about the R with her, but we've all been home because of the storm, and we've had way too much time together.

[AnotherStander]

She tells me that if I would have reacted differently when she first layed this on me(two months ago)by saying "ok honey, I hear you and I will give you your space and move out) , she would have had a change of heart. Now, because I did the opposite,(not move out and fight), she's less interested in reconciliation.

Again, if she wants out so bad then she needs to leave. She's just trying to guilt trip you into saying "you're right, I'll leave ASAP". How does she know she would have had a change of heart had you moved out? She doesn't.

I'am getting tired of her coldness, lack of love for me.

Believe me, I understand because I was there too. It got a lot easier after W moved out though.

Today she told me that she thinks I'm sticking around because I'am hollow inside, I'am nothing without defining myself as the husband and father in this family.

Based on your posts it sounds like there's a ring of truth to this. I can relate, because that's how I felt for months after BD. Hollow inside, like my very identity was stripped away. But if you really give DB'ing your full efforts, you get back in touch with YOU. You've let yourself be defined by your M and your parenting for so long that you don't remember who YOU are. It was the same with me. But I have gotten back in touch with ME, I remember the ME that existed before marriage, that was happy and content even with no wife and no kids. That me was still in there even though he'd been suppressed for decades, he just needed some coaxing to come back out again. But he's back, and I feel stronger, better and more confident than I have in years. You need to find that in yourself too. Because once you do, if your W tells you you're hollow inside, afraid of being single, afraid of talking to your family, etc. you'll have to honestly suppress a laugh. You'll get to the point where you'll want to respond with something like "W, that couldn't be further from the truth. I'm happy and content with who I am and I have come to realize I will be just fine with or without you." And you'll honestly mean it too! You've got to get to that point.

And it made me feel angry.

If my W said these things to me a few months ago I too would have been angry. But now, I'd probably look at her like she had lost her mind. I'd wonder how she could be so far off base. But here's the thing, I seriously doubt she'd say these things to me, because SHE knows they're not true now too.

I know I'm not supposed to talk about the R with her, but we've all been home because of the storm, and we've had way too much time together.

Talking about R = pressure. Applying pressure while cooped up in a house during a storm = bad. You're really making her feel caged in when you do that. Your goal is to never, ever bring up R talks. If you were able to be crammed in the house with her during a storm and not talk about the R at all, that would demonstrate to her that you're taking pressure off. THAT is what she needs right now.

[someguy1233]

Great advice from AnotherStander!

[dorightman]

I'am so embarrassed to post this, but i fell off the wagon AGAIN!!! I need help detaching and i need help to stop snooping. I always get myself in trouble with both of these behavior patterns.
Once again, I found a note my wife wrote after talking to her friends. She wrote that she needs to stay strong, stick to her boundaries,see a lawyer for her rights, not back down, stay in therapy, she feels guilty like she's destroying me, she wants it all to be copacetic, it's about her not feeling guilty, guilt is making it worse, she needs to not allow me to make her feel guilty, she needs to be clear and not allow fear and confusion to fog the divorce.
The friend told her I'm trying to change her mind and punish her. She told my w I'm nuts and in shock and ungrounded, hurt, scared, angry, clinging, grieving, dramatic, manic depressive, should be on meds
She told w she will meet another man soon!
This morning I told her all this stuff without leading onto the fact that I read her notes, and she freaked out!
I wish I hadn't done that, but I feel like after more than two months, nothing has changed and she keeps getting support from these bitter divorced friends.
I know I messed up again. And I'm afraid that I keep messing up and she doesn't have any faith in me whatsoever anymore, but at the same time I feel like she's just stubbornly manipulating me until she gets what she wants, a divorce.
I keep saying to her,myself and my friends that I will give her space, thats what she wants and needs, and I'am unable to control my emotions while living with her.
I can't keep my trap shut and I feel like I'm digging myself into a hole that just keeps getting deeper and deeper.
I need a DB coach with me 24/7!

[Drew]

Reread what AnotherStander wrote you.