Good for you! Knowing you made the right decision should help to make you stronger. There is absolutely no logic in how the WAW thinks. It scares me to death when I think of the risks I was thinking about taking at the time I was the WAW.
That's why you can't depend upon her making "right" decisions. She's thinking out of her emotions and not her brain. She know the love you have for her.....and she will use that knowledge to work you to get what she wants. Don't let her wear you down until you can't think logically for your family.
Knowing what's the right thing to do......doesn't always make it "easy" to do. Making the right decision is the easy part. Hold your ground. Giving over to what she wants right now will not make you any brownie points. And, don't be surprised if she doesn't tell you that she was beginning to think there might be hope for a future at some point......until now! Now you've messed up and now there's no hope for EVER having a R together! It's just a continuation of the tantrum. Just remember that she isn't the first woman who ever thought of that little gem.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
And, don't be surprised if she doesn't tell you that she was beginning to think there might be hope for a future at some point......until now! Now you've messed up and now there's no hope for EVER having a R together! It's just a continuation of the tantrum. Just remember that she isn't the first woman who ever thought of that little gem.
Wow, you're good sandi. Do you do house calls? (thread drop ins)
M: A really long time. Crisis: 5 years. She's still worth it.
Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
Sandhi wow, these insights are priceless. I have a much better understanding of what I am dealing with. I intend to use it. Thanks for the tip off as well. I am not sure how I wld have reacted to the 'might be a hope' speech and I think this might be coming - she is not done trying to pursuade me and moves from being nice back to insults when I don't back down. Again, this is all helping me understand the importance of detachment - I need to do this to keep strong and protect my family/myself. Your v first post is now starting to sink in. The last chance of happiness, how she will fight for it, do anything to get it. It all makes sense now!
Now to pick up working on me. Please keep posting and thanks. I am getting it at last.
Ok well it just got worse. She asked again and said I am keeping her dangling. I told her I had already said no. I did not get chance to say anything else. I now need to practice my boundaries re not being spoke to like that. I had to ignore her and not get drawn in. She stormed out! But I will not be spoken to like that. I can understand her place but I am not being bullied.
Somehow I don't think I will have heard the last of this.
She's still trying tactics to get what she wants. You don't have to accept disrespect and you don't have to accept being bullied. Some newcomers mistakenly think that is DBing, but it’s not.
This behavior seems to be common with a lot of WAW's. In her mind, she wants out....plain and simple. If the LBH doesn't bow down to her wishes then she keeps trying different tactics trying to see which way will pressure him enough to finally give her what she wants. I've read stories from several men who come to the board who want their W back so much that they're willing to do anything. Sad to say, but some have seen just how low a WAW can get. B/c she doesn't think about the H she's leaving behind. She doesn't care how damaged he is financially or emotionally. (IMHO, that is what she meant when she said you owed it to her.). It's all about what she wants to be happy. She's just as desperate to get out of the M as the LBH is to keep her. A lot of H's have actually got so sickened by the actions of his WAW that he decides he doesn't want her anymore. But before running out to file for a D, he should understand that this is almost “protocol” for her and what he’s feeling is to be expected. Just don’t respond by acting on those feelings. If you know what is coming, then prepare…..just like you would if a storm was headed your way
This doesn't happen with all the H's. But I just want you to brace yourself to expect the worst. Some think that's too negative, but if you look for signs from her and get your hopes up over little things....then you will experience the same feelings as when you got the bomb over & over again.
Am I saying to give up and never have hope? No. But I am saying that it's going to get worse. I can only think of a few times that it hasn't happened in people's stitch here on the board. If you keep your head and emotions intact, and you prepare for whatever you think she could possibly do to make matters worse....then I think that's being realistic and you won't be completely blindsided by future tricks she pulls out of her bag.
That's why some LBH's can't be best friends with his WAW for quite some time. Maybe never. Hopefully, there will come a time you can be friend..ly to each other, but being friendly is not being best friends. It's not letting her take advantage or disrespect you. Instead of trying to prove how much you love her, you need to protect you and your children financially.
You prepare mentally as best as you can. If need be, think of things she may say and how you will respond. I know of some who actually would practice in front of a mirror. If that's what it takes to keep your feet planted, then do it. Otherwise, she'll keep you knocked down.
The mistake so many make is they don't believe their W would ever do those kind of things, and therefore, they will not listen to what people on the board try to tell them and they set themselves up to fall. I am always telling newcomers that this is not the girl you M anymore.
By the time a LBH comes here, the W is done. She doesn't want to work on the R. She's through. That's why doing all those things you should have done years ago doesn't work well. I'm not talking about improvements on you. I'm talking about romantic things, etc. It's too late for that now. If the M is reconciled and the two of you find a good pro-marriage C, then you can do those things later. But now isn't the time. You have to take a different avenue right now. Your W will get very angry at you. Expect it. You will feel that there isn’t any hope for the two of you. Expect to have those times. But if you continue to stand your ground by doing what you know is right, she will begin to see the man she M and she will begin to respect you again. It will take her time. She won’t even admit it to herself for a long time…..but it will happen.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Your comment re 'its not the girl I married' is so true. I see it in her. She is still changing. I needed this stand to make me see that. For her to let the anger out properly gave me a glimpse of how she feels about me - she does not care.
There are also v strong signs of EA/possible PA that may have been going on for some months as well. Not sure how to deal with other than set boundaries. I am staying surprisingly calm about it reading these posts-like I should have expected it. But all the talk re not dating etc was prob garbage.
She has now moved into spare room. Suspect another reminder that we are really done. She knows I wld not leave the marital bed. It feels like a pressure being taken off as the intimacy obviously had gone.
I do not feel like everything is crumbling around me anymore.
Stoney silence today. W not said at word. Having a reflective moment about last few days.
Lots learned. I feel I have pretty much detached. I am at the point were I don't care what she does. But am worried that my love is fading. For the first time I have thought about positives of being single. That worries me.
My instincts are permanently on protecting son. Angry still that W wld do this to him. He is innocent and no child deserves this. I will not say this to W as I know she thinks the alternative is for him to live in a bad marriage. That he will get over it! He has to convince herself of that.
I feel much stronger. Like I have been mentally tested and passed.At the same time sad that I am letting go of her. That our M as it was is truly over and there is no going back.
I am expecting the worst (M cannot be saved) but carry hope of a new better marriage. I feel I have a great understanding of the problems from our M. Of my issues and W. But for now I have to live my life for me and focus on myself and children. I will keep up with the 180s and working on myself. But I am not blaming myself anymore.
Got this e-mail from W today. Pretty uch spells out how she feels:
'So you want to know how I feel? I’m so angry. I feel cornered and trapped and my future lies in your hands, like you have total control. I’m not happy with that at all. We wouldn’t have this house if it wasn’t for me. I fought to the bitter end to keep it when me and Tony split up because it was the one stability for Alex. You know how much it cost me to do it. It was the only house we had. I allowed you to move in here when I could have let you stay where you were. I was paying it all myself with no help from anyone and I could have continued to do that. You had nothing, you lived with your mum and dad, and at the ripe age of 26 you hadn’t ever had your own place for long, not had a proper job for long and your mum was running your bank account. I had a good job, I worked hard to get where I was and I don’t think you ever realised the responsibility I had or how much I had to do. I also don’t think you ever realised how much I had done in the past to get to where I was at work. I’d done the project thing driving around; meeting big wigs and entertaining clients and a lot of that as a single mum too. You came to see me in my office and maybe you just didn’t realise, but either way you never acknowledged it. You continued to work at Bolton on your terrible wage and you did not see for some time that it was not a wage to support you really, let alone pay for a house and bills. I remember having a big row when I was pregnant and throwing the scan video at you; trying really hard to get you to take some responsibility and realise that we needed more money and that fell to you. I was pregnant and soon to be on mat leave andI couldn’t do any more than I was doing. It should have been something that you stepped up to yourself but it took me shouting and falling out before you moved. You got the new job eventually, but for whatever reason you chose not to keep work informed of what we lived with at home. I know you felt under threat and it’s harsh of me to say, but not getting up in the mornings or being late would not give a good impression anywhere. If you had have told them about home, they would have afforded you some understanding therefore securing your position. I remember asking you to tell them to reduce our worries, but you wouldn’t, you just decided that you’d go all out in the job instead. Telling them wouldn’t have only released pressure on you, but me too, at home with two kids. You focussed on the job and didn’t understand that the pressures were building up for me too. The exams. I struggled alone with the kids whilst you did them and I know they weren’t easy but you really didn’t have to give me or the kids much thought did you? You knew I would handle it all and I did. Lots of evening at your mums and in those days you didn’t help with bedtimes, and certainly not with housework stuff except washing up. You have done a lot of kitchen tidying, but it is one room in a house full of eight rooms. So, all this time the gardening, Jacob, Alex, house, cleaning, washing, cooking, finances and responsibility was all mine and I took it all on. Out of the last 13 years you have stepped up to share all or at least some of all that only in the last few months since you’ve known you’ve lost me. Twelve years of mum-like care are worth something. I know you brought the money home, but I have contributed with benefits and bits and bobs until recently. I know you worked hard to get where you are, only you did that but you would not have done it without my backing and taking over at home; you weren’t here enough to do otherwise. Now we’re here. I didn’t envisage this, but I now accept that I have probably thought about it for some time and not been brave enough, always thought this would do and I’d feel differently, but that hasn’t happened. I feel like a no-one and I think you’ve helped that. You certainly haven’t made me feel otherwise and you certainly have not cared for me emotionally. I have asked you to sign the guarantor because I have no-one else. It’s my only chance to have a rented house no matter where I go. I’m a stay at home mum; stay at home because that’s what I’ve done for the last 13 years. I have tried to do other things to better myself and it was impossible, primarily because I couldn’t do everything and work or learn too. Jacob needed one of us at home and that was me. You climbed your corporate ladder without much of a worry for anything else because I covered it all and I’ve never had too much recognition for that over the years. I cannot guarantee my benefits any more than you can guarantee your wages for the next twelve months, BUT its 12 months, not a lifetime. After the twelve months I will not be asking you again. I have had to beg enough as it is whilst you keep me dangling because you’re not happy. I’m not happy asking as it happens. You are still my husband for now. I have done nothing but hold you up emotionally, look after our home, and have the majority of the responsibility for the kids and home for all that time. You brought home the bacon and it irks me that you have the power over that ultimately. Power that I feel you have over me and what I can and can’t do for my future. I cannot ask friends to do this for lots of reasons despite a few offering because they now know I’m desperate. It’s not their responsibility, it’s yours. Helping secure a home for me for one year is not too much to ask. I think I’m owed it and it would be the right thing to do to make sure Jacob and Alex have another home with me. I find you cold and heartless for saying no, I admit I really didn’t think you would say no because of the implications of that. Turns out I was wrong. However, the one thing this has taught me is that I’m right in my decision that we’re not right, that you haven’t got that emotional connection to me or my feelings and that I’m right to leave. Things will change from here on in. If you’re in, I’m out and vice versa because right now I don’t want to be anywhere near you. Now you know how I feel.'
Now there is a lot of this that is BS (e.g. the videoscan was a story she told me from her previous marriage. I have never and would ever do anything like that and remember being shocked when she told me the story). I wont list the rest out. I know the rules re seeing and hearing.
The bits that have truth in I am already working on...which she comments on. I assume this is the trust bit. She thinks I am doing them to win her over?
I still think this is blackmail for the guarantor issue.
How do I respond? My feeling is that if I respond verbally, she will use it as an opportunity to try and pursuade me, then call me names when I don't agree and we are back to square 1.
If I e-mail her back then she would think me 'not man enough to confront her..plus I would be playing her game. i.e. this is now her form of communication with me.
Do I even respond?
I feel like verbally responding, correcting her for the complete innacuracies (stuff that is made up or not our sitc)- there are limits to what BS I will take, but validating her emotions.
