Wow Mirage thanks for that information. I actually saw alot of my XH in what you described. He appears to be doing both sides of the MLC. One thing that helped me to hear is the anger you felt towards your wife. Would you mind sharing with me about that anger you had towards her? Do you remember why you had such anger towards her? What triggered anger in you?
My Xh did seem to go through an internal MLC and then went external. He too was the life of the party, Mr. Social, so friendly and upbeat. A man in love with his wife and kids, and had no problem letting the world know about it.
Not sure if you've read my past posts, but XH was wounded in a shooting at work...via his now OW's XH, claiming they were having an affair. He still to this day swears that nothing was happening between them, but I have a very hard time believing it.
After the shooting he went into a very dark place as anyone can imagine he would. He left two times prior to the 3rd and final time, and filing for divorce. First time before the shooting, second time after...staying with the now OW claiming they were friends.
I do know when he left he was the lowest I had ever seen him. I was very concerned. He acted very bi polar is the only way for me to explain it. He could swing his mood 3 times in one sentence.
At times I couldnt tell if he was trying to initate fights with me just to be cruel....cause he was just down right cruel and tormenting with his words. I never knew he was capable of acting such ways, and speaking such hatred towards someone. Never had he ever spoken to me in all our 22 years together as he had a year and a half ago.
Im so sorry you had to go through MLC, but I am so grateful you came through it, and are here to help. Im sorry your XW went through it too. Ive worried I might go through it, but I realize when I start to have MLC thoughts....it's all because Im just overwhelmed with life....not in balance, and really not living authentically.
Yes this has helped. Anything else you'd like to share I'd be happy to hear.
Hi, just to chip in. I think the internal/external MLC is spot on - and perhaps instead of dealing with it, the MLC can go 'external' as Mirage suggests.
I would agree that many, including my xh, have an internal MLC before it goes external. Perhaps there is a point at which they either decide to deal with it themselves, or externalise it onto others. My xh was so very very mean for a long time. That seems to have largely stopped, but I am not sure whether it is just that we all have very little to do with him, and don't see it, or whether he is now less angry. I get a sense that he is still a slumbering volcano!! But I hope he is less agnry.
Trouble is, once they have externalised the crisis it feels as if all restraints are off, and everything comes pouring out. They are then like a child who has had an enormous tantrum, and doesn't know what to do next. They lack the resources to sort things out [if they had the resources they wouldn;t have had a MLC] and so many of them remain stuck, with some awful OP who encourages all the most destructive parts of the personality.
They seem to choose an OP who plays to the shadow part of them . . . .
Kimmerz, Heres the thing about MLC and why it's F'ed up. I will explain why I was angry at her during the MLC and then what I realized later on. I was angry at her becasue I was angry at myself. In the MLC while the alien was steering the ship it had to be her that was the cause of all my emotional pain. If she wasn't there then I would have travelled the world, done great things, seen great places, married a diff girl etc, etc, etc. All BS since I had all those things right in front of me. I think a true MLC changes you completely. The anger at her was not justified. She was at the time a great woman, caring, family oriented, beautiful in my eyes. In MLC I could not be the problem.
Eventually, about 3/4 of the way through the tunnel and I was moving through it I one day sat up and said this is me, I am angry at myself. The next day the worst and best day of the whole journey took place. The toxic BS was washed away, I had basically forgiven myself(the magic bullit) and then was able to forgive her for being a human being as well.
My life began to change starting that day. Now I still had to go through the depression, wihtdrawal, and acceptance which took another 6 months but the lesson MLC was supposed to teach me took place. I now had the tools to be a complete, spiritual whole person capable of forgivness.
Why do many MLC'ers get stuck and stay angry. I think the answer is MLC is painful, It FKN HURTS. Did I say it HURTS!!. I am sorry you are going through this but you do not want to be in the mind of an MLC'er( it hurts) but a lot run from this pain. I embraced it and kept moving through without running away and destroying my whole family. (I did think about running, but did not, I think it was just luck).
There could have been a few things that triggered my anger/MLC. I don't know what the true catalyst was. I did have a twin brother that committed suicide at 38. Maybe that who knows.
What I do know was MLC helped me to see things now. I believe MLC is a gift but as you know how many people open a gift look at it say that,s nice and toss it aside. Many!
My EXW now is MLC, Im sure. Sadly I don't think she has the wherewithal to get through. I realize its only been 2 1/2 - 3 years but I had to move on for the sake of my kids. They needed a rock and I was the only one left to provide it. There mother ran away and they only see here occassionally and thay know something is wrong. She has done so many mean things I have lost track but I will always love my now X-wife. I told her a year or so ago if she wanted to talk I would, thats bisically the last contact if you will.
My life is now a work in progress. Its a pretty good life. I would not change my life one iota. I think we are given opportunities in life to grow. Those opportunities can come in ways you least expect. the WOW REALLY is this how its going down. You must have a good sense of humor.
In the Peaceful Warrior Soc had it right when he said the 3 things that govern this earth that allow us to get through are PARADOX, HUMOR, CHANGE. If your living through what we all are and have some undertanding these words should ring true to you.
Kimmerz, My prayers are with you. Please do not analyze too much. This journey for you may be the most rewarding of your life. I know at times it is painful for you but you are growing.
Thank you for your post mirage. I believe my H is in the middle of some kind of crisis, and your post helped me see things in a slightly different light. I know there's nothing I can do to change it, and he must go through it. I'm just not sure he'll ever make it out.
I read somewhere that adolescent brains run completely on emotion. Seems like the same thing happens to an MLC-er. It's all raw emotion, minus the rational thinking.
Just a thought,
Heather
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
"Trouble is, once they have externalised the crisis it feels as if all restraints are off, and everything comes pouring out. They are then like a child who has had an enormous tantrum, and doesn't know what to do next. They lack the resources to sort things out [if they had the resources they wouldn;t have had a MLC] and so many of them remain stuck, with some awful OP who encourages all the most destructive parts of the personality.
They seem to choose an OP who plays to the shadow part of them . . . ."
I really like this quote. My H's OP is covered in completely in tattoos, collects disability for some emotional issues, is a chronic marijuana user/alcoholic and has had serial affairs. I really agree that he found someone who can encourage the most destructive parts of himself as opposed to me who is "just the nagging wife."
Trying to back off now so he can experience the full impact of what and who he has chosen.
Heather
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
I really do love this thread...thank you for starting in Kim!
"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter". "Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!" "Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
So here's a question. The OW, in my case, is super controlling and easily threatened. Surprise, Surprise! I think this is why I've resented her so much because I know she has been calling the shots on all this pain the kids and I have had to survive.
Now, this questions will reveal the newbie that I am. How come the spouse can't move back in and become the controlling person in the relationship?
From what I hear,in my case,the OW collects disability for some emotional issues. So, won't this instability be a turn off at some point? Won't H, in his current bizarro frame of mind, want someone leading the way who is somewhat stable and rational.
If I was bonkers, I'd hope I'd gravitate toward someone I trusted, someone who personified stability. Isn't that just a basic law of Physics? that crazy energy seeks stable energy? Why not in this case?
Seems like H, deep in the throes of an MLC, should be easily manipulated and controlled. And, since I know this guy better than anyone, why can't I find the magic formula that makes him at least move back in our direction?
Heather
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
Wowzers everyone! Thanks for chiming in and keeping this post rolling! I look forward to chiming in and commenting on new posts here.
Holy crap I don't know where to start. I was going to start with good news....XH and myself actually on the same page for ONCE and are parenting with one another! Still having issues with D9.
Lets go back to square one, which is me always reminding myself to act authentically in order to live authentically, therefore chose my actions accordingly.
This morning I sent XH two home movies and a long text in regards to D9's serious tantrums and anger issues that are baffling the crap out of us both. I then swallowed my pride and told him that I needed and wanted his help with the girls, but I allowed my ego and pride to NOT ask him for it this past year, and that wasn't right of me.
He responded much later taking me up on the idea that he still picks the girls up for school on the mornings Im here, in order to help keep boundaries firm as parents together that D9 must go to school. I can't tell you what a relief it is to feel a little support from him.
D9 appears to have had it with life and is having a nine year old life crisis and is trying to DROP OUT of school. Believe me we're tying to see if there are issues physically, or perhaps there are problems with friends and possibly gettintg bullied at school. D9 denies this....but D9 is also much like XH MLCer. Stuff it down and lash out.
NOW.... for the OP issues! LoisB....Wow the "OW" in your life sounds alot like the "OW" in my life.
I guess this is the year of validation for me. For everything I had figured out on my own with very little clues has turned out to be true between XH and OW. Spot on intuition is a blessing and a curse. Accepting guideposts and messages from the Divine is all that's kept me going, yet believing that some how some way my XH and myself will find peace between us again.
OW is making my kids life very miserable when they go to see their Dad.
Lois, the only way to make sense of complete nonsense is to develop an appreciation (if you will) for the MLCers irrationality. I like to say that our new Normal with an MLCer is our new ABNORMAL. If you can learn to start putting a backwards spin on things, then unforuneatly after a while you get used to this weirdness.
I think part of them hooking up with people that obviously seem to have some pretty big issues themselves is that it's some sort of sense of safety and control. These people tell them everything they want to hear. They agree with the nonsense of what the MLCer tells them about us. I think the MLCer and OP are more than likely on the same emotional and maturity level, therefore they can relate to one another.
Bea said "They seem to choose an OP who plays to the shadow part of them . . . ."
This is very true with my XH's OW. All I can say is that XH had a dark side to him, and she came along and just continues to feed the fire in that dark place. I know this because his thinking and the way he relates to me has become so damn distorted at times, it's like he's been brain washed. The MLC that resides within him eats this up like candy to a child.
For me, Im learning that standing my ground, and being honest and firm with him when it's called for is paying off. I have no intention to offend him nor do I have the desire to fight with him. But as an advocate for our children and standing up for myself I will chose my battles wisely with him. And if I go toe to toe with him I will do it and I do not care if he's offended. Though he very well may not listen, there are many things XH needs to hear. I have no problem being the messenger, but obviously with anyone in MLC whether or not they hear that message is a crap shoot! Truth Darts is all we can do and hope for the best.
I'm sorry for posting so much. I'm new and, right now, this forum is my lifeline. I only found out about the PA a month or so ago. It's killing me imagining what they are doing. I know he is prob living with her and it makes me nuts.
He has gone completely AWOL as if we don't exist.
I like what you said about trusting your Higher Power. So far, my God has given me dead-on info when I needed it. Everything from the drugs to the OW were hunches I had before H had his Big Reveal (caught them together with my D10). My gut tells me that she is convenient. She is easy--so to speak- and expects nothing from him, only that he give her his undivided companionship in return for drugs and booze. The best part is she won't nag about his drug addiction and she tells him what to do. I'm sure he is hating himself for all this--At some point, I believe she will get old--I think things need to settle down some though. For all my faults, I wasn't a major control freak when it came to his whereabouts. I'm thinking her insecurity about us will force her to hold on tight--at some point, he will resist.
H has seen us only a handful of times since he moved out. Maybe fifteen times since Feb? I think she has been the source of this separation--not to let him off the hook-but H still loves us and she knows it. Coming to the house and seeing us must be really scary for her.
I, however, have been a reactionary mess and made things much worse. I allowed my emotions to run the show. I'm pulling back now--not sure how much damage was done though. I do think H is trying to convince himself that he loves this woman in order to justify his insanity. He has isolated himself from me, his kids, his parents, his brother and sister and his best friends. He now has a completely new set of friends.
It's all so insane. As much as I hate it, I know I'm not ready to reach out to him. I have more work to do. Kills me what new damage he is doing to our marriage on a daily basis. But, it is what is.
My feelings go up and down constantly--I have moments where I feel confident things will work out, followed by a moment of absolute despair. Sometimes I think my feelings are directly connected to how he is feeling. Moments where my gut tells me he has convinced himself his new life is exactly what he's always wanted. Then, moments where he is confused, followed by these feelings of certainty that he wants to come home. Today, I feel a fog--like he's just going through the motions and not thinking too much about anything but what's right in front of him.
Anyone else experience this? Maybe it's must massive denial? But, I don't think so.
Heather
"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man
“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
