It sounds like it was a really good email. No word back from him? You'd think he would at least apologize for giving you the papers on your birthday. I find the whole thing mystifying. Does he know you post on this site?
It would drive me crazy trying not to analyze it! But I think you have a much better approach. You sound so strong. I admire that immensely.
Quote: Hope the email helps you to feel better, Wonder. Remember, no expecations!
Yeah... it did. Because my goal was just to do my 100% to keep up the positive communication and emotional transparency I've developed with him -- 2 changes he'd wanted initially and that I needed to make -- and not backslide into where we were once upon a time. I sent it a week ago yesterday. I figure even if he never responds, I've made those changes permanent and that's what I'm showing him. And I don't doubt that he's read it. That's all I need right now, though a response WOULD be nice.
Quote: You'd think he would at least apologize for giving you the papers on your birthday. I find the whole thing mystifying. Does he know you post on this site?
Yes, I thought he might at least do that too-- it seems weird to me. BUT I also know withdrawal is my H's way of coping with most things--something he's come to recognize himself, but doesn't seem to be changing.
It all seemed so bizarre to me that I have held off mentioning the papers to anyone in our lives yet... just on the off chance he'd reconsider his birthday gift. And because it sounds just so awful to say it.
You know, I've wondered lately whether he knows I post here. I once sent him an article of Michele's and once something from a thread that I just knew he had to read (both were well received). I've not ever mentioned posting here and frankly, it's not the kind of thing I've ever done before. So I don't know if he'd think of it. I'd think he would mention it. Oh, now I'm wondering about this...
P.S. I'm adding buying and installing a new printer to my list of + things... I was literally dancing around my house last night when it worked. (I'm not the most technically literate girl on the planet, folks. H is the techie by trade.).
Quote: P.S. I'm adding buying and installing a new printer to my list of + things... I was literally dancing around my house last night when it worked. (I'm not the most technically literate girl on the planet, folks. H is the techie by trade.).
Hooray for you! That is a big thing, especially when you're not a techie. I installed my DSL myself, I was proud, too.
Quote: the advice was in THAT case you keep putting yourself out there and offering them unconditional love. Which after many missteps and trying to analyze my H to death and dealing with my own pain in a healthy way, I started to do. I did this all last year and he kept wanting to come home. March. April. July. August. November.
Can you point me to a link that would go this far back? I would like to learn from what you had done then.
Quote: Yeah... it did. Because my goal was just to do my 100% to keep up the positive communication and emotional transparency I've developed with him -- 2 changes he'd wanted initially and that I needed to make -- and not backslide into where we were once upon a time. I sent it a week ago yesterday. I figure even if he never responds, I've made those changes permanent and that's what I'm showing him. And I don't doubt that he's read it. That's all I need right now, though a response WOULD be nice.
This statement says a lot about who you are and how strong and confident you are with yourself! You have done all of these things first for you, for you guys as a couple, and also for him. Most importantly for you! Bravo Bravo! I'm clapping can you hear?
I agree, a response would be nice. It is hard to see a glacier move, isn't it?
Quote: BUT I also know withdrawal is my H's way of coping with most things--something he's come to recognize himself, but doesn't seem to be changing.
This is also my WAW way of dealing with things. Running, burying it, whatever you want to call it. She even acknowledges it. I somehow have hope the intelligent people we married will look deep within themselves and find the strength to give us the opportunity. I do believe a lot of what has been said lately of fear, and this new life they created, the path of least resistance that they view, is making the decision difficult for them.
I also hope they can realize what we offer them now, and the potential growth we can have together. Symbiosis is an important factor here, as we are the strong ones in knowing what we do now. Couples are together for a reason and generally one that is weak in another is augmented by the partner that is strong in that area. Guess which one the WAS is?
Quote: The timing near my birthday particularly--that's either being cluelessly self-absorbed or deliberately hurtful... and not the actions of someone making positive steps forward after some time to think and some C.
Agreed, but hard to guess what is inside their heads. As you pointed out earlier, they are obviously fearful. Sounds like you've have a WAS that is willing to communicate, do you think he would actually discuss those fears with you?
Quote: Can you point me to a link that would go this far back? I would like to learn from what you had done then.
Well... you see, don't clap too hard for me yet... I wasn't posting during this much of this time (foolish me). My first thread (Advice Needed, think D is Coming) started when he started to withdraw again after moving out of OWs the 1st time in Aug.
Quote: I somehow have hope the intelligent people we married will look deep within themselves and find the strength to give us the opportunity.
Me too!! And give themselves the opportunity as well. My H also tells me I'm strong... you'd think that would be a good selling point.
Quote: Sounds like you've have a WAS that is willing to communicate, do you think he would actually discuss those fears with you?
Not sure. He goes up and down with the communication. What he often does is open up a topic (I am afraid that it will fall apart again.) and then not go any deeper but go around in circles with it.
I KNOW my H has done so much thinking and feeling about things, but it seems as if he does it over and over with the same ideas, digging the same grooves deeper, instead of letting in any new ideas and possibilities.
One thing that defines my H is that when he is trying to understand anything, the first thing he does is read all about it, books, web sites, etc. He fills himself with information and ideas and tries them out. We are so much alike in this way.
But in this sitch-- he mostly recoils at the very idea of reading and exploring books, other people's experiences, and learning from them. It's interesting. Doing that is what helped me get past being afraid.
wonder
p.s. to Azure-- looks like we are just happening women of technology. Aren't we just amazing?
Quote: What he often does is open up a topic (I am afraid that it will fall apart again.) and then not go any deeper but go around in circles with it.
I KNOW my H has done so much thinking and feeling about things, but it seems as if he does it over and over with the same ideas, digging the same grooves deeper, instead of letting in any new ideas and possibilities.
Our WAS are identical in this trait! How do we break this stalemate? It seems they are doing this intentionally to make excuses to not try somthing different.
Quote: One thing that defines my H is that when he is trying to understand anything, the first thing he does is read all about it, books, web sites, etc. He fills himself with information and ideas and tries them out. We are so much alike in this way.
I wish my WAS was like this, instead she jumps head first without looking into the pool and hopes nothing is there. Always rushing and trying to jam a square peg in a round hole.
Quote: But in this sitch-- he mostly recoils at the very idea of reading and exploring books, other people's experiences, and learning from them. It's interesting. Doing that is what helped me get past being afraid.
Another similarity for us, she is definitely like this. I share your views as well, thats what got me over the hump. But how do you communicate this to someone who isn't WILLING to listen with an OPEN heart and mind?
I guess if we knew, none of us would be here. I'm going to ask my C these and see if he has any bright ideas.
Hi wonder ... been a while since the last time I dropped by.
Wonder, I too, had stated that if CAW was to leave to pursue a R with OM, that I don't believe I could be just friends with her, but I was determined to continue to be there for her until that line was actually crossed and fortunately, she never did cross it. I'm sorry you are having to face the possiblitliy of being put in that position.
Quote: I suspect there is big OW withdrawal and grief and I get the sense my H does NOT think he should feel that... because then there must be something wrong with us if those feelings take a while to dissipate.
This is great insight and one I can see now that CAW probably shares. I'm gonna have to give this some more thought.
I'm sorry to hear H decided to move forward with D-papers. I hope he will be willing to respond to your email and offers some insight as to why he made the choice. As SS mentioned, some WAS's see the D as closure on the old R in order to be able to move on and proceed with a whole new R with the LBS that may lead to a better M in the future. Not saying its right or wrong ... or better or not, just its the approach they believe works for them.
Hey Wonder! First of all, let me give you a pat on the back for setting up your printer (and to Azure...DSL? WOW!). I celebrate every time I do something I would have normally depended on H to do!!!
You have a wonder-ful (get it?? ) attitude!! You are modeling the proper behavior for him and that is all you can do right now ~ treat him the way you would want to be treated!!
Your H has to come through this in his own way and on his own time. I hate when they run from problems, but that is how we all got in this mess in the first place, right?
You are doing a great job "getting a life" and I am so SURE that H has noticed. I think he may have a bit of my H's problem in that he doesn't know what to make of these chnages or even if he can trust them. Just keep up the great work, Wonder!!!!
Happiness is like a butterfly: the more you chase it, the more it will elude you, but if you turn your attention to other things, it will come and sit softly on your shoulder.... (thoreau)
Quote: One thing that defines my H is that when he is trying to understand anything, the first thing he does is read all about it, books, web sites, etc. He fills himself with information and ideas and tries them out. We are so much alike in this way.
But in this sitch-- he mostly recoils at the very idea of reading and exploring books, other people's experiences, and learning from them. It's interesting. Doing that is what helped me get past being afraid.
I really can identify with that! My H is a very intellegent man, that's part of why I am attracted to him. When he puts his mind to something he can pick up things astonishingly quickly. He picked up the local language here very easily and well. He worked in computer programming years ago, self taught. He has picked up his present career direction skills on his own, etc etc etc.
But when it comes to relationships, well, a man can't change, can he???? Or even learn. Or come to a clearer understanding of things.
Why?????
Livnlearn
"The unexamined life is not worth living" - Socrates
) attitude!! You are modeling the proper behavior for him and that is all you can do right now ~ treat him the way you would want to be treated!! 
