After thinking about tonights interactions, I have think I have finally accepted the reality of this mess.
I don't want to make the whole nail painting thing sound trivial. It is obvious that my w is deeply troubled by her decisions. For the women out there, is there any of you that wouldn't think it was nice for a father to take his d to get her nails done. By all means I am not doing it for a reaction out of my w. My d is so sweet when she is sitting in the chair, just mesmerized watching the nail tech.
I also don't think any of my wifes actions are trivial. I finally realize that she is trying to get reactions out of me. She is as confused about this as I am/was. I commend evryone out there that seem to really grasp DBing in the very early stages of their sitches.
I don't think there will ever be a time that don't wish this wouldn't have ever happened, because I will always want my family whole. There will always be a scar. It is bittersweet that it takes this for me to really take a hard look at myself and to learn how to keep a relationship filled with love. With that being said I am ready to take that look at myself without wondering if it will help bring my wife closer. It is nice to have a starting point for my IC sessions that I am starting on Monday.
So along with keeping away from being angry and bitter, I will also add jaded to that list.
To the vets out there I would be curious to know how your transformations went?
Do we as LBS's go through a similiar healing process as dealing with a death? In essence that is what happened only more difficult due to the lack of finality. I know I have a long way to go, but even when someone says they are done, do they really mean it? Won't there always be a question mark? Heck I don't think there is one ex-girlfriend that I have had that I wouldn't date again. And I don't have any children with any of them.
Yikes this started out as a quick post, but things just started flowing.
Me 37/W 32 S 5 D 4 ILYBNILWY 5/12 Sep 8/12 Starting to find myself 11/12 on
I should read the details first, but at a glance, I would say that I probably side with your W. It is usually tradional, I guess, to think of that particular activity as a mother-daughter fun thing. She feels like you are treading in her waters. Has your W taken her to do her nails in the past? Have you ever taken your D before? Are you trying to do these things to get back at your W? If I were your W, I'd probably think you were being a jerk. Sorry, but I personally think you should find something else to do with your D. It's just one of those things that's kind of hard to explain, but I'm sure there are things you kind of want to be just for you and your son.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I'm definitely not a vet and I am also still struggling with some of these issues but here is my take on some of your questions.
Originally Posted By: eyesopen
After thinking about tonights interactions, I have think I have finally accepted the reality of this mess.
I don't want to make the whole nail painting thing sound trivial. It is obvious that my w is deeply troubled by her decisions. For the women out there, is there any of you that wouldn't think it was nice for a father to take his d to get her nails done. By all means I am not doing it for a reaction out of my w. My d is so sweet when she is sitting in the chair, just mesmerized watching the nail tech.
It is a very nice thing you are trying to do with your daughter and if, as you said, there was no ulterior motives in it, you shouldn't be worried about it. Your W is angry with you for lots of reasons and she's struggling with her decision. She is confused and probably feels guilty for imposing this on her kid. She is probably very insecure right now and might feel like you are trying to take her daughter away from her. A similar thing happened with my W, 2 months ago, and it eventually went away. Don't fret over it. You did tell her that if it was that important to her , you would let her take care of it, and even that didn't appease her. Nothing would at this time. Let it be.
I also don't think any of my wifes actions are trivial. I finally realize that she is trying to get reactions out of me. She is as confused about this as I am/was. I commend evryone out there that seem to really grasp DBing in the very early stages of their sitches.
You are right, NOTHING is trivial to her. She is probably constantly questioning her every actions, and yours. It's important for you to try and validate her feelings right now, and stay away from potentially volatile situations.
I don't think there will ever be a time that don't wish this wouldn't have ever happened, because I will always want my family whole. There will always be a scar. It is bittersweet that it takes this for me to really take a hard look at myself and to learn how to keep a relationship filled with love. With that being said I am ready to take that look at myself without wondering if it will help bring my wife closer. It is nice to have a starting point for my IC sessions that I am starting on Monday.
That is the sad reality of our situation but at least we did come to this realisation. How many people just divorce and move on to re-create similar situations because they haven't grown. I wish I'd learned these lessons after my 1st marriage.
So along with keeping away from being angry and bitter, I will also add jaded to that list.
To the vets out there I would be curious to know how your transformations went?
Read as many sitches as you can. Find sitches with things in common with yours and see the progress or lack thereof. Read the mistakes people have made and see how it applies to your own sitch. In the end, the common denominator is TIME. Be patient.
Do we as LBS's go through a similiar healing process as dealing with a death? In essence that is what happened only more difficult due to the lack of finality. I know I have a long way to go, but even when someone says they are done, do they really mean it? Won't there always be a question mark? Heck I don't think there is one ex-girlfriend that I have had that I wouldn't date again. And I don't have any children with any of them.
Yes, from what I've read the process is very similar to the grief you might feel after a death and no, they don't always mean it. The same way they don't always mean for better or for worse until death do us part. Everything is reversible. That is why we are here.
Yikes this started out as a quick post, but things just started flowing.
That's ok. This is what we're here for.
Eyes - "Heres to hoping that I am not posting how miserable I am two days from now."
Arsene - "Not unlikely mate but that's ok, enjoy the good times when you get them. Cheers!"
Freshman Class of 2012
M-49 W-42 1D-10 T 10 YEARS M 9 YEARS EA/MLC 07/2010 Separation 28/05/2012 PA confirmed 31/07/12 W Asked for D 31/07/12 D on and off the table since then
I have done it in the past just once. It was prior to a wedding, post bomb. At the time I thought I would show my wife that I didn't need her, I could do all the parenting. I really enjoyed watching my daughter during that time.
You are right though, and I will find something else to do.
Me 37/W 32 S 5 D 4 ILYBNILWY 5/12 Sep 8/12 Starting to find myself 11/12 on
Catching up on your posts tonight. Looks like you've had a confusing day or 2 here. For whatever it's worth, here's what I think:
Originally Posted By: eyesopen
Not exactly sure, but I feel I am on the edge of something. I think I might be at the point of really letting go. It is a bit confusing, at the same time it feels good. Almost like I can really start focusing on myself, really start living again. I am positive that it needs to happen. And I am still positive that I love my w and I want my family whole again.
Ok, good self introspection, your mood seems pretty good, all the while still realizing you ultimately want your family element to remain intact as the ultimate goal.
But then...
Originally Posted By: eyesopen
Letter to my w,...
WHOA?!? 21 hours ago you posted those positive minded thoughts. Now you're writing letters to her...did you actually send this letter or just journal it here?
Originally Posted By: eyesopen
I am really frustrated right now, she literally got upset when I told her that I was going to take my daughter to get her nails done while my son was at a b-day party. She said that is a mom and daughter thing. I said we are both parents now. I think she misinterpreted that and said what she doesn't have a mom. I told her I meant that we each fill both roles now.
I read through all the posts up through your response to Sandi before I started typing this. Just a couple questions for you:
1. I know you said you took your D once to get her nails done post bomb. Had her mom ever taken her to do that pre bomb?
2. I recall earlier in your first link you talked about her suggesting taking the kids to a play together as a family and that the idea of that was perplexing to you at the time. The nails event, though basically dissimilar to the play, now begs to me the question: When it comes to activities with your kids, have you and she established any ground rules?
Originally Posted By: eyesopen
The last couple of interactions were pretty much damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
Time to start living for me!
I noticed in the same post, you wrote these 2 things.
Again, a couple questions for you.
1. Just out of curiosity, WHAT do you feel you were damned if you did and damned if you didn't about?
2. I get that your were very completely frustrated by how this went. But the heart of the exchange was about your daughter, right? That was the issue. You then wrote, "Time to start living for me!" Why the transition to you?
M-34 XW-32 D-7 Found OM's presence 4/09 Separated 12/09 Divorced 8/10 GREAT relationship as coparents since 8/10
No, we haven't set any ground rules as far as the kids go. This is the first time anything of the sort has come up. The children are one of my main concerns that I wanted to talk with a C about.
About the damned comment...She was upset that I was going to take her, when I asked if that was something important for her to do, she gave me the money comment. I am reminded of something Sandi2 told me awhile back, and that is to slow down a bit, and think before I act or speak. So it is another fine line to walk as far not caring what she thinks, but still be considerate of how she might take something.
As far as the transition to me, I think I am ready to really detach and stop reacting. Ready to start acting on my own behalf. Like I said I am on the edge of this. Trying to make the perverbial leap. I know that I still have a lot of work to do. That is why I am still somewhat all over the place with my posts. Everyday I see things a little clearer. Each day brings me closer to that leap.
I have been thinking about a future without my wife, what it would look like. I am trying to put our old r out to pasture. As you probably well know it is not easy, but nescessary to do, to be able to start over.
Me 37/W 32 S 5 D 4 ILYBNILWY 5/12 Sep 8/12 Starting to find myself 11/12 on
About the damned comment...She was upset that I was going to take her, when I asked if that was something important for her to do, she gave me the money comment. I am reminded of something Sandi2 told me awhile back, and that is to slow down a bit, and think before I act or speak. So it is another fine line to walk as far not caring what she thinks, but still be considerate of how she might take something.
Since you mentioned that your W had taken your daughter before, I don't think the simple act of you taking D there is unacceptable in and of itself. The context you do it in is what matters. (Now in all honesty, just talking to you "bro to bro", that's not something I'd have personally had any interest in doing, but, nothing makes me happier than to see a smile on my daughter's face, so to each their own on how they achieve that.)
Either way, you must set ground rules with your W when it comes to activities and experiences with your kids. I feel uncomfortable at this point about giving you any kind of recommendations because what has worked very well for myself and my XW may not work nearly as well for you and your W depending on variables in your situation. But you have to know where the other person stands, or the kids will just get caught up in the middle of it. The good intentions you will have (seeing a smile on your daughters face) at the onset will be dwarved by the sad and angry expressions on everyone's face that follows at the end of it all.
Bottom line is, you don't want to surprise your W when it comes to your kids, which is what I think you did here. This is the slowing down part Sandi is talking about. You shouldn't care about what she thinks as far YOU individually are concerned, but it's different with your kids. You've got to, just as you'd want her to for you.
M-34 XW-32 D-7 Found OM's presence 4/09 Separated 12/09 Divorced 8/10 GREAT relationship as coparents since 8/10
I get what you are saying. I have decided not to do the nail thing. There are many ways to out a smile on my daughters face. Nails are a mother daughter thing.
I do not want to add more stress to a already stressful sitch.
Me 37/W 32 S 5 D 4 ILYBNILWY 5/12 Sep 8/12 Starting to find myself 11/12 on
Good for you. And after there has been some time under the belt, hopefully feelings won't be as raw as they are right now. She's hyper sensitive about everything, and especially the kids. I don't envy what you are going through.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Thanks Sandi, that really is it. Have to wait for both of our feelings not being so raw. Then maybe we be able to objectively take a look at what is going on.
Sometimes I wish she had went a little nutso like I read so much about. I swear she has read DR and is not giving me anything to work off of. She is counter DBing.
Oh well, had a great day with the kids.
Me 37/W 32 S 5 D 4 ILYBNILWY 5/12 Sep 8/12 Starting to find myself 11/12 on
