You impress me so very much! You're right of course, let's try and stay with in our own heads and not mind read!
It could well be that the C is reviving all the negative things for your H, and if so there is nothing you can do about that, except keep being the you that your H would want to be with.
Quote: How to give this 'space' that all WA's seem to want? I just don't know. I think it's just getting on with your life, so that they know that you are ok while they sort out thier head. I don't mean getting on as in with out them, just allowing them to sort it out and concentrate on themselves without having to worry about you and know that you are in such pain while they examine their life. Or something like that....i don't think i explained that real well!!! LOL.
Lee, I think you explained it to perfection! That is where I'm at, just letting H know I'm here doing my thing, he is welcome into my world whenever he feels the need. I'm diffently giving him space.
Wonder, great job! Patience, patience, patience! Wait, wait, wait! LOL
I agree, Lee, that you did explain that wonderfully. It really struck me as I read it, and seems like a good philosophy to have during all these uncertain-what-H-is-thinking times.
I agree. I think you explained it well, Lee. And when I look back on how long it took me to get there, I cringe! Though I never stopped having my own life or moving it forward, the allowing them to sort it out and concentrate on themselves without having to worry about you and know that you are in such pain while they examine their life part took a while to "get".
I feel like I have my very own cheering squad here. Thanks so much.
Yesterday was my b-day. Lots of people mistakenly think my b-day is the day after it actually is... don't ask me why, but it is a longstanding trend and even my H has done it a few times. However, yesterday, lots of people wished me birthday wishes on my real day... in fact, most people I know, except for H. I didn't expect anything from him, and though I had a fun day and will be celebrating a little more today and on Saturday as well, it still hurt not to hear from him.
Last year on this day, he asked to see me, pledged his love for me and told me how sorry he was for all of what we'd been through, talked about building a future with me, what kind of R we wanted to make, traveling with me, talked about his own creative work ideas, etc. It was a wonderful marathon conversation full of hope and love.
I'm not down, actually in a very good mood today, though I fell asleep feeling a little sad last night.
I will see H at the bank appt. this afternoon. Actually, I will need to call him because he never confirmed the time with me. Way inside that cave, he is this week.
I read something interesting in one of the Hendricks' books the other day... that many times, people can be more committed to their old and destructive patterns (doing what they know doesn't work!) than they are to having the M they want or to being loved and loving others... no matter how much they say they want it, their unconscious committment is really to preventing themselves from having it (not committing to do what does work). Found that really familiar. Their whole discussion on committment was really very insightful, I thought. Has anyone read their books?
Happy Birthday, Wonder! (Can I be one of those people who thinks it's a day later than it is?) I'm glad you're feeling happy overall. Enjoy your celebration on Saturday, too.
I hope H is mixing up his days. Maybe he won't get on bended knee this year since he's in his cave, but he could send some nice wishes.
I agree with that. People are addicted to their old habits even subconsciously.
Part of the reason I think WAS has so much trouble returning is that they are so afraid of falling back into these patterns. They are afraid we will do it and they are also afraid they will do it. Once they get comfortable (to at least try) we won't do it, it is an internal battle within themselves that they won't do it. That is what we can't control, that is the joureny they have to take for themselves. Take heart, you are very Wonder-ful.
I hope all goes well with your bank app. I'm sorry that your H hurt you by not making mention of your B'day, that would have upset me as well. I would try not to read to much into it though, his thoughtlessness has nothing to do with you and is just one of those things that you can't control, it's a hard one to keep the expectations low for though!
Azure, thanks for the wishes! Seattle, thanks for the sweet words.
Quote: I hope H is mixing up his days. Maybe he won't get on bended knee this year since he's in his cave, but he could send some nice wishes.
Well. Happy Belated Birthday to me... my H gave me D papers immediately after he signed off on my equity loan. (please, join me in stunned silence here). Then he said he didn't have to do that, meaning the loan. Which later he took back and said he was happy to do that for me.
I was supposed to go to a board meeting after that bank appt. (never got there). But H wanted to talk, and initially I declined, but I had a few minutes so I did. I feel now that I should have just taken the papers and gone to the meeting and not talked.
He cried when giving me the papers, so of course I got a little teary as well.
I was surprised. I really believed he needed some time.
I probably should have walked away from this conversation because it was more surface stuff.
I did not get overly emotional as in the past, but did get a little teary in response to his tears.
Here is what he said... most of it is not new, but it's not stuff I've heard in at least five months either.
1. This (meaning D papers) doesn't mean that I dislike you.
2. "I can't do this anymore." * Now I absolutely hate it when he says this. As if the only choice is to stay in this limbo state or divorce. It ignores anything he could do... I didn't point this out-- I simply reiterated my feelings that I also do not want to "keep doing this", that we've agreed on that many times, that yes, he is absolutely right about needing to move forward, only I'd prefer we move on from this place together.
3. "I can't lead you to think I am coming home when I don't think I will ever come home. It's not fair to you."
4. "We need to let go of this. Can we let go of this please?" I asked if he remembered our conversations in which I told him I wasn't standing in his way, and he said "but you haven't let go of it either". I asked if he felt I'd pursued him and he said no--not what he meant, but that I still wanted it. So I said yes, I prefer we work things out, and have decided to be honest about that with you, but left you with the decision. I asked if this meant we would be talking to one another and he said "if you want to".
5. "I can't keep holding (papers) over your head. That isn't fair to you."
6. "I wish you understood." I asked him whether something had happened that I was unaware of to change his mind from where we were in Nov/Dec/Jan (wanting us, what do we do now, no intentions of giving me the papers, etc). I said it might help me to understand if he talked about that. He said he would call me later tonight to talk about it.
When he did call, I started the convo by saying I don't want to put him in a position where he feels he is defending himself or that I am demanding an explanation (he said, yes, it felt that way) but that I was responding to what he said about not understanding, that if he wanted me to understand something, he needed to share it with me for that to happen. He got that, and said that he'd rather have that conversation on a night when he was feeling more up to it, so I agreed.
7. I have wanted to want this. (but he doesn't want it)
And then, this is the one we talked most about: 8. "You know, I lost a lot by leaving this relationship." When I asked him if he would elaborate, he (in tears now) went on to say I "took his brother away" from him as one example. Honestly, he used those words and it is not the first time-- all I can think of when I hear this is a second grader saying "you stole my friend".
Some background, this is old replay conversation coming back (and part of this immature thinking is my MIL--she says/encourages this kind of BS all the time).
I was calm and simply pointed out that he walked away from everything, that I did not take anything from him, that of course, I'm not capable of "taking away" people who care about him, nor would I ever want to take anything from him because I love him and care about him. I want him to have everything he needs.
More background-- my BIL (with whom my H has not had a close R) has very strong feelings about As and M, and has been vocal about them. I have become much closer friends with my BIL and SIL during my S from H. My BIL loves H very much but believes what he is doing is destructive and has been very outspoken about this in the family. I don't really talk about H with BIL, because I don't feel comfortable with that, though SIL and I did talk about H for a while, though not in many, many months.
He said this is how he feels. I said I felt disheartened that he would think that of me. Then he says that he knows I love and care for him, that he knows I would never do anything that would hurt him intentionally and he was not insinuating that I took anything away intentionally, that he knew I have only done what I have needed to do "to survive", that I don't have ill feelings, etc.
Personally, my take on this is that this is not really about me, but that H does resent that I have a positive relationship with BIL and SIL and our mutual friends. He seems not to get that it is his actions-- his A, really-- that has strained his R with BIL.
I brought this up in our phone call this evening, and he said "I'm not going to debate my feelings". I calmly said that his feelings were his feelings and I wouldn't presume to debate them (I really didn't think I was doing that). I did feel the resentment/anger when he talked to me about BIL and that I felt he was not OK with me having an R with BIL. He disagreed with this and said he completely understands why I have an R with BIL, when he doesn't. He said he knows it is his choices that caused the rift between them, not me.
It was like the bomb conversations... lots of circular logic. I feel like I went back in time, only this time I asked questions and shared my feelings instead of debating.
And then this -- several times when I said the words "I feel XX, XX", H responded with "that is not what I said." And then I would have to point out that I was not talking about him. And then he would be fine.
So, with all this, I KNOW I should not have, but the words came out before I could stop them. I told him that when he did not remember my birthday, I felt hurt. His voice got all emotional and he said he remembered, of course he remembered it, and that he was sorry he did not call me. I told him that I didn't really expect him to do anything for my birthday, but that it did hurt and that even though I realize how silly it is to feel that way, I even felt a little twinge of anger at him for forgetting. And he said he understood that and that I was entitled to feel that.
Now I feel like I am back to square one, or worse.
