Now Separated, Am I doing the right things?

[Denver_2010]

Quite frankly, I am not sure how to respond if she asks me how I feel about her infidelity.

"We are married. Your infidelity is disrespectful to me, our children, our marriage, and to yourself. That's all I have to say about it."

[25yearsmlc]

Here’s my plan moving forward, I am going to let W set up a time for us to meet with the councilor, I will do just fine. I will surely be prepared with the verbiage Arsene just provided. I want to get myself mentally prepared for the conversation. There’s a couple topics that I want to be prepared for. I also really like the response Denver gave me a couple weeks ago if for some reason infidelity comes up.

“I am married and I am behaving as such”

What's the goal with that comment? To reassure her or your fidelity

OR to get her to reciprocate?

B/c if it's the latter, That's an attempt to control her, of course. And you can't do that, plus it does sound judgmental to me. Like you are implying that YOU are doing something SHE is NOT...(so you are right and she's wrong).

You can say you are "Still working on yourself and towards a reconciliation" which sounds, TO ME a lot more possible...than the "here's what I am doing, in CONTRAST to you..." (which is merely how I am hearing you atm...Not necessarily what you meant...)

So how will you feel IF she says "I will date OM if I want to AND the D is merely a legal formality" or "I will then file asap"

b/c she feels cornered?


Quite frankly, I am not sure how to respond if she asks me how I feel about her infidelity.

I doubt she will ask b/c surely She KNOWS how you feel.

So Do not volunteer it again.

The more you say things that have no consequences or effect OR that are critical of her, the more she'll confirm in her mind, her choice to leave AND

the weaker you look, IMO.

It'd be very different if she sincerely asked about your feelings b/c MAYBE that would mean she wants to know if you can ever get past this.

If she thinks you'd never let this go, (which is understandable on her end b/c you bring it up a lot and you DO think about it a lot)

then she'll never want to try.

Very Few WASs want to try to reconcile if they feel the affair will be held over their head like the Sword of Damacles

or thrown in their face every time there is a fight.

Similarly, you have a chance to show her the NEW you. If you can start seeing interactions with her as opportunities instead of stressors, your attitude would be better and you'd come off stronger and more confident.

So, WHO is the NEW you?

How can you show her that man? How can you be that man?

finally, there IS a chance, however small, that she has a different intent for this meeting. She may be probing...she did NOT say "let's settle this once and for all" and if it was a text, I don't know how you "heard" her tone.

Was it a voice mail? Maybe she does not feel you have shown her interest.

What is HER love language

and how do you Give love?

IMO you ought to Start the meeting by Listening...and then listen some more.

[roughenough]

Hey 25!, You stood out from your very first post. Just hang with me, just PLEASE bare with me!. EVERYTHING you say is logical ok, you have a tone of wisdom, no doubt! This isn’t easy sh!t, ok. You see, I wasn’t born knowing how to deal with this sh!t, what to expect, how to handle all this bs. I ask myself, why? Why am I being tested like this? Why am I having to endure this turmoil, did I do something wrong, I just don’t get it?

One thing I find interesting is that a lot of the good people on this site are in there late later 30’s/early 40’s. Is this the time when they finally come to their senses? You can’t crack a nut till it’s ready? It’s like we’re here for a reason. It’s just really hard to let it really sink in! I am truly blessed because a lot of people go through life “as if” and don’t even take in half the stuff we discuss. Take Care, Rough.

[Denver_2010]

Sounds like you may be having a tough night Rough. I posted a story on Carnac's thread that I found early in S, and that I relied upon when I was really having a rough time... wondering why I was doing what I was doing... I'm going to post it here as well (since I still have the word doc open on my computer ;))

"There once was a man who was sentenced to 25
years of backbreaking labor. His wrists were tied
to the handle of a huge wheel that was inlaid in
the wall. His job was to turn the wheel 10 hours
a day.

For years, day in and day out, the prisoner would
wonder what he was doing with this wheel. What
was the meaning of his work? What was on the
other side of this wall? Was he grinding grain?
Pulling up water? Moving some sort of conveyor
belt?

For 25 years he contemplated the meaning of his
work, and for 25 years he spun that wheel. It was
grueling, but he survived.

When his sentence was complete he was released
from prison. The first thing he did was run to
the other side of the wall to see what he had
been doing all this time.

What did he see?

Nothing!

There was nothing attached to the wheel. For 25
years, 10 hours a day, he was spinning a wheel
for absolutely no purpose. When the man realized
his true sentence, he collapsed and died.

The prisoner was able to survive 25 years of
backbreaking labor, but when he realized that it
was all for nothing, he couldn't survive for
another moment.

So what's the difference between pain and
suffering?

Pain has a purpose.

Suffering is true torture because it has no
meaning.

Pain is bearable. Suffering for no reason is
devastating.

Ask any woman about child labor. How was it?
Would you do it again? Most women will answer: It
was painful, but I didn't suffer. I would do it
again.

This is the key to surviving marital problems and
making it through to a new love and peace with
your spouse.

If you think there's no purpose to your emotional
hurt, you'll just want out. You'll run from your
kids, your responsibility, your vows...you'll run
from it all just to get relief from an unbearable
suffering.

But if you can come to understand why you're in
this situation, then you'll succeed to make it
through like a woman in child labor.

Why is this happening to you? What are you
supposed to be learning from all of this? Can you
see how your marital problems are really an
opportunity for you and your spouse?"

[Arsene]

Hey Rough,

I know that 25 has a very different way of looking at things I have to admit that very often, it hurt me to read what she wrote on my thread but I have to tell you, if you stop and think about it, she makes an awful lot of sense. Always question the true motivation behind anything you say or do. If it's punitive or judgmental, do you really want to be that way with your W? Remember, would you rather be right or happily married?

I, for one, also thought that this answer (“I am married and I am behaving as such”) rang well if she asks me if I'm seeing someone but after reading 25's post, I think I'll reconsider.

Btw, that post by Denver? Wow!!! Eye opening. The thing is there is a purpose but we don't always know what it is right now. Once we're through with our sentence, we might realize that the purpose was not to save our marriage but to save ourselves. The marriage might still be saved collaterally, though.

[roughenough]

Good stuff Denver, thanks much. Arsene, I always really appreciate your posts! I am on a journey, a journey towards discovery, a journey towards self improvement. Who knows, maybe I can call it a breakthrough. I am realizing I am perfectly imperfect. I am the only person I have to please and it’s time for me to start seeking my own approval.

[Arsene]

Pperfectly imperfect!!! that's all of us mate. Just a big old happy family. I know you're fine. Just reading you, I know.

[roughenough]

I spent years trying to meet W’s “needs.” I was like a dog chasing his tail. Looking back on our marriage I rarely got many of MY “needs” met. I really need to question why I went so long without making my own needs a priority. I truly feel I am starting to pull farther and farther away from W but that’ ok. In all actuality, I change my view on this quite regularly.

I just pocket dialed W by accident and when I realized I called her I hung up the phone. Less than a minute later W called me and left me a voice mail saying “I noticed you called but didn't leave a message so I am just calling you back.” I just found that to be a bit interesting. Anyway, I am looking forward to living it up and going out with some friends tonight. As time goes by I am finding it harder and harder to refrain myself from the ladies.

[Arsene]

Hey mate, I'm not going to tell you what to do but you got to know that although it might feel good for a couple of hours, it's definitely not going to help your sitch. Think about it twice mate.

[25yearsmlc]

I spent years trying to meet W’s “needs.” I was like a dog chasing his tail. Looking back on our marriage I rarely got many of MY “needs” met. I really need to question why I went so long without making my own needs a priority.

Really? Well what does this^^^ mean? What triggered this revelation?

All I'm asking is what these words mean. They're your words...


I truly feel I am starting to pull farther and farther away from W but that’ ok. In all actuality, I change my view on this quite regularly.

yes you do. That's normal and I'll place a post of yours from less than One month ago, to remind you...


I just pocket dialed W by accident and when I realized I called her I hung up the phone. Less than a minute later W called me and left me a voice mail saying “I noticed you called but didn't leave a message so I am just calling you back.” I just found that to be a bit interesting.


it's not bad, but it's just not a big thing. Hey, SHE could be wondering why you called her? Think that's something to spend time on? Can you tell me what it is, that YOU are working on in yourself and what "becoming more patient" means, to you?



Anyway, I am looking forward to living it up and going out with some friends tonight. As time goes by I am finding it harder and harder to refrain myself from the ladies.

Everytime I ask you about what this^^ type of comment means, you avoid it. Why?

Is it b/c you know you are so not ready for a r with OW?

I've asked you if that's fair to the women you meet. You did not answer.

Do you see any patterns in how you feel and interact with your w, or don't, and then how you start "needing" to be with the ladies even while claiming to be working on the m? ANY patterns?

When I asked you about dating so fast and not processing your role in this

you gave a non responsive answer with "so does ANY r after a divorce mean it's co-dependent?" I wasn't saying to never date again and or to never have another r again if you divorce...how YOU twisted that was very intriguing to me. Do you do that with your w?

IMO, you FEARED that I was implying something. So instead of responding to what I actually put in writing,

you reacted to what you feared I secretly meant, and avoided the real question.

That is a poor communication method and it's your problem, not mine. I'm a wordsmith and I chose my words with care.

Reply to what is specifically asked and if you wish, you can also add on-

but don't pretend I said something I didn't, and don't put words in my mouth and then ignore the real questions I asked.

I find that useful for you to realize and I hope you see this behavior of yours. It's valuable.


Of course you can have a r someday and Not have it mean you are needy and co-dependent. But to me you sound that way b/c of the timing...

You say you are fighting for your m, then you say you won't be a free agent for long, then you say you can't believe she's dating,

then you say you are tempted by the ladies...

sounds like You're very confused and lonely. Are you getting any counselling?

think about what you wrote, below...and figure out where you really are. OR where you want to be.



Less than one month ago, YOU WROTE:

"Since the separation the only thing that is discussed is the kids or finances. Part of me really feels I should be more proactive with the “conversation starters”. W’s definitely not very good at them, even though I know she’s open to talking. "....I want to improve, I want my W back. I should probably ask W more questions.

so are you doing anything about this??^^^


"My heart is too heavy, it hasn’t let go of this women. To see the pain in son 8 is just heartbreaking. The pain is so deep, almost unbearable; I feel sooooo bad for him. A child shouldn’t have to go through this but its reality right now.
I pray daily, I pray for myself, others, my W and my kids. I was talking to a pastor at the party last night and he told me what a good heart I have. That’s the truth; I know I have a very good heart. I am closer to the Lord then I’ve ever been. I know He wants W and I to be together but I also know He gives her free will."


Yes she has free will. So do you.

I'm sorry you are in pain.

Can you tell us what you want to change in you?

And how is that personal work going? And the GAL?

To me, going to bars is not GAL. It's not meaningfully connecting with people or learning a new topic or mastering something. ALSO, It's partying...it's numbing you. Not always a bad idea to take a break, but it's no solution.

GAL means making an effort in your life to "finally" doing things you always wanted to do or learning a NEW topic or pushing your comfort zone OR doing something good for yourself, something new and different, e.g.,

taking a class, going to a seminar, joining a group or club, volunteering, meeting new people (who are not drunk) and connecting with them...

ANY of that^^ going on? You admit you don't know this "[censored]" and were not born with the tools for it.

I KNOW, as I was not born with those tools either. And I never saw forgiveness growing up. It's a learned skill...

there are tools though.

So how are YOU going to get those tools? You need them, regardless of your w's choices...