Yes, that sounds more like the H I know. And knowing him, the negative and dark aspects of reducing spousal support or opportunity to rebuild R are all there.
I just can't picture him telling his work buddies (who have met me & the boys) that he might want to work with me while/after D me. I just can't imagine what they thought.
It does make me feel like he isn't having an A with someone he works with which was a fear of mine. Maybe we could work out at the gym together! Lol!
Thanks for your perspective.
Me54/H47 '08 H is "done" March '12 H moved out Brink of D, December '12 2014 totally reconciled! ...... "I firmly believe in the...absolute possibility of marriage renewal." Jim Conway
I read your post on about communication on labug's thread. When I get home from class I'll read it again to digest it. It looks SO helpful and on target.
I can't thank you enough for coming to my aid today. I had a GREAT visit with a lady L and will post on my thread later tonight.
I can hardly wait to hear more about the budding romance with W. You are doing GREAT!!!
Me54/H47 '08 H is "done" March '12 H moved out Brink of D, December '12 2014 totally reconciled! ...... "I firmly believe in the...absolute possibility of marriage renewal." Jim Conway
lol rH, I don't know about the budding romance part yet, but W was very pleasant today after work, so apparently no damage done at least. There are certain things I will want to know before I jump in fully and trust fully. But thankful regardless, without expectations...
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
Well, this week was my 3 month self check-in. Lots of reflection and old brushed aside feelings felt and examined.
I discovered there are chunks of anger, bitterness floating around...taking them on in manageable pieces. I don't want them there.
I see progress, not only in our sitch, but within her, which is most important right now...she needs to establish her inner peace, find her inner self, before a full R can happen.
Her selfishness annoys and hurts me, but I know it is hopefully just a temporary phase required for growth into the butterfly she is trying to become. I can let it be during this process.
The holidays are coming up, I will not take away from our kids any possible enjoyment...the last 2-3 holiday seasons have been awful, especially last year. They deserve the best I can provide.
I'm in for another 3 months. Quitting is off the table.
The last 3 months since last check-in just flew by. I can't believe I have lasted, grown as much as I have...I guess it is true that you never get more than you can handle from God.
Now, I do ask him to hurry her along a bit faster...lol...she's taking her sweet old time. But better thorough and slow, than fast and half-assed. I do not want to repeat this journey, or know if I would even be able to.
But I can handle this one.
Have a great weekend all!
T^2
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
T, A very well thought out posting. Yes, you are definitely in for the long haul and your patience and compassion are paying off. It's going to take her a while longer to get through the crisis, but she's going to be one heck of a beautiful butterfly when she appears next spring!
Enjoy weekend!
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
T~Your "manageable chunks" comment reminded me of something my pastor recently said to me (last week when I freaked out about the e-mail with OW name). He said, "Heather how do you eat an elephant?" I of course told him I didn't know, since I never tried. LOL He said, "One bite at a time." He went on to tell me not to worry about tomorrow because it will worry about itself, and I need to not even try to get through the day, but the next hour, or break it down even smaller, maybe even just getting through the next minute. I found this very helpful, baby steps. I don't know if you'll find it helpful or not (but if nothing else amusing!), long story short, small manageable chunks are good! Don't try to eat the entire elephant at once.
My friend (the one from high school I recently reconnected with) told me a couple months ago (when I said something about God not giving us more than we can handle)it's not that God won't give us more than we can handle, but he promised we wouldn't go through it alone. Interesting perspective....probably very true, just thought I would share.
I ask God to hurry too sometimes(especially because to me it feels like H is perpetually stuck, but then I remind myself I can't see what's going on INSIDE him), but I know God's timing is perfect, even if it doesn't seem like it at the time. I really like your butterfly analogy btw.
Also, I really empathize with the selfishness being annoying and hurtful, that's one of the things that is very hard for me to deal with...
It's really good you are seeing progress though! Just continue to be patient.... good things come to those who wait. For what it is worth, I think you are doing amazing and you are so inspiring to me!
Sunday W was in a mood, she did do something new and asked me to go with her to the store, she drove (in her mood it was scary, taking it out with driving, but I kept my mouth shut), she parked in a empty lot and vented...I checked my internal calender and figured a lot of it was hormonal, but she disagreed strongly (and Monday she checked the calender, and said maybe it was hormonal, i just said, "Yup, maybe..."). Her current issues, posted here for journaling's sake and any help from or for people (us guys who are wondering what happened to our mlcW/WAW)
-Doesn't want the kids to grow up, she wrapped her "self" into them and being a young mom with young kids...she was happy with that. She is piecing together that 4 years ago at her dad's funeral, she stayed 6 weeks back there with family and noticed that the 2 younger ones were not the same, changing. she used to be everything to them, now she wasn't enough, they were and are growing away. She feels empty and lost with that, doesn't know what her purpose is anymore.
-Doesn't want to be old, is scared about how she would take care of herself (job, paying for place, car, health/car insurance, etc...all the stuff I provide atm). Really projecting into the future, all possibilities except the positive ones (not only is the glass half full, but she is in a desert). Angry at all the changes that crept up this past year, and she has aged, to be honest...cellulite all the sudden made its appearance, more wrinkles, etc...I wanted to say that what did she expect, all stressed, not sleeping, burning the candle at both ends chasing vaporous unicorns? but of course I said nothing. I happen to think that the crinkles at the corner of her eyes when she smiles are endearing, and I said so a couple days later when she brought it up again.
-Then she brought up that she wish she hadn't changed in "those" feelings for me...but she still feels nothing there (oh, and what did she email me 3 weeks ago?...hmmm). I said nothing again. After she vented we went to the store and such, it was okay.
But that last bit about "those" feelings is a touchy place for me and it churned inside that evening. And that OM had called previously, knowing from all that I have read that "those" feelings recovering are being hindered by the OM being around still, if only via IM and phone. So I did something different, I confronted her about it. i gave her an "out", saying that I know the OP will call after things have stopped and try to pull you back in...she played dumb.
"I was looking for [neighbors] number on the caller ID, area code 123?" "I don't know that number" "[OM's first name]?" shakes head, "No..." "[OMs full name]" "I don't know who..." [okay, three chances to be honest]"W, please don't lie to me, I have known for a year when you first called him and it was on the LD bill..." (and I wasn't surprised, at all, that she lied).
Then the histrionics started, I watched calmly and neutrally...got the "I hate relationships", "i hate YOU for knowing, it was my private thing (I answered that even the best actors in the universe can't hide infidelity forever)"
...etc, etc, etc... she calmed down, Brought up how OM has nothing to do with affecting those feelings, I replied that EVERY IC, book, forum poster, etc would disagree and say "how could it not?"
Then the core: "I know it's not right...I can't stand my pain, and being alone in my pain...I just wanted a break from it, a distraction", "I hate myself, i am so messed up, etc", etc. I answered "then you got hooked, like a drug, and the mental and bodily reactions are almost exactly the same". "So when you emailed me 3 weeks ago when you were feeling good about yourself, you felt one thing...then when you haven't been feeling good about yourself, then OM...possibly?" You could see a light bulb of sorts light up I swear...
So we talked about other stuff going on with her, her anger at the world, the pain, the point of being alive, mad at God for allowing all the suffering in the world...your basic existential crisis thoughts and topics.
I wasn't going to bring up affair(s) and current OM activity, but at the last minute I did. I think maybe I was going off intuition and things I have read here (HB, for example) that sometimes you have to "stir the pot" in this stage to "lead them out of the tunnel a bit", and you will be guided when and what by God. Since W will be the first to say that she is a "no decide or do until the last minute when she absolutely HAS TO..." kind of person, maybe is it time to change things up, I let it ride for a year pretty much...idk.
I also have changed up something else after Sunday's happenings. I have taken off the wedding band and left it on the dresser in front of the clock (this is where I keep my wallet, keys, etc)...I think the lies at this point, and the opinions here that some think continuing to wear the wedding ring is pursuit behavior, have changed my feelings about it. W silently noticed it Tuesday after work I saw, and she seemed to be "waiting" at the top of the stairs...I have also dialed back on the dimmer switch. Yesterday as well she looked right to my hand when I came home. She is a symbolic-oriented person, so maybe it is speaking better than words?? Last evening she sought me out in my "wild wooded" area of the yard, took the ring hand in both hands and asked me if I wanted to go for a walk with her, but it was okay if I didn't...that is a first in 3-4 years.
We went on the walk, it was pleasant for the bulk of it. She got annoyed with me a couple times, we discussed that later, that for her she had the same feeling as when her Dad would question something she would be saying and that she felt he thought she was wrong. I explained that those instances when not that she was wrong or it was a bad, but that my engineering work world and "man" world it is normal to try to think of all the possibilities, good and bad. She said she doesn't know what to think of those irritated feelings, she has always kept them in. I told her that is was good she is telling me, if I don't know I can't learn and change, also that I get those feelings with her sometimes, too. The rest of the night was pretty normal and nice.
I don't know what I am gong to do about the ring thing right now, just leave it off, I can always change my mind. I do like how I am not reminded of my sitch by it all day though, helps me focus on the rest of life. So sad that it couldn't remind my of my wonderful M and W right now, but that is reality, and I accept that.
So that's where I am at this week...questions, opinions, translators welcome as always...
T^2
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
T, She is still going through the motions of filing, sorting, etc. Listening and validating when necessary are about all you can do right now. She is fighting her inner self and we all know that we can't be Peter Pan forever. She's getting there and it is a very slow process for her because she's fighting it all the way.
If you feel okay w/not wearing your ring for a while, then by all means leave it off. I think you are giving her some space w/no pressure by leaving it off.
T, you are going to have to dig even deeper for more patience. It is crucial that you do not rush her now. She's right where she needs to be at this moment.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
