Hello! 20 year marriage teetering on the brink...

[AnotherStander]

First a quick update, we had our "gang" lunch yesterday (I hesitate to say "family" in the midst of S) with all 3 kids. I also went over to hang a ceiling fan at W's house for D15. My wife's attitude towards me could best be described as friendly, but cold and distant. There was no pursuit whatsoever. She didn't even thank me for buying everyone lunch at her favorite restaurant. No biggie, I have no expectations and certainly don't expect a turnaround this quick, I just wanted to update where things are. W did give me a large bag of the white trash snack mix I mentioned earlier, so that was nice.

W's week long visitation of the kids started yesterday. It was very tough on me, the house seemed really lonely and empty. I stayed busy doing stuff, but I'd be lying if I said it didn't get to me in a major way. Thankfully I'll be seeing the kids after school each day before W picks them up from my house.

I almost think that^^ "backsliding" BECAUSE of Retrovaille is impossible. Why? B/C UNLIKE some mc's, who rehash the past, Retrovaille itself cannot hurt a m, in my opinion.

Thanks for the info on Retrovaille, that's very helpful!! It's been hard to really gauge what it's all about because most people don't really get into details of what goes on there. But things have changed here recently and W at this point has zero, and I mean ZERO interest or willingness in working on our R even if that means just improving communications. I just checked the Retrovaille schedule and the one near us is two weeks out and that's just not going to happen given W's current state. There's another in February that's a reasonable drive from here, maybe there will be progress by then. I do very much appreciate your input and respect your opinion, thank you again!

Make sure you are GAL and start to be a bit mysterious. At some point she must fear losing you. Be less predictable (not "unreliable" as a parent, but less predictable...less available to her...

My new lady friend went on a texting frenzy to me while I was out to lunch yesterday with W and kids. My phone was buzzing like crazy. W didn't say anything, but then later we were driving to her house to hang the fan, W was driving and I was texting and she asked if I was texting D18. I said "no", and she asked who and I said "a friend". She didn't ask anymore about it, but yeah, it played pretty well into what you described above I think Frankly I was surprised she asked who I was texting.

Detach...which is NOT giving up. It is a protective step that also helps you to not pursue and that usually eases tensions in the marital r.

Thanks, and I think I've done well in detaching without making W think I'm giving up on the R. There's been no tension between us for quite some time, we get along great other than her being somewhat cold and distant.

There's more hope in your sitch than in most WAWs I think.

I just can't believe how difficult it is to have hope!! Like Cadet is so fond of saying, it's a lot easier to just quit and move on. It's so much harder to harbor hope, because with it comes the fear of being rejected AGAIN.

Of course, if she tells you she's gay next week, I might retract.

LOL!

what if she's been holding back on things that stewed in her for a long time?

THis is potentially a goldmine of info...wow, WHY did she buy it AND what did she think of it?

NOT saying to ask it that directly, but it's essentially what I'd want to know...

I just did the math on this, back then our oldest would have been 3 and our middle daughter 1. W went through very severe post-partum depression after our middle daughter was born and that's about the time she started A/D med's. She may have bought the book to explore the possibility that our M was to blame for her depression. After she started the med's she had a major and immediate turnaround and things were great again.

LOL, my wife tells our pet rabbits she loves them while hugging them good night.. while I'm sitting there quietly thinking "lucky rabbit". haha

Hahaha! I think my W is so used to telling everyone in creation that she loves them that she has to consciously stop herself from saying it to me. There have been a few times when it looked like she started to say it and then caught herself. I just feel like telling her "look, I know you're not "in love" with me, but you're not "in love" with your BFF either so you can sign off the phone to me with "love you" and I'm not going to think you're moving back in, it's no big deal." Better to just bite my tongue though