Chasing Ghosts

[Beardown]

LOL My W just called and wanted to talk, then asked if I was going to drop S off. I said I could and she asked if I wanted to stay for dinner? What? I agreed just so I could see where this is going to go. I plan on looking good, smelling good and feeling good. This is a chance to work my 180s.

It is amazing how much children can pick up on things. I am afraid W is losing the respect and love of her own S through her own actions.

A friend of W was at the hockey game last night and texted her that he thought we were there. Maybe by me showing her I am getting a life outside of her is making her twice. The OM was there for about two hours yesterday afternoon but don't know if he spent the night. W said she went to girlfriends house and to a bar for a while but was home early. More lies I suppose.

[Beardown]

Just got back from the W's house. We ended up carving pumpkins and had dinner as a family. I allowed her to carry the conversations while I stopped what I was doing and looked into her eyes. It actually felt normal. It was a good night overall. I thanked her for inviting me over and then I left. I'm afraid Denver you are right though. I think she wants to friends and keep me close while she plays out the affair. How do you tell your WAS that you can't be friends with them until they and the affair without pushing them further away?

[AnotherStander]

I think she wants to friends and keep me close while she plays out the affair. How do you tell your WAS that you can't be friends with them until they and the affair without pushing them further away?

This is a tough one. On the one hand DB'ing instructs to be your W's best friend. Be the person she wants to talk to whenever something good, bad or interesting happens. This paves the way to future reconciliation, because after all, before you dated you were probably good friends.

On the other hand, as Denver has pointed out in order for her to not see you as just a backup plan, at some point she has to think she may lose you. This is what LRT/ going dark is all about- showing her that she is losing you. But LRT should not be about acting like you're moving on. It should be about actually moving on. It's about you saying "that's it, I'm done trying to get her back, it's time for me to focus on myself and my life without her." This is exactly where Denver was when he did it, in fact he was the one that filed for D.

I guess I would ask you this- have you done 180's and has your W had time to truly see them? If the answer is 'no' then I would say you should consider trying to be her friend and continue to show her the 180's for a while. But if the answer is 'yes' and you feel like you've already shown her the new you, then maybe it's time for LRT.

[Beardown]

Thanks for your response AS. Great timing as well. W called a few minutes ago to ask if I could swing over to the house and grab some card board from the rafters in our garage for her. I said I would call when I got done with work. She has not had the chance to see my 180's in action until yesterday. I think today could be another chance to show my 180's. It's tough though, knowing that her and the OM went out for a romantic dinner then stayed at a hotel. I received a little info from a mutual friend on that one. She has been at this game for over a year not with the same OM (EA last year for 2 months) and lied straight to my face about what she did Saturday night. I am beginning to weigh my options as far as filing for divorce. I don't see any effort or change on the horizon and I am getting tired!

[Denver_2010]

Thanks for your response AS. Great timing as well. W called a few minutes ago to ask if I could swing over to the house and grab some card board from the rafters in our garage for her. I said I would call when I got done with work. She has not had the chance to see my 180's in action until yesterday. I think today could be another chance to show my 180's. It's tough though, knowing that her and the OM went out for a romantic dinner then stayed at a hotel. I received a little info from a mutual friend on that one. She has been at this game for over a year not with the same OM (EA last year for 2 months) and lied straight to my face about what she did Saturday night. I am beginning to weigh my options as far as filing for divorce. I don't see any effort or change on the horizon and I am getting tired!

AS has it right. However, I'm not so certain that you need a long period of showing your W your 180's. Her complaints were about things that were not all that bad. Fairly typical stuff IMO. Mine, on the other hand, were much worse.

It is typical Plan A and Plan B stuff here. For reference purposes, the Plan A/B strategy is from a book called Surviving the Affair.

Plan A - is basically being her friend, showing her 180's, opening avenues of communication, allowing the cheating spouse to go about their delusions without calling them out... being Mr. Nice Guy really.

Plan B - Is essentially LRT. You cut off most, if not all, contact. You set and enforce boundaries.

Check out the book if you want to learn more about that.

Essentially AS is right about LRT... that it calls for you to actually be done. He is right about where I got with it. I was DONE and told my W that I wanted a D. I got the paperwork completed, but never actually filed.

HOWEVER, I do think that LRT can be done without being DONE, or reaching that point. In fact, I think that it is essential that you give it a shot BEFORE you reach that point where you might be the one that ends the M.

If you look at my story, you will see that I applied LRT on a number of occasions.

At some point BD, you are going to have to do this. How do you do it?

1. Explain to your W, ONE TIME, that you love her and that you continue to want the M. That you believe that it can be saved, and that you and she can have a great M. Not average. Great. Much better than before. ONE TIME.

2. Explain to her that you cannot be a part of her life as long as OM is.

- that you will NO LONGER be an active part of her life until OM is completely out of the picture.

- That you don't want to have contact with her unless it has to do with "Bills or Boys" (coined by Jack3beans)... ie, finances or kids.

"W, I will not be a part of your life as long as any OM is. Unless, and until, that aspect of your life changes, I don't want any contact with you unless it has to do with [kid] or our bills. I appreciate you understanding."

* THIS is your BOUNDARY

3. Enforce the boundary by ending all non financial/kid related contact. Respond to your W's attempts to get around with short, concise, business like, but polite, responses to any contact.

- If she complains or gets p!ssed, don't be surprised. Respond that by maintaining your cool and politely reminding her what your boundary is.

------

This CAN be done without being DONE. Get it? It can be done without filing for a D.

[Beardown]

I hear you Denver. If I didn't know about W's Saturday rendezvous I would think things were really turning around. She even asked if I wanted something from Subway meaning dinner two nights in a row. I was polite and helped her our with the boxes but said I was meeting a some friends downtown so I had to get going. W asked if I had a hot date and I kindly responded no I am married. I had a chat with a close friend of mine and much to my surprise he said to go dark for awhile. It seems these past few weeks she has taken the initiative to call and ask you over for dinner. Before she just wanted out. I am going to go dark for a while and when she asks why I am not calling I will let her know my boundaries. I have been thinking about this converation the past few days and am getting the strength to do it. Over the past month I have begun to lose my fear of her and I have been much more confident talking with her and maybe she sees that I am slipping away so so she is getting curious. When I formulate my boundaries I would like to run it by you guys. Thanks for checking in I still believe we can do this it gets hard though when you are the only one interested. The only thing that keeps me going is the thought of someday being back home happier than ever. I think se saw a glimpse last night!

[Beardown]

Hi everyone,
This is my boundary that I have been working on for my W. W is full blown in a ea and pa relationship and am struggling with her double life. I am prepared to move on with my life if she so wishes but I can't be second fiddle to my own wife. Let me know what everyone thinks.

W, I want to thank you for the gift of time. Over the past four months I have lived in hell. I have walked through the gates of hell and realize our marriage is over. I love you and want to save our marriage. From this point moving forward I know our marriage will be better than it ever has before. My love for you has grown stronger and want nothing more than to be a family again. However, I cannot let you continue disrespecting me or our marriage. I will be happy to discuss any financial matters or Son but until you have ended your affair, everything else is off the table.

I am guessing she will ask where this came from and my response not mention of her OM simply I have grown up and became the man, the husband you wished I would be.

Beardown

[Denver_2010]

Hi everyone,
This is my boundary that I have been working on for my W. W is full blown in a ea and pa relationship and am struggling with her double life. I am prepared to move on with my life if she so wishes but I can't be second fiddle to my own wife. Let me know what everyone thinks.

W, I want to thank you for the gift of time. Over the past four months I have lived in hell. I have walked through the gates of hell and realize our marriage is over. I love you and want to save our marriage. From this point moving forward I know our marriage will be better than it ever has before. My love for you has grown stronger and want nothing more than to be a family again. However, I cannot let you continue disrespecting me or our marriage. I will be happy to discuss any financial matters or Son but until you have ended your affair, everything else is off the table.

I am guessing she will ask where this came from and my response not mention of her OM simply I have grown up and became the man, the husband you wished I would be.

Beardown

It's my nature to edit! Sorry BD!

"W, despite everything that has and is happening, I love you and want to save our marriage. The past four months have been hell, but I also think that it is the best thing that has ever happened to me and our M. For me, this has been an opportunity to become a better man and to really learn what it takes to be successful in marriage. I have fought for you, our M, and our family. I have done everything in my power to learn about my shortcomings in our M and about how I can make sure that I am better, and that this never again happens. Whether it's with you or someone new. I want to be clear. I very much want it to be you. And I truly believe that we can have a GREAT M. Not average. Great. However, you are still with OM. Still seeing him, still talking to him, and still spending time with him. It is disrespectful to me, to our M, and to our family. I have tried to be patient and to give you time to seek your own happiness. I do that because I love you, I want you to be happy, and because, first and foremost, you are my friend. For now, I will continue to be patient and give you time. But I can no longer continue to be an active part of your life as long as there are any other men. I won't. So, I am asking that we now limit our contact to matters that pertain to our son and to our finances. Let me know if and when you decide that you want to truly work on our M. I would be open to discussing what that would mean at that time. I appreciate you understanding. H"

If she asks where this is coming from, simply tell her that it has been something that you have been thinking about and that you just won't continue to be disrespected. Be honest with her without being mushy, pressuring, or pursuing.

[Denver_2010]

Oh... and this is the ONLY time that you tell her this, except for the boundary, which she may need to be reminded of many times.

And you enforce the boundary. The boundary will only serve you well if you enforce it. Don't do this unless you are ready to do that. YOu don't want to be the boy who cried wolf.

[Beardown]

Thanks for the edit Denver I appreciate it! I am not ready to give this to her yet but feel it's only a matter of time. I can't thank you enough for taking the time to give me advice and read my sitch. It does make you feel like your not alone. I have been reading your sitch and have made it to February of 2011. Sometimes I laugh reading your thoughts especially how it feels like we are on a roller coaster. A roller coaster from hell. I love the Lighthouse story and plan plan on keeping that with me.