Separating Inevitable

[Arsene]

Hey girl, it is tough but not impossible. Quite frankly when ever D8 asks why mom left and doesn't want to come back, I just tell her it's nothing to do with her, that mom still loves her but if she wants to know why she should ask her mom.

I never lie to D8 about it but i also don't want to be the one breaking the hard news to her. W left and this is one responsibility she won't be allowed to escape.

It's not easy being the parent left with the kids. We see everything they go through and we have to comfort them at night when they really miss the other parent. Every other day D8 cries and I just hug her and tell her to be strong, that mom just needs a bit of time to figure things out.

The main thing is trying to always be upbeat when they are around. really tough but necessary as they notice everything and every change of mood.

Good luck with that.

[littleGTO]

He just emailed me back saying he didn't mind if I emailed him. Then he said, " I hope you're having a better than average day!"

I shouldn't be as thrilled at his response as I am, but anything positive gives me HOPE and HOPE is a good thing.

I have a IC this afternoon & haven't seen her for 3 wks--lots to fill her in on. Not sure I am going to continue w her as she is more all about listening and less about coaching. Her MO is more symphathizing and projecting my possible FUTURE feelings. I'd rather spend my time w someone who helps me deal w current feelings and gives me advice about what to do (like here on this forum)!

[littleGTO]

What a roller coaster ride this journey is!

I went to my IC yesterday-spent a good deal of time filling her in on events of the past 3 wks, but told her up front I was looking for more "coaching."

She listened & said that it seems as though my H is at least being honest w me on all counts at this point--brutally honest at times. she suggested praising him wherever appropriate for that.

H was in total depression/shut-off mode last night for several hours...listening to "HOME" by Phillip Phillips over and over--the song speaks to me...Im just not sure who he envisions the song with--at first I thought it must be me, but now I think it is prob OW. Only mind-reading.

Then I was depressed and laid on my bed for an hour straight just thinking and wondering about where we are...(not sure, really). Kids are on automatic pilot as we both are not focused on them...and I know I need to be more.

Worried about kids and how they'll take the conversation about dad moving out.

Worried about interactions between H and me after move out.

Worried about his weakness in not comm w OW.

H gives me a hug before leaving for work this morning and says "we need to give each other hugs coming and going." CONFUSION!!! Love the idea of it, but not sure WHY he said this and IF he really will follow through.

Sorry...running on fumes and just getting down my stream of conscience. NEED ADVICE!

[AnotherStander]

I get so confused by his behavior and I don't know whether to shut him down when he comforts me (as this seems to make us BOTH feel better) OR if I should refuse his offers to make him feel better?

This is a delicate balancing act. On the one hand you want to detach and protect yourself, but on the other hand intimate contact has a way of bringing people closer together. I was reading DR again over the weekend and was surprised to run across a blurb where Michele actually suggests that ML might be a good idea in trying to resurrect a failing marriage. That might seem counterintuitive to DB'ing, but ML is rarely just physical and does create deep emotional bonds too.

When he moves out in 3 weeks I feel the opportunities for us to be in these scenarios will be zero.

Perhaps, but look at the other side too, he will get much more space and time if he's not under the same roof.

It just feels weird knowing he doesn't LOVE ME but yet finds comfort in being close to me sometimes.

32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared.

What do I do, and why does he DO this?!

It's the distance/ pursuit dynamic. Try not to react too strongly to his swings back and forth.

I agree that his happiness has to "happen" in order for us to have a chance.

It's not that his happiness has to happen, it's that he needs to come to the realization that his unhappiness is coming from within him and not from you. That's where the space and time thing comes into play.

I am worried that for the past 4 months since he dropped "the bomb" we have talked regularly and openly but now that he is moving out the sitch changes and so opportunity for talk is going to be more limited. Plus I don't feel it will be right for me to call him (unless it's about the kids).

Again, don't look at this as a negative, look at it as a required step towards healing the M. Space and time is what he needs. What you need is to back off of him and work on yourself.

I could use some advice from others who are separated how they handled things. I just don't know how being separated can bring us close.

I highly recommend working things out with your H before he leaves. W and I sat down for about an hour to hammer out things like visitation, bill payments, what she was planning on taking from the house, etc. Get it all worked out beforehand so the transition is as painless as possible. We even talked about things like W respecting my privacy and not letting herself into my house after she moved. If your kids are in school then work out dropoff and pickup too. And discuss the kids' expenses and how that will be handled.

As for S bringing you close, I think you're still missing the point. You have to let him go! Detach! Release him! Give him the freedom he thinks he wants! Until he gets that "freedom" he's not going to realize how little you have to do with his unhappiness.

I hate that our boys are going to have to go through their dad leaving and not living with us (even though he will see them every day). Any advice how to handle the kids? ...what to say/ not say when we tell them?

It is very important to emphasize to them that they had no part in the S. They will blame themselves, you both need to reassure them that it has nothing to do with them and that you both love them very much. Also tell them beforehand how the visitations will work so they don't get blind-sided later. Tell them when it will start and what the schedule will be. Emphasize to them that you will both be flexible, so if they're with one parent and really miss the other then they can go visit them. When it comes to kids you both need to let go of your own needs and desires and facilitate the kids, especially in the first couple of months. If possible it's nice for the kids to see both parents each day even if only for a few minutes. Even on my weeks my W comes over and gets the kids ready for school after I've already left, and even on her weeks I pick them up and bring them to my house until W can pick them up. It's obviously not as good as us all being under the same roof, but the kids seem to be adapting OK since they see us both each day.

[Tumbling]

Hello TurtleGirl
How are you doing today? You dropped by my thread a few days ago. I'm sorry I haven't had time to respond properly til today. But I have caught up on your sitch now.

You wrote
I could use some advice from others who are separated how they handled things. I just don't know how being separated can bring us close. (He says he needs to go so maybe he can stay.) He's so "lost" and confused that he's even convinced me that the only way for him to figure things out is if he leaves. I just think it opens the door for him to decide to start comm w OW again.

I can't advise on the family element because me and H have no children but I can tell you ALL about surviving him moving out etc.

Firstly I echoe what Another Stander says that there are positive ways to view him moving out.

I know it's hard to believe him moving out will bring you closer but that's because in our heads we think they're leaving us (I said I'd been abandonned in the house) but that's us focusing on us and how we feel NOT them. They aren't leaving us, they are doing what they need to do to find them Selves and we have to allow them to.

I only had two weeks from bomb drop to him going and I asked him to go - definitely wrong from a DB point of view - but from a self-respect point I was like "You don't love me, you don't want to work on us, you don't want to talk about us, then you know what? I don't want to be around you. It's too difficult for me." I couldn't believe it when he made arrangements. I got very sad etc.

However, I realised that altho we were married, our relationship was no longer as amazing as it had been in the first year, that I wasn't so happy either and that the best thing we could do was physically separate to see if we could bring it back. I purposefully wasn't there when he left - I RECOMMEND THIS saying goodbye would have totally floored me - (and he bottled it the first day but did it the next) but I text him "We are doing the right thing. We couldn't carry on the way we were. Remember Einstein - insanity is doing the same things over and over again and expecting different results."

I recommend trying to talk admin/coms/visits/seeing each other/. I found a list on the internet of what you might discuss.
a) time limit - sometimes I wish we did that as we may not be 2 years in but it might have put too much pressure on us
b) finances
c) furniture - does he need any - mine didn't tho took linen
d) ongoing M relationship - boundaries/privacy/intimacy/scheduled contact/phonecalls/ household (I still have issue with H letting himself into the house when this is my safe space but he says he doesnt want the neighbours seeing him ring the doorbell)
e) seeing OP - we don't do this
f) privacy
g) ongoing reviews of where you both are at (I want to do this but I never have the nerve to ask and just assume he still wants to fix - or did until last 3 mths)

I tried to discuss all of this with H before he left. He would not engage at all post BD but it would have alleviated some of my not knowing if we had agreed some things. I was scared I would NEVER see him again.

BUT this time enabled me to focus on what I might have done to help him reach the conclusion that he LMBNILWM and with him gone, I had all the time in the world to dwell on that.
And that thinking gave me my 180s
And time to me enabled me to reconnect with who I am and realise some GAL activities that i wanted to do
And time to himself made him start questioning what he wanted cos after the first month of no responsibilities (ha - now he had to do the laundry etc) hanging with his buddies and doing what he pleased when he liked - he started questioning his decision.

I think that's enough for now! I've rambled on enough.
I know you're petrified of letting him out the door - I was too but we're still not separated formally nor divorced and these days I still believe we will reconcile

[littleGTO]

AnotherStander and Tumbling, thanks for your advice about the separation. I understand his need for leaving, but the acceptance of it happening after these 4 months of it "possibly happening" is very difficult.

I don't know HOW to detach. What does this LOOK like? How do my interactions with him change? MY IC said to maybe act interested, but not always available. Let him initiate ALL contact (all non-kid contact). I'm not sure I can/want to do this.

GAL is also tough when you have 3 very busy boys running different directions all the time- my life is THEIR activities, for the most part. I do exercise for my own sanity, but have very few interests outside of my kids' activities, and don't go out with friends hardly at all.

Evenings/nights are going to be the toughest for me,as that's when we talk IF we talk, and when we CUDDLE if at all. I have some sort of insane need just to BE around him sometimes...even though his signals are sometimes very clear to STAY AWAY (if which case I back off and give him space).

My H is starting to see a IC tomorrow so I'm praying this person is a good match for him. In his write-up it says he used Solution-Oriented Brief Therapy so I'm hoping some of his advice will be in line with Michele's. We'll see. I also hope my H will share some of his therapy with me, but will not pressure if he doesn't.

Some of the logistics of the S have already been worked out--visiting (at least loosely), "stuff" he'll take/won't take, finances (we both pay for everything together still...for now), and NO visits for kids to his apartment. They will remain in our house and H will visit there (whether I'm home or not is up to me). MY IC thinks we need to put more specific times on the visits so kids don't have certain expectations, but our kid schedule is so different from day to day that we BOTH need to be available to get everybody to where they need to be.

[littleGTO]

Having a very bad morning...no new reason in particular, just everything is weighing heavily on me as I woke up.

H hasn't come to bed in the past 2 nights (usu comes up in middle of night.)

No "real" converstations at all this week except about kids.

H got up early and said he was leaving early for work. (OW & he are still talking at work...who knows the tone/content of their conversations, but it is killing me not to know...I thought end of comm outside of work might give him time & space from her, but it seems the fire keeps burning at work).

I got upset and said, "REALLY?" H stormed out of room and said "I can't believe this (as in you are accusing me of something (going early to talk to HER) just b/c I am leaving for work early?). I said, "I'm sorry, I'm just having a really bad morning" and proceeded to cry. He said, "What do you want me to do?" Me- "I don't know."

He talked to me and said maybe I should take the day off of work (maybe I should but I'm afraid I would just wallow in self-pity all day), or maybe I should get some medicine to help with my emotionality (he is taking anxiety meds & is looking to go for anti-depressants). I told him I didn't want to have to take meds. I can't believe HE'S the one with all the problems AND I'M FALLING APART!

He mentioned going to his dad's to get some "stuff" for his new aptmt on Sunday. Me, "How are you going to do that w/o the boys knowing?" H-"We will have to tell them." Recent events have changed the date of telling the boys but I am NOT ready to drop the bomb on them (I guess I never will be).

Move-out day is only 2 wks away now. I want to give the boys time to adjust to the news, but I am just having a hard time with the reality of the sitch for ME and for THEM. It isn't fair.

H hugged me again before leaving (early, but not as early).

I just hope to get through my day w/o falling apart at work.

[littleGTO]

Fears and negative thoughts are inidating me today.

I'm now thinking what if when H moves out that it will be easier for him to DETACH from ME and will be easier to start R up/continue (not that's it's really stopped) w OW?

Feel like sending him an email today asking about his interactions w OW at work. Doesn't that impact ME...are they having casual conversations (doubt it); is he seeking her out or vice versa; are they talking more/longer now that he is not comm w her outside of work? The thoughts are driving me crazy! I know that would not be DB, so I guess I won't.

Days like these are so HARD to focus on the positives. I feel like dropping off the face of the earth (except for my boys).

[eyesopen]

Turtle,

I worried about the same thing with my w and OM as far as being able to pursue their R. I believe that it is part of why she moved out. So I do my best to not think about it. It is her choice, and I do not want to take away her free will. She has to live with the consequences of her actions. Does it affect a lot of lives, yes. But I keep going back to something I read about making yourself the best choice. We have to be patient. Others may think it is weak to hold on and hope that it will work out someday, but personally this has takin strength that I never knew I had in me.

[AnotherStander]

I don't know HOW to detach. What does this LOOK like? How do my interactions with him change? MY IC said to maybe act interested, but not always available. Let him initiate ALL contact (all non-kid contact). I'm not sure I can/want to do this.

Yeah, your IC is giving good advice. Detach means you pull back. Work on yourself. Become more independent. Give H space. It's OK to respond if he contacts you, but don't initiate unless it's kid-related and necessary.

H stormed out of room and said "I can't believe this (as in you are accusing me of something (going early to talk to HER) just b/c I am leaving for work early?). I said, "I'm sorry, I'm just having a really bad morning" and proceeded to cry. He said, "What do you want me to do?" Me- "I don't know."

Well that went poorly. What did you take away from that? Hopefully that you need to quit pressuring H and you need to quit crying in front of him. You need to be strong and independent right now, he will NOT be attracted to weak and needy.

Move-out day is only 2 wks away now. I want to give the boys time to adjust to the news, but I am just having a hard time with the reality of the sitch for ME and for THEM. It isn't fair.

You should go ahead and tell them. They do need some adjustment time before he's gone. Make sure you have the visitation arrangements ironed out so you can tell them the schedule. It's VERY important not to fall apart during this talk with them. Keep it calm and gentle. Tell them they are most important and that while S has to happen, you both love them very much and want to minimize the impact on them.

I'm now thinking what if when H moves out that it will be easier for him to DETACH from ME and will be easier to start R up/continue (not that's it's really stopped) w OW?

It sounds like the S is inevitable, so there's no use in worrying about it. I was concerned that when W left she'd jump straight into dating and would never miss me or the kids. But the opposite has happened, she did not start dating and she has been more involved in family activities now than before she left. D15 has even commented that she senses W is missing the family life. So you never know, sometimes S is needed for the WAS to reset their priorities.

Feel like sending him an email today asking about his interactions w OW at work.

Don't do that.

Doesn't that impact ME...

Well of course, but stick to the game plan! DB! No R talks, no OW talks, no pressure.