Can This Be Salvaged?

[leopoldstotch]

Denver thanks for posting. You and Mr Bond may be right about the intimacy but I'm not so sure. Ever since Monday I've been feeling down and I believe it's been mostly due to me starting to worry about how we are going to pay for things and it seems like my wife has been short with me. Last night on my way to my friends house I called my wife to ask her if there was a problem since she seems real short with me the past few days. She said everything is fine and asks what is wrong with me. I told her I would talk to her later about it.

This morning as she was getting ready for work she started talking about what needs to be paid, how much is in the bank etc.
That is when I told her that I was feeling depressed about not working and worrying about the bills. She then gave me the old I told you so speech. "I've always told you to save money for a rainy day and now it's here and we've been married 20 yrs and don't have crap to show for it". I told her that she was right but there was nothing I can do to change that except when I get back to work to just save. I have always been the spender in the relationship. I used to tell her that "you only live once". She also tells me that every year around this time (our anniversary is Oct 3 and my birthday is Oct 11) that I get "sappy". She says that she is a slow leaner but she's "caught on" after all these years that this is how I get this time of year. I didn't even bother to ask her what she meant by all that.

Denver I would love to talk to her about letting go of the past but I think she is more stuck there than your wife is. I want to move forward and leave the past where it belongs but it appears she can't let go and I fully understand why she is that way. I am the one who has shown her that I have gone back time and again to past behaviors.

As far as Dbing goes I have been working out again for the last two weeks. Not to sound stuck up but I used to be built pretty good. Even my sister used to compliment me on how I looked. So I'm determined to get back in shape. I go to my buddies house almost every Friday night. I play softball on Tuesday and Thursday nights with my oldest son in a league. We also play in a league on Sunday mornings. I may be joining a bowling league on Monday nights. I will probably be hanging out more with my one buddy who is recently divorced. I don't follow her around the house like a puppy dog. I don't call or text unless it's important. I haven't told her "I love you" since this all began.

I'm trying to find the balance between being the husband I should have been but also not pursing her. God only knows what she wants.

[leopoldstotch]

No I had stopped on my own because like you said I felt better. I have been taking them steady since July. I have only felt down the last few days. I haven't felt like this since June when I wasn't taking them.

I have read both DB and DR a long time ago. You are right there is a lot of "more of the same" behavior and that is what I have been trying to break with her as of late. For myself I no longer fly off the handle or react to her when she gets angry and yells. That used to push my buttons and I would go right back at her. I haven't done that in months and I've been telling her in a calm manner that she can't speak to me like she does when she's angry and that is when she tells me that I used to do it to her.

Thanks for posting AnotherStander

[leopoldstotch]

I have the 5 love languages and I haven't read it in a few months. Yes I suppose you are right her tank is empty too.

[leopoldstotch]

AnotherStander,

I agree entirely with your feedback, but I need hep reconciling how filling the love tank is not considered pursuing activity. Any thoughts?

Williams I think AnotherStander is correct. When I first came here last year I believe that Sandi2 told me that I needed to show my wife that I loved her. I too did not understand how to do this and still DB but it can be done without pursuing.

I haven't read your sitch but I will check it out soon. To give you some examples of what I have been doing I do compliment my wife on how she looks when she is getting ready for work not everyday but once in a while I do. Oh for those who don't know or in case I didn't say it we do sleep in the same bed. It's a king size bed she sleeps on one side while I'm on the other. So yes I still do see her naked for those who may ask and yes she sees me naked as well. What does this mean? I have no idea lol. My point is sometimes she accepts the compliment sometimes she doesn't.

Figure out what your wife's LL is and start filling her tank.

[leopoldstotch]

For those who are posting thank you. I plan on sticking around here and updating and taking all help and advice that I can get. I should have never left in the first place. Thanks again

Butters

[AnotherStander]

No I had stopped on my own because like you said I felt better. I have been taking them steady since July. I have only felt down the last few days. I haven't felt like this since June when I wasn't taking them.

OK, good. I'm on them as well, and while they do help they don't totally get rid of all bad feelings, so if you're feeling a bit down due to your sitch that's to be expected.

I have read both DB and DR a long time ago. You are right there is a lot of "more of the same" behavior and that is what I have been trying to break with her as of late. For myself I no longer fly off the handle or react to her when she gets angry and yells. That used to push my buttons and I would go right back at her. I haven't done that in months and I've been telling her in a calm manner that she can't speak to me like she does when she's angry and that is when she tells me that I used to do it to her.

Great, sounds like you're working on 180s and that will help. It's going to take her longer to accept that the 180s are real and not just acting, so stick with them. I would suggest that rather than tell her she can't talk to you in a certain way (which she may perceive as pressure or pushback), that instead you just tell her you think it might be best if you both take a break and discuss it later when the mood is better.

[Denver_2010]

Denver thanks for posting. You and Mr Bond may be right about the intimacy but I'm not so sure. Ever since Monday I've been feeling down and I believe it's been mostly due to me starting to worry about how we are going to pay for things and it seems like my wife has been short with me. Last night on my way to my friends house I called my wife to ask her if there was a problem since she seems real short with me the past few days. She said everything is fine and asks what is wrong with me. I told her I would talk to her later about it.

You admit that you have been down (depressed?) the past several days. Man, who do you expect to be upbeat and happy around someone who is like that all of the time? Let alone want to be intimate with that person??

Sounds to me like one of your 180's needs to be mood enhancement. You need to figure out how to put your stress and worries aside. There is a time to be worried and stressed, and a time to put that aside and be happy about the things that you do have in this life... errr... your wife??

Listen, I TOTALLY get this. It was a HUGE factor in what led to the breakdown of my M as well. I would go to work and be stressed that my business was suffering from the economic downturn (at that time)... then I'd go home and be down and depressed about my W and I's debt. I was "down" MOST of the time. That could not have been fun for my W.

Home at night with your W is a place and time that you should let yourself be happy and fun to be around. It is not the place and time that all of your problems are going to be solved.

Happiness is a choice. Make it.

Denver I would love to talk to her about letting go of the past but I think she is more stuck there than your wife is. I want to move forward and leave the past where it belongs but it appears she can't let go and I fully understand why she is that way. I am the one who has shown her that I have gone back time and again to past behaviors.

Then stop. You can't change her or her choice to focus on the past. The only person that you CAN control is YOU. So...

Change your behaviors. These are your 180's. IMO, from what I've read about your sitch, your 180's should be:

1) learn how to be happier and fun to be around - how were you when your W first fell in love with you? I bet it was NOT down and depressed. Go back to that. Be THAT person. If you suffer from depression go back to your doctor and talk about a new med. I had to do that. BTW, I found wellbutrin to be great. Maybe give it a shot.

2) Compartmentalize your life some. There is a time for work, a time to be stressed, a time to worry... but there is also a time to put that stuff aside and enjoy the things that you do have going for you. Your WIFE, your friends, your softball league, etc. Learn to separate these things.

3) TRUST - it seems to me that BOTH you and your W have some trust issues that you have both contributed to. If I were you, I would become an open book ASAP. Volunteer to your W what you are doing, when you will be home, who you are with, who you are talking to... "W, I'm heading to my buddies house for a few hours. Will be home by x:xx. Can't wait to be home with you. Love you!" AND THEN STICK TO IT. DO NOT DISAPPOINT HER.

Listen to this... YOU DO NOT HAVE A RIGHT TO BE TRUSTED... ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU HAVE DONE THINGS UNTRUSTWORTHY...

TRUST IS SOMETHING THAT IS EARNED.

*** YOU need to take the lead on ALL of this. Why? Because YOU and YOUR actions/choices are the ONLY things that you control. Look in the mirror and decide what you would like to change about yourself to become the man that you want to be in this life. Not for your W, but for YOU. And then do it... work at it.

CONSISTENT CHANGE + SUFFICIENT TIME = CHANGE THAT YOU W CAN TRUST

And this WILL take time and patience on your part. It won't happen over night. Hell, it took me 18 months. Is your W worth it?

Lastly, one of my favorite mantras during my sitch... and even to this day is:

"Be the change that you want to see"

You canNOT change someone or force them to change... You CAN show them how to change by doing it yourself!!

I repeat... YOU CAN SHOW SOMEONE HOW TO CHANGE BY DOING IT YOURSELF

As far as Dbing goes I have been working out again for the last two weeks. Not to sound stuck up but I used to be built pretty good. Even my sister used to compliment me on how I looked. So I'm determined to get back in shape. I go to my buddies house almost every Friday night. I play softball on Tuesday and Thursday nights with my oldest son in a league. We also play in a league on Sunday mornings. I may be joining a bowling league on Monday nights. I will probably be hanging out more with my one buddy who is recently divorced. I don't follow her around the house like a puppy dog. I don't call or text unless it's important. I haven't told her "I love you" since this all began.

All of that is great. As long as you are also showing your W that she can trust you.

I'm trying to find the balance between being the husband I should have been but also not pursing her. God only knows what she wants.

This is a terribly difficult thing to balance. However, I do NOT think that you are in a position of having to use the Last Resort Technique. In other words, I think that there are some things that you can do that are borderline pursuing. Being happy, flirtatious, and fun... being an open book and offering up reasons for your W to learn to trust you again...

I will leave you with this last thought... this is not going to happen overnight. Shed the expectations. Be prepared to be rejected for a while. But don't react in anger or frustration. Shrug it off and believe that what you are doing with bear fruit in the future.

Google the story of the Chinese Bamboo Tree.

Denver

[leopoldstotch]

Denver thank you for the 2x4 it is much needed. I have some work a head of me to say the least and I will google he story of the Chinese Bamboo Tree. When I have time I will answer your post more thoroughly as it really has sent me a message. I love your mantra "Be the change that you want to see" I think I may steal it lol.

[Denver_2010]

It wasn't meant to be a 2x4 Leo. You haven't been at this that long, so I realize that you are still in the beginning stages.

I look at it as a suggested guide... strategy.

Make no mistake, if you are going to be successful at this, you have to view it as a battle. You are lucky, because there is no OM (as far as I know anyway), so there is no enemy other than the guy in the mirror.

But, as with you any battle, you need to have a plan and a strategy.

I looked at what you are doing and what you are saying in your posts, and I didn't see any real plan. I am just suggesting the basis for a real plan.

I will keep following you and giving you my thoughts if you like. But you've got to come up with the strategy and do the work.

I think that you have a good shot at saving your M because I don't think that it is as dire as many others' here. That's a good thing.

Hang in there.

Denver

[leopoldstotch]

Denver I would very much like it if you followed along and gave me your advice. I really do admire all that you have accomplished. The plan you have outlined is going to be my strategy. I think it's time for me to read the Five Love Languages and start there.

Yes as far as I can tell there is no OM. I'm not naive to think that she would never do that but I just don't have that feeling in my gut and trust me I know that feeling. You are probably correct that it is not as dire as many others on here and I did read the story of The Chinese Bamboo and I will say that patience is what I need to learn. I promise you this Denver I will win this battle.