first time need help - still (new thread?)

[nero]

You still may be his safe place to return to, my H calls it a connection as says it's a good thing.

i was reading this - and your comments- and the phone rang and it was h. I picked it up thinking maybe you're rite and i should maintain the connection. we had a very pleasant conversation. then when i got off- i realized probably he calle din a.m. to "get me out of the way" because his evening was (perhaps) going to see ow. then of course, me in less than cheery mode. not misery- so that's something huge- i didn't stress or let it ruin my day. BUT- it did intrude into my thoughts and take the fun out of the nice conversation.

I know, it's very unsettling because he's not enough for me (as is) but I can't shake him either. I know this will either end by me or I feel it may linger foreverrrrr. He's committed but with half a foot out the door crazy

oh man - ditto for me. i am beginning to think i will end up HAVING to be the big ogre too when i finally cut him or myself loose out of sheer self-preservation and need for human interaction with someone that actually wants to be there with me. I'm mighty sick and tired of feeling like i'm some giant burden to be around. i mean- really..... i have friends who are more than happy to interact with me. if he's soooooo lumbered with me- what the heck is stopping him from walking? it's sick isn't it? do you think it's a power thing- they just keep us because they can and it makes them feel all in command and powerful to jack around some poor sap they think looooooveeesss them sooooooo much?

i swear - i don't know most of the time and don't care to fgure anymore the rest of the time. i'm marking time here-

But, ultimately no he doesn't "want" me out of his life, but he won't do anything to prevent it.

i know- me too. wht the heck is it with these guys that they cannot make the decision- one way or the other and stick to it dammit. much like their original commitment to us- just decide it and do it- that is that. nothing fancy- just do it...

phone call- need to go- will be back later..xxo

[albamarie]

My H tonight went to N side early for work and is sitting inside ea/ow house. She called his business phone # earlier which forwards to me when he doesn't answer and it was her. She usually talks to me telling me how he's a pain and won't stop trying to have someone to talk to when he's up N.

In reality she's calling him but covers for the call forwarded to me. He insists there friends as does she who has said I can come over and see she's no prize. I DONT CARE!

So back to him being there now...I called her house (first time in a yr I'v ever done anything) and she answered. Through my silence she realized it was me and said to my H "it's for you" as he got on the phone saying hello I stayed quiet and he said there's nobody there and hung up. (he's dense)

I think he answered as a way of not hiding (since he says he has nothing to hide) from anyone who may have tracked him there. Otherwise, I can't imagine what was going through his head. I WANT TO PUNCH HIM IN HIS F***N FACE!

He'll be home from work in the am and I don't know how to make sure he doesn't feel like he's getting away with anything he wants to do. Wow, Im starting to ramble.

I want to create boundaries so when he comes home he see's that his actions have consequences but not "in your face' kind that would make him angry and then win because now he's loader and meaner.

I wish I could just leave...make him see that he has forced me make the choice for him and be gone! Let him rattle around this house, realizing it's not a home very much anymore if I'm not in here.

You said if you had a bazillion dollars would it make a difference, I think yes, because though we would still be disappointed in the men of our choosing we would have the confidence and security to not stick around. Even if we were just getting away temporarily the opportunity would be very inviting.

I don't have a lot of $$$ but I do have a credit card and I tell you it is burning a hole in my wallet calling out lets go!

Sorry this is more of a rant than anything!

[LoisB]

Oh Dawn, I'm sorry that happened. I know the feeling and it [censored]. Its not about you, but, yes, it's really unfair and you deserve to be treated better.

Much love,
Heather

[nero]

hey hi-

oh crap - poor you. RANT AWAY- it sounds totally warranted i think- and you rarely seem to just let loose.

i will be interested to hear how you make out with boundaries and so on. i am terrible at it i think- in my mind i refuse to be treated so crappily- i don't make a fuss or issue any demands - a feel abused and think i cannot possibly accept it- then i do- i just don't know - as usual- i'll either end up mothr theresa or blow up someday- ka boom - blood & guts allover the room - contents under pressure-

i have never dialed the ow number becasue quite frankly- i don't know what the heck i would say - to either of them. i hate to give her the satisfaction- and acknowledgement. he knows i know- i know he knows - i feel like you, there is nothng about losing me that is stopping him from the self-gratification. what could or would i say- don't? i know? can't imagine- hate it and them for all the things they make me feel & endure.

i'd like to be more mystical about it- all this mlc stuff- it may well be true- BUT - FOR ME - i do not see this man as anything other than a self-centered person who has endeavored to "have it all" - lied to me to keep me around for whatever lame reason-= while allowing me to love him and see a future and WASTE MY LIFE ON HIM. (with malice) he knew it all the time - and he did it anyway. i did not matter if it came to his entertaimnent or my heart. face it- he'd throw me out of the lifeboat to save himself. sorry to know it.

. this ow is someone that has apparently been there FOREVER in our life- flirtation back in early days ( i never ever even suspected- he volunteered that) and they have kept each other around forever - that ole "greener grass" out there. what? they were each other's secret fantasy and met up a time or two a year- in retrospect- any time i've had a giant giant crisis in life - and wasn't around- he used it to - what? to do her? i'm thinking very probably. he was never "there" in those times - emotionally. probably his detachment was his stinking guilt- what a bum.

this morning- i look at your note- i think of my "life" and i'm thinking they are selfish people who probably do not warrant our love. i hate to let go of my "love" (fantasy) - my life (fantasy) - even if it's been my own delusion - . also like you- i agonize over this jerk that doesn't give me a second thought. and I MAKE IT EASY for him to do.

does that make it easier to walk- no , not really. the gazillion dollars- i guess would really make all the difference. i gues syou could subsidize alot of self-respect with a million bucks. i have no idea why i allow people to treat me like junk- some stupid egotistical notion i must have that i am "seeing" something that they do not. they are what they are- mean & abusive (in some sense) and i am sucking it up for some insane and unknown reason & character flaw in me.

i would like - on a minute to minute basis- to punch a little (of his) face- but don't even want to indulge in violence or the actual having to do it. (ick ick ick- ) when i put him in perspective- i do not see someone hurting. i see someone self-indulgent and spoiled. his life may have had it's "downs" - that does not justify what he does to other people. nothing does- there just does not seem to be any justification out there in life. you do the crime- you do the time. it is/was all his own choice - knowing the consequences (possible consequences). just "me first" pure and simple. how i could have not noticed this for my entire life- well, i am disgusted this morning with my own insanity over that. love is nuts - not blind. well, blind & nuts...

today- i'd say i am a giant fool to even be here in his life- it's been a depressing morning (poor little gal next door and her wheelchair- stroke victim-diabetic- mother). now a staph infection in her leg- she's got to go back to pa to her job/husband/life- she needs the break. afraid to go- emotionally unable to stay one more minute - we blubbered together for a couple hours- it's a tragic sitch there- she's had her father and brother die in past four or so years too- i cannot imagine where she gets the inner strength to carry on - it is such a black hole & sooooo hopeless pretty much.

even seeing that doesn't make me feel any better about myself enduring this crap for probably nothing. i mean - really- what can this man feel for me???? if he can be a shallow enough for 30 years to have this ow - in touch- gag me - really..... i think that says it all. at best i was a useful diversion - one who cleaned the house- traveled well and was "there" for him. no "there" for me.

think i'll go take a bike ride- i wanted to mention your comments of other day about you being there for the crumbs of affection and left overs emotionally of everyone when they had the need or time (i'm paraphrasing - but something like that) i feel it too. what the heck ?????

what the heck makes us bottom less pits of understanding and caring in the face of everyone elses preoccupation with their own selves- lives - loves, etc. it's a very shabby thing about life- feeling ALONE and not even crucial to the lives of those you (think you) love and should love you. - today - i feel we are (possibly - giant ) fools. well, me anyway. hate to take you out with me- what the heck man??????.......

i sure am at my worst this morning. sorry about this all-

i hope you are feeling better or doing better. h ow the heck will you set boundaries without "going there"??? i cannot even bear your sitch- i don't know how you do. it's sooooooo cruel- really. i can't believe ow can talk to you- i would hang my head in shame if i were her. it's awful- this stuff is enough to destroy one's faith in human nature or human goodness- where the heck ARE the good people with values? i'm wondering...

dread that thought of my mother - she's been on a tear last couple days- poor old thing is absolutely (and militently) certain she's never ever mentioned to me my sister and the $$ she's borrowed and alllllll her hate and anger. OH MY GOD_ ONLY Several times a day for the last decade - heellllppppppp....


and then- the two other sisters - have decided to take over running the show with my mom's beach house - that my oldest sister (controlling- clueless- spendthrift) has managed to financially decimate- oh my Gosh- the people in my life at this very moment make me nuts- i need to forget them. i was even rather "calm" yesterday- stupid stupid me. never relax -

does this junk ever just go away? i think not

SORRY toyou for my rant- maybe it's the mmoon or something. now- bike ride - i'll put it on low gear and work really hard. maybe i will come home inspired to do chores & some work on computer- need to make a few $$ if nothing else (to motivate me). cripes------- what a day (and it's only 12!)

[albamarie]

((((((nero)))))) we both sure sound like we need hugs!

We need to really work on ourselves. I don't think you give yourself enough credit , hey that's what people tell me.

Your pretty active doing things and talking to people. I can go days before having a talk with someone and never about what's going on with me. My friends only want to hear nice things.

I need to work on me, h is in my head way too much! I'll let you know how I do that when I figure it out

[nero]

hey hi -

((( )))- boy do we ever. here's one back.

i am like you- too much this guy in my head. truly- i do not know how we hurry ourselves to a place where we hate this life with them - more than the one without them. i am not cheery girl this morning- another jacked up sleepless nite- oh boy...

when i am "real" (like now) and consider what i "have" with him- or could have- i am not sure there is something worth allllllllll this. the pain, uncertainty- etc. i would say it is my insecurity and those sad ole (happy) memories of how it felt to be loved - that make me stay.

i'd say this morning that i'm rather pathetic in a not terminal kind of way. it's this "being wounded" thing that is holding me down at the moment. i do have faith we can get up and dust ourselves off and tra la off into the sunset. will I find someone else to share my life with (and i am a person that likes having a shared life) honestly, i don't think i will. i am too distrusting now- maybe a bit damaged here - and statistically i don't see it happening unless i go really beat the bushes - and i'm not that girl either. dreary- but trying to be realistic.

i keep telling myself nothing has changed. no matter if i see some hopeful sign or have a pleasant conversation- nothing has changed. i am still fighting it i guess- now that i say it out loud to you. well, i guess that is what db is about partially- not letting go too easily- but the bit about being detached while you are immersed in this battle is a bit beyond my belief. i am less "bleeding" than a year ago- i am by no means neutral. i can gal til the cows come home. my missing "life" still pains me.

what the hell????? I want definition & certainty - i want "out" with no pain or bother. i am totally unrealistic about this- the no pain thing - but i can say what i want rite?? i resent like mad that it hurts ME (us) so much- i am sick of caring what bad happened to him that made him this way. I DO NOT CARE ABOUT HIS JUNK in life - he is a bad person to let it spill onto and hurt me. we all have free will- we all want justice for ourselves- we all deserve it - he deserves the pain he is dealing out- not me. SELF righteous central here - sorry- bad bad dog... i don't like "paying" for his crap life and emotions. still feeling like being in prison for some crime i didn't commit.

oh well- sos w/ me- maybe i'll never get further than this point. maybe i'll just burn out in the end- and fizzle away and be done with it all from sheer exhaustion. probably not a bad thing- maybe it's what finally makes anyone do something they think they "have to" but loath. i hope your mind and day are alot better than this dreary drivel.

i'm going to go get busy and do alot of wildly productive stuff to give myself a bit of self esteem (if i can't admire myself for enduring this crap-fest at the hands of this jerk) i can at least not be a wallowing grub-ball here. ta da

it's sunny and I do love autumn leaves. picked several bouquets last nite on our walk- put them here and there for color. i am going to go (for real) take pix of all the extra lamps, furniture, great junk i have around to send to my neice and see if she needs anything. maybe work on that stupid chair and get it out of my own face- either or-

this is me pulling myself up by my boot straps and getting on with it. had a nice evening last nite with my little neice (14) - she's good company- she's a compassionate kid - she was looking thru my highschool yearbook- i don't remember most of it and what people wrote becasue my dad had died the day before- i went to get the book and people signed it- but i was in a fog. i thnk i've blocked out most of that time and graduation, etc.- tooooooooo wierd and awful at the time. life sure is funny isn't it? the things you do, endure, function thru- etc.

will be interesting to see where i am five years from now. okay- lets make a pact that no matter what- five years from now in october we make sure to check back in here (in case we drift away somewhre) and see what the heck we are both up to. okay? it's a funny notion- maybe we will laugh together over this bad bad bad time in our lives- and compare notes on how we triumphed over evil - ta da.... super-hero-gals - . ya think?????

xx0

[albamarie]

i am not sure there is something worth allllllllll this. the pain, uncertainty

I KNOW - RIGHT! We knew (at least I do) that there was some sucky times that "another" would have been much more fun to be with. Hey, this isn't our first rodeo we know other guys and what they had to offer, good w/the bad. And, we chose these A-holes. My ex-bf is married in the riches suburb - CEO of his firm. Is this Gods way or did I not follow His way -made my on choice to live with now?

I think we miss what was-what we believe could have continued to be. Also, I think it's the whole not coming to grips with the unfathomable sitch to begin with, the why, the WTF! For me it's also the ea/ow the jealousy of his time and attention going to sh!t leaving me as a LBS lonely and pissed.

It's also the effort of now who, what, might I have to go through to not be alone. I read someone here wrote:
"people like to stick with the devil we know, every relationship is going to come with baggage''

I feel like at least this is mine I'm fighting for, not some one yr guy who's gone off. It's the longevity - you understand that better than I do!

I'm not better here this morning - I just woke up and am writing before all my thought muck up my brain

Soo wounded are we all! I'm not that girl either, never had to search.

I DO NOT CARE ABOUT HIS JUNK in life - he is a bad person to let it spill onto and hurt me

Amen to that - last night my H said I'm the only one hurting from this, you know, BS, his HURT is what started all this in HIS junky life of poverty, LBS of a mother, depression, OCD, ect... I had some junk yea, but I grew up once I had a family!

lets make a pact that no matter what- five years from now in october we make sure to check back in here

You got it! Honestly I wish I will say I am with a wonderful man who loves holidays, birthdays, rainy days, me unconditionally, my kids, he's loyal, faithful, interesting, smart, loves vacations, and most of all has eyes and heart for only me, because he choose me , and it makes God smile

You make a list - It doesn't have to be with or without him just what "you" want my friend! Hope for a good day for all! It's sunny here as well gonna go blow the yard.

[Takevowsserious]

"You got it! Honestly I wish I will say I am with a wonderful man who loves holidays, birthdays, rainy days, me unconditionally, my kids, he's loyal, faithful, interesting, smart, loves vacations, and most of all has eyes and heart for only me, because he choose me , and it makes God smile :)"


Hey, if you find a guy like this, see if he has a brother! Or maybe someone can just buy us a Ken doll for Christmas?

The sad thing is, my H was that guy. I am still holding on to hope deep inside that he'll be that man again someday

Hoping everyone here finds their happiness





[/quote]

[nero]

You got it! Honestly I wish I will say I am with a wonderful man who loves holidays, birthdays, rainy days, me unconditionally, my kids, he's loyal, faithful, interesting, smart, loves vacations, and most of all has eyes and heart for only me, because he choose me , and it makes God smile smile

well my dear - i don't think i need to make a list- i'll just borrow yours if it's all the same to you. sounds like what i'd like to have in life also.

just returned from giant giant hate-fest at mom's. poor old thing- she honestly thinks she's has NEVER EVER said all her junk about my sister and her awful festival of gripes. GOD - i hope someone just chops my head off if i ever become like that. this business of life (what is left of it) being alllll about hate instead of remembering the good times- i hope i'm not like that.

now i'm thinking just this morning i said (to you) my h has destroyed all my happy memories. I'M CHANGING THAT to- has ruined them FOR NOW- I'M SURE at some point in time in my life i'll return to my normal self and not feel sorrow or bitter about him and residual fallout.

i need to remember to always always be vigilent and fight the urge to blame and hate. i see how awful it is- i wonder if inside, my mother even has a clue she's residing in the old hate-hotel or thinks she's happy. we can never ever make it thru any conversation lately without her spinning down the hate cindy road. which spins off into how much she thinks i LOOOOOVe her and make her feellike a queen(?) and protect and defend her(???) I never even have to say one word- honestly- she just makes up all this junk and heaps on the accusations til my head explodes and i respond. if she can get me screaming she's satisfied. maybe she just needs a giant reaction from someone and i'm the only one stupid enough to go around her??? GEEEEEZZZZZ- what a way to spend your last years.

anyway- i did some upholstery- it was going okay instead of the problem i had when i lfet it- so a good omen. i'm going to tidy this entire house and quit being down on myself for a messy housekeeper (oops - now whose JUDGEMENT would that be??? he may not be here- but his BLAME BLAME BLAME - is allover the place.


LOSE IT SUE - rite now- ala ka zam- ta da!!!!! i'm okay- you're okay- (rite?)

i'm outta here- act6ually getting stuff done- will return later when i take a break - in my sparkling clean tidy house

today- driving home from mom's for the very first time i considered actually thinking maybe i should just go ahead and sell out of this house and be done with every memory, every nook and cranny of my life that ever contained a momento or memory of h and run (*like the wind). just a thought- but didn't make me sad or shudder- starting to sound like a "maybe" course of action. God- did i just say that???

okay- onwrd & upward here - talked to my neice's baby just now- she wants to "come to my house" - i'd kill for a baby "fix" rite now. nothing but love- the way people should be!

(yyes , even when they're older than 3.5yrs!!!) in my land anyway-

[nero]

get this- my mother called me about four hours after our "visit" from hell (scream fest) and apologized. i was/am speechless. she has never ever in 61 years been a person to acknowledge her part and say "sorry". i apologized too because i was ratty and thanked her for her apology. i have no idea what to think-

i don't even want to say it might be a hopeful sign. i am trying not to think in terms of hope anymore.

people sure can batter you around can't they? i can't believe i'm sayin cheezy stuff like not thinking "hope" anymore. i feel pretty scabbed over and not wanting to get anywhere near anyone anymore. lot of "any"s huh? can you say "raw"???

i'm outta here- hope your day went okay- now, another long lonely nite - oh mannnnnnnn........i know, don't think about it-