Legally since he has he has been involuntarily committed before within the last 2 years and not on meds that wouldn't be such a hard thing to do. Especially since it was for rage and suicide/homicide ideation. In a nutshell about a year and a half ago, he was threatening to kill himself, me and anyone that tried to stop him. He had armed himself and headed into the woods behind my house. I managed to get my kids out and get out of here. At that point, I called the police. That was when the swat team came out. He was never charged with anything though. There was an agreement between the sheriff, our county attorney and myself to have him taken to the hospital. He stayed there for a while. They got him medication and got him into intensive counseling and he came back home and did outpatient counseling. Around the 1st of the year his insurance was changed. It no longer covered his meds specifically (abilify) so he had to wean off it. He has since refused all meds and all counseling. One of the reasons I believe he left was because I was pushing him to go back again.
In the past, the court would only allow him supervised visitation. I do not believe he would hurt my children. Apparently, some of his family members (father and step mother) are concerned though and made it a point to let me know this today.
He was just hurtful with his words which is a pretty normal pattern. I know he can only be hurtful if I am not detached. I think we know I am not detached. I'm trying. I have tried for a very long time to try to fix him and hold this all together. Maybe fix isn't the right word. But encouraged him to get help. I had even told him about 6 months ago when I noticed the depression getting worse and the suicide talk coming back that I would be okay with a separation or whatever if he needed that in order to get himself back together. I still feel that way. Our situation was very bad. It was abusive both verbally and mentally. Not just sometimes but literally every day. When he first left it honestly was a relief. Now though, I stay worried about him. Worried about the kids. Worried about everything. All these stupid things I have no control over. Although, his mental state and issues are part of the reason I haven't minded the contact and act as if things are hunky dory in the hopes it will help him. Also, so that I know he hasn't blown his head off. He has pretty much cut all contact with his family and most of his friends. Many of them had no idea he had even left and have stopped by to see him and he's gone. Then they try to call and he doesn't return their calls.
Yes, I do realize I am not his caretaker. Really. Although, that is the role I have played for some time now. It is difficult to just let go.
Quick comment: DBing doesn't mean being a doormat. It's okay to have boundaries, and bottom lines. Your bottom line is infidelity. You let him know of this bottom line, and if he ignores it, then you must take action and follow through--BUT make sure this really is a bottom line.
Also, why wash his clothes? Let him do his own stuff. I made the same mistakes...helping him pack when he moved out, even putting together a "care package." Ugh. What was I thinking? I guess love does make one do stuff like that. But stop being a caretaker. Bring the relationship to an even level. Good luck.
Tori you are right of course. Things seem a little better after a few days but a little worse too. Kids went with H tonight. They were supposed to stay all night. S14 didn't really want to go at all and I had to beg him to stay for 3 hours. H and I had a decent conversation. He is still slipping in the honey and baby's which irritates me. Now of course he says sorry after he says it. It's just dumb. So around 10 PM H calls back. D12 told him she wanted to come home and not stay. So he brought her home. Didn't say much to me but I didn't expect him to.
Our conversation earlier got pretty out of control. I think. I dunno. We talked quite a bit. I did say something to the effect of I am going to IC this week. I'm not sure how to ask this but what issues would you say I might need to work on. So he says control, anger, saying mean things, and I do not finish things I start. I validated the first three and even said yes I do that and even know why. I am trying very hard to work on the anger and he has seen that himself. The finish things one threw me for a loop. I really am not sure where he is getting that. Honestly, that describes himself and I even said that to him. Sort of like point blank I have thought the same about you. My house is one big unfinished project. Seriously. So in all honestly all of those describe himself as well. Very much so. The other thing I have noticed and has become much more pronounced the last few days is that he gets angry any time I say I feel...... It really doesn't matter what I say on the end. He just gets mad. The other thing is it really seems to not matter what I say or do much of the time. It's like he has this idea in his head of what I am thinking and how I am going to react and it doesn't really seem to matter if the reality is different. He was saying tonight-- Now you're mad... and I wasn't. I even said why do you think that? I'm not raising my voice, not saying anything rude. He said well its your tone. I said I really don't think I have a tone at all.That might be something I need to work on though. His response was you most definitely do and really he said it pretty nasty. Whatever. At one point I said whatever. That made him mad too. I asked him what he thought I meant when I say whatever. He couldn't answer. So I said to the point- When I say whatever that means I am not going to fight with you. It doesn't matter and it's not worth a fight. I had to go over there to pick up S14 earlier and it was extremely uncomfortable for me. He asked me if I wanted to sit or want something to drink. Acted offended when I didn't accept anything. So when I left at that point things were still going well. It was when I called to say Goodnight to the DD's that it all went downhill. Really, I wasn't fighting. He was though. Or trying to bait me into a fight. Told me how I push his buttons, and I only called to try to control the night, put him in a bad mood, so I would have control. I honestly only called because it was their first time there and I was concerned they were going to bed soon. The man seriously has not one single good thing to say about me. At one point I asked what sort of timeframe are you looking at for D? He got all mad about that. Why do you want one? Are you in a rush? All kinds of things. Just assuming all kinds of things. I was very calm. Finally, I said actually- I would prefer not to get one and if you insist at least for a while. I have enough on my plate as it is. Then he says well you just said you wanted one. I responded- "Nope, I asked you if you had a timeframe in mind. I never said that and I didn't imply that. You assumed that." So I said you just proved my point on assuming you know what I am thinking and how I am feeling. The whole thing was exhausting. We didn't really leave it on good terms. Things are slowly kind of coming out so that is at least good. I don't really have much hope though. He really doesn't acknowledge his own role in our problems. Sadly, when he finally does take a look at all of it, likely it will be very very bad for him. And if he never does he will never be able to have a normal relationship. I have been feeling quite a bit more detached. I think in part just due to how obvious it is that he is just not himself. Really weird acting. No OW. I am now 100% confident. One additional thing happened. He went with his father to an annual charity auction. Apparently, his 1st wife was there. To my knowledge they haven't seen or spoken to one another in about 17 years. He said she recognized his dad and walked up and asked if it was him. He said yes and they talked for a few minutes. So he told me all of this because in his words - Several people saw them talking and he didn't want me to hear about it and be upset or think anything was going on. He basically was reassuring me.
Oh! normally I go to the auction myself. So he called me this morning to see if there was something in particular I wanted so he could keep an eye out for it. Meaning particular items or anything.
He is the mixed signal king and I truly believe he has no idea what he wants or anything else. It's like talking to a confused, jacked up teenager.
So that has been my day. I am now exhausted and completely ready for bed. I am still so confused how one person can obviously have feeling completely contradicting what they say and yet somehow they believe their own words even when no one else does. Hello MLC!
He is the mixed signal king and I truly believe he has no idea what he wants or anything else. It's like talking to a confused, jacked up teenager.
I feel just the same.
It sounds as if things have been pretty intense. When does your course end? Your H is a lot like mine. He also has a thing about my 'tone'. It's very difficult for me to catch it. In fact, I wonder if it's projection. How do you feel about the reassurance about there not being an OW?
Hang in there and remember your points about why you're doing this.
Me: 51 H: 52 T: 23 yrs M: 19 yrs S18, D16, S14 (special needs) PA: 2003/2004 Piecing: 2004 on Suspect H had EA: 8/2012-12/2012
hello mkb23, i'm sorry you're in this sitch. in reading your conversation with H, above, what came to my mind is the way the two of you communicate. it's filled with lots of blaming and accusations from both of you. also, i think you may want to stay away from R talks for a while. don't get baited.
my H and i figured out a long time ago (because of a joke we heard) that "fine" from a woman means you're in trouble and "whatever" means F... Y...! it's not good in an adult conversation. try not to start any sentence with "you"; you did this, you did that.
"nope" is kind of surly, too.
i see a lot of promise for you in your sitch. i think your main problem is the two of you have trouble communicating in a way that is not defensive. maybe you could get some books on communication?
good luck! ((()))
i hope i haven't offended you.
M:63 H:53 S:41, SS:28, SS:25, SD:23 M:15 T:16
Bomb:12/17/11, "I think we should go our separate ways." H moves to his mother's house, 4/1/12 12/21/12: H moves back home, piecing
The other thing I have noticed and has become much more pronounced the last few days is that he gets angry any time I say I feel...... It really doesn't matter what I say on the end.
Told me how I push his buttons
So I said you just proved my point on assuming you know what I am thinking and how I am feeling.
He really doesn't acknowledge his own role in our problems. Sadly, when he finally does take a look at all of it, likely it will be very very bad for him. And if he never does he will never be able to have a normal relationship.
He is the mixed signal king and I truly believe he has no idea what he wants or anything else. It's like talking to a confused, jacked up teenager.
All of the above describes my life as well. I love the assumptions of how I am feeling or thinking. No matter what I say, in some scenarios my H assumes I am saying something else because he will not listen. When he starts this, I tell him that what he said is not what I am thinking/feeling. He says yes it is. So, I've started saying, I'm not going to argue with you about how I think/feel. Only I know that. And then I move on.
My H has said all of our problems are because I push his buttons, he won't acknowledge that he pushes mine, or any of the other contributions he's made to this mess. Part of our problem is that he has hold overs from his last M, so your comment about not being able to have a normal relationship is correct.
I hate the mixed signals. One minute mine wants to be "unmarried", the next he wants me to fill his prescriptions.
I am still cooking, washing, etc because I am trying not to be vindictive. I am also working on forgiveness and forgiveness for me is not being a b!tch. I've got to wash anyway.
It is amazing how someone can be so confused, and it leaves us exhausted. Hang in there and take care of your kids. They need you, especially if they don't want to stay with him.
M44 H57 D17 (special needs) M 18 yrs Bomb 7/2/12 Still living together
Thanks ladies. Scared maybe you are right. I don't catch a lot of it. It is simply how I communicate and always have. I try very hard not to blame. Very hard. I had 5LL here somewhere but couldn't find it. So I ordered a new one was going to reread it. I also wanted to try to find other books on communication. Any suggestions would be helpful. I think H's LL is combination Words of affirmation and physical.
Wendylon I believe him. I did before that conversation. We had a conversation the day before that basically sorted it out. I did apologize for the way I acted and spoke to him the day before. Basically told him that several people had asked me who he was seeing or if he was seeing someone. Honestly, it brought back all of the pain and hurt from the first time. I told him that. I also admitted that I still have a lot of anger and resentment from then. Not only that, I still, obviously have trust issues. He told me point blank there is no one else. At all. I believe that. He told me about seeing his XW to prevent me from being hurt more. That is something he would do knowing how much stress the entire subject causes for me.
Hopeful- We do not live together but I can see where you would. I would too. Acts of service are definitely my biggest way of showing love. Be careful though. I think by doing a lot of things in some ways they think we are trying to control things or that we only do nice things to make up for other areas that may be lacking like -spending time together or sex. That's hard to deal with though when at this point they are not willing to do any of that anyway. That's all part of the caretaker thing. Doing the things he asks though are likely helpful.
So I am not sure what is happening but I really have been much more settled and calm both yesterday and today. I love this!
I have been thinking about things though and I am not sure what my best approach with H is.
I was basically a WAS myself even though we were both in the same house. So I am not sure if I should be being friendly and verbally affectionate because frankly I wasn't before so that is a 180 for me or if the best thing is really just to stop all of it. It is starting to feel like I am just playing into this limbo and prolonging it. Whereas if he sees a clear choice maybe it will speed up the process? Not sure if that makes sense.
Maybe I will try being less available the next few days. Unfortunately, our schedules are such that he is around quite a bit and frankly that helps all of us. Not him. But the kids and I.
So I am not sure what is happening but I really have been much more settled and calm both yesterday and today. I love this!
That's wonderful. Enjoy it.
Originally Posted By: MKB23
I am not sure if I should be being friendly and verbally affectionate because frankly I wasn't before so that is a 180 for me or if the best thing is really just to stop all of it.
I'm not sure when you're referring to when you say 'before'. Do you think that being friendly makes it harder for him to see what he'd be losing by not returning to the R?
Originally Posted By: MKB23
Maybe I will try being less available the next few days. Unfortunately, our schedules are such that he is around quite a bit and frankly that helps all of us.
Certainly, you can try out a different way of being around him things and monitor the results. Are you thinking of being less available, and less friendly and less verbally affectionate? Will you still listen and validate? I'm just not sure how dim you're thinking of becoming.
I never know though how long to give a sitch before you can tell if your new actions are leading anywhere positive or not. I hope it won't be too hard to tell in your case.
Anyway, good luck and keep us posted!
Me: 51 H: 52 T: 23 yrs M: 19 yrs S18, D16, S14 (special needs) PA: 2003/2004 Piecing: 2004 on Suspect H had EA: 8/2012-12/2012
I agree with SS's post on 10/7. Being less available will help, and no R talks for a while will also help. If your H tries to start the R talk, you can listen, but don't get into arguments or reason against his feelings. It's tough, but you can do it.
The most important thing now is that you can feel good about yourself knowing you want to save your M, and if for some reason your H doesn't cooperate, there is nothing else you can do. Don't give up. Be patient.
