After 18 months - H is finally filing.

[keep_going]

BTW, I forgot to add...

I am not afraid or unwilling to go back to work ASAP. I have always done so and was the sole source of income in our M for two years while H tried to get his business off the ground.

So I will do so. I don't want to sound like I will just sit at home and expect H to solve everything. I just want to first talk to a lawyer to find out the ramifications of it in our future D. My H is very, very ademant on giving me as little as possible in child support and no alimony...

My question is really more about the D process and hiring a lawyer now...

thanks again!

[25yearsmlc]

BTW, I forgot to add...

I am not afraid or unwilling to go back to work ASAP. I have always done so and was the sole source of income in our M for two years while H tried to get his business off the ground.


Yes we know. And where'd it get you? I'm a big fan of yours but fear you are about to make a mistake that will cost you time with the kids AND financial security. In theory, If YOU go back to work full time, and earn well, HE can get 50/50 custody AND CS from YOU!



So I will do so. I don't want to sound like I will just sit at home and expect H to solve everything. I just want to first talk to a lawyer to find out the ramifications of it in our future D. My H is very, very ademant on giving me as little as possible in child support and no alimony...


then you'd be insane to rush back to work. HE has the advantage of 2 things. First, he was more recently in the job market and he can return faster, has more recent connections, etc. Second, he has OW and there will be SOME income from her.

OH and BTW, I think he just had a nice expensive weekened, right after losing a job. WTH? So, I guess HE/YOU PAID FOR that (or borrowed from mutually owned accounts??)

Don't pity HIM. He wants to pay you nothing for a 20 year marriage in which you worked and earned a lot which lead you to have a nice lifestyle AND you had 3 pregnancies AND you had the kids and you kept working and that's insane.

AND he wants the kids half time and then they'll live where? HIS job isn't near you now...his job might move northward...ever wonder about that? What's keeping him near you if not his job? The kids? Hmmm, so SHE will move away from HER kids?

Really, I don't think he thought all that out.

Don't repeat history b/c HE lost HIS job and go outside the home to work b/c HE lost HIS job. YOU still have your job, you're a mom.

My question is really more about the D process and hiring a lawyer now...

thanks again!

hire a lawyer now, please. I say this b/c your h is moving full speed ahead w/the divorce

UNLESS he tells you otherwise. LET HIM BRING IT UP, and since he filed and you MUST respond, you must hire a L.

He knows that. If he is so concerned about the costs, let HIM TELL YOU that he wants to hold off on the divorce.

Really, I fear Your concern about finances are outweighing his, and that's odd. It's not good. LET HIM BE A PROVIDER as that is his role, remember?

I often wonder if maybe you took the lead too much...let HIM worry about how HE will pay for HIS 3 kids and ex wife AND his new life. IF he can go to a baseball game and have a great day, that's nice. But don't make that send YOU into a job away from the kids.

He's the one costing the family this money, not you. He can blame you for "not working" (b/c we all know how EASY it is to hang with 3 kids under the age of 5, yeah that's not "work") but down deep, he knows what HIS choices are costing. If not, then he's working hard to avoid looking at that reality.

but it's on him that he left you while pregnant and with a new fixer upper dream home...and lost his job...

and it's on HIM that the divorce costs so much b/c he put you in a position where you have nothing to lose by fighting him, since he's offering you less than the law provides.

I've no idea what he's thinking as to what your motivation is for accepting THAT!.

You want what's best for the kids and your future. That is normal.

He wants what is best for HIM and OW first, and in his mind, then the kids. He wants to give you nothing b/c you gave so much before, and to me..that's selfish.

And so, before you make a choice that will affect you and your time with the children,

check with your L.

[keep_going]

25 -

I had wanted to try to use this unemployment situation as an opportunity to work together with my H, showing my support, build trust and re-connect.

I wanted to trust H and not assume the worst, but I know that he doesn't trust me at all either anyways...and I hear you loud and clear - his actions are indicating that I shouldn't.

At this point I just have too much at risk here for me and the kids.

I wanted so bad for this D to not be contentious, and it kills me and I feel physically ill when I think that it will not be pretty and that I will have to fight just to get a fair deal. I know it's all business for H now and it needs to be for me as well.

I am grieving... I have trusted my H blindly, 100% for almost 20 years that we had been together. And it's all gone.

Who is this man? I just don't recognize my H in him at all.

THANK YOU, 25. You have been like a sister to me.
(((((25)))))

[BklynMom]

Ditto exactly what 25 says.

It is understandable that you are grieving don't minimize what you are going though.

My h has the same mentality as yours. He is not doing anything to his kids, he is only leaving his wife. The kids will be happier cause dad is happy, they wouldn't miss any of the comforts of having 2 parents together in 1 comfortable home and having a shared income level.

Only time will teach your h that he is nuts. We need to be more patient, amazing and kind then imaginable because he is comparing us to a swooning other woman.

Is there anything you can do to help with your finances without working. Maybe a college student who in exchange for a free bedroom will babysit 10hrs a week? If you are home can you cook meals for working moms and get paid under the table.

I don't think you should work full time but I think there are many ways for you to work off the books from home so you are not completely dependent on him. Be creative

[25yearsmlc]

25 -

I had wanted to try to use this unemployment situation as an opportunity to work together with my H, showing my support, build trust and re-connect.

I wanted to trust H and not assume the worst, but I know that he doesn't trust me at all either anyways...and I hear you loud and clear - his actions are indicating that I shouldn't.

At this point I just have too much at risk here for me and the kids.

I wanted so bad for this D to not be contentious, and it kills me and I feel physically ill when I think that it will not be pretty and that I will have to fight just to get a fair deal. I know it's all business for H now and it needs to be for me as well.

I am grieving... I have trusted my H blindly, 100% for almost 20 years that we had been together. And it's all gone.





what if you told him something like this^^^???

Doesn't matter if he believes you NOW. You'll have told the truth. Someday he'll see those words in writing and perhaps wonder if they are true.

But What matters is that they ARE true, and you'll have expressed them.

Frankly, we all must accept that our words might not reach them. But it's our responsibility to say our words, not withholding...and once said, be done with that.

You did not want this divorce, we all know. But it's coming, and you are stepping up to the plate on behalf of your children.

I think it'd be easier, really, to just go out and get your old job (or one like it) back and work your butt off, sharing the kids and re creating the stress and chaos of your previous life. That would "Shut him up" and prove....something....

But you have been deeply hurt and grown from this painful experience. The last thing you want to do is repeat the same mistakes of the past after going thru all this hell.

Too bad if he cannot see that. YOU CAN. Your eyes are open.





Who is this man? I just don't recognize my H in him at all.

That is understandable. Maybe You can say something neutral like, "H, you're right. I don't know you anymore." That isn't pursuit; it's part of your negotiating strategy. To SUBTLY get him to look in the mirror and feel guilt.

Some comments that came to me, on your behalf, are listed below. I DO NOT KNOW what to do with them KG. Maybe nothing.

But I feel as if you need to start spinning things a new way. You take on too much of the past responsibility -which was fair for awhile-but you let him off the hook too easily.

Even if you were a total beyotchh, (and I buy that you had a nutso temper, based on your admissions here. I get it, and you need to work on it big time. Which you are)....

but, you just don't leave a pregnant wife. You just don't. To me that's akin to divorcing a soldier while he's deployed. Totally uncalled for and totally something that can wait!

And if a pregnant woman then makes efforts to change that you can see, (b/c he has seen some with you and the kids. That's a fact he may not admit but WE know it's true.)

you give her another chance. The reason he won't is OW.

To use a car analogy, Your h believes it's easier to start fresh with a new "car", than to repair a broken one with a red blinking light. It's running rough and he does not know how to fix it. But a shiny new car is right there next to him...easier to drive off in THAT, and leave the old one behind...

The problem with that belief is 1) he's not getting a "new" car; he's getting a used one, that has problems and rattles of its' own, which he will discover only after he drives it on his own for a few miles; and

2) he'll never learn how to repair a "car" if he just switches it in for a new one whenever the red light starts blinking. Nothing "mechanical" has been learned.

Well, I don't want to wear out my metaphor but I hope that helps.
here are the words that came to me. Do with them what you will and that can include scoffing at and tossing them!

for when he lashes out at you for being so mean--

"H, I hurt your feelings and you ARE a man who allowed hurt feelings to cause you to leave a pregnant wife and 2 very small children. Though I'll always regret taking things out on you, Til now I didn't realize how unfairly burdened I WAS---- financially supporting your business

while also being pregnant and

then having the babies and

still working such crazy hours--- and finally letting the stress get to me, for which I've repeatedly apologized...Clearly, we both put far too much on ME.

Though you may never see the imbalanced burdens on me, H, OR how they affected our marriage, the point is, I DO see them.

My eyes are open & the kids are now my priority.

I hope I'm wrong h, but it seems to me that Your expectations of me continue to be WAY out of balance, esp since I now have yet another child.

But the good news is, my expecations are much healthier now. And For that, I'm grateful.

As always, I will do what I can to economize, and to assist where I can b/c they are OUR children. But I won't abandon my children b/c you lost your job.

They've already been put through too much b/c of our mistakes, (*maybe add* "and b/c you will not let go of your pain).

I will continue to work on finding balance in my life so that my resentments will keep fading. I look forward to doing what's best for our children as I know, at some level that is also a goal of yours..."

THANK YOU, 25. You have been like a sister to me.
(((((25)))))

KG, I'd be lucky to have you as a sister. And I have 3 already and love them!

If you ever do EE, let me know. I'd love to do TEAM when you go. And since they have a waiting list, let me know b/c they sort of owe me and I'd PROBABLY be able to slide you in.

(((( hugs again )))) and good luck.

Be brave, be strong and KNOW that

IF you are acting from the heart and for your children

that has to be enough for you. You can't NEED his belief or approval to move forward, and hold your head high.

((( )))

[keep_going]

Journaling...
It's Sunday night and I am quietly sitting at home. My kids were with H this weekend and come back tomorrow.

I miss them so much when they are away... I call them each time to say good night. My girls are so cute and tell me they miss me. I can't put a price on that. Yet they are still very young and don't have the attention span to talk for more than a couple of minutes.

I am now pondering about this past week. Man, it's been tough!

I got served. My H lost his job and today I finally got to give both bad news to my dad, who is going through his 3rd round of chemo treatment for colon cancer...He loves H like a son and has felt so deeply betrayed and abandoned by him as well. But my dad never shows his pain at all - he feels that as the head of the family he needs to always be strong. Vulnerability has never been an acceptable option - he learned that from his mom and I am working hard to break the pattern. I have never seen him cry and he's 86 years old...

I could tell he was hurting for me when I told him. He didn't hug me - he never does. He responded as he always does, by offering suggestions for what to do and then told me to take one thing at a time and that everything would work out. I love my dad and I ultimately know that he is showing me his love the only way he knows how and I have now learned to be grateful for it.

I didn't have a chance to tell my mom. She is in Paris with H's mom. Yes... That is right, my mom and MIL are on a trip together. Both our families are very tight and we have always done a lot of things together - holidays, get-togethers, trips, etc. H asked that we didn't tell them about his job loss so they would enjoy the trip and I agreed. Bad timing, I guess.

It will be sad to give them both news when they get back. I know they will be just as sad as everyone else is (except for H, of course...)

I did try to get a few positive things going on this weekend to try to snap out of this funk.
- I slept in.
- I read and reviewed some exercises on anger management.
- I reviewed my gratitude lists.
- I tidied up my house. (I love having a clean and tidy house, but it only lasts long enough when the kids are not here - lol...)
- I talked to one of my best friends and my sister. They are so supportive and love me so much - I am a very, very lucky person to have them!
- I had breakfast with my other best friend - it was a gorgeous, sunny morning.
- I went swimming in the ocean and went for a long walk at the beach to think about things. (It's been so hot in S CA in the last few days that I knew this might be our last beach-weather weekend.)

And the best thing - the week is over!
I have clarity of what I need to do next and will face head on the tough moments and decisions awaiting me.

I hope everyone has a great week!

[labug]

Good for you kg. Sometimes it's hard to find the good stuff.

[keep_going]

Thanks, Bug.
I try focusing on the good stuff as to stop negative thoughts, pretty much like the stop sign exercise.

Per the advice of my DB coach, I talked to my H this morning when he brought S1 back. I invited him in (he never comes in), but I could tell he was uncomfortable. He never sat down or accepted anything to drink. I asked him how he was feeling about the job loss and let him talk. I listened and validated.

He said he is looking and described his job search focus. He then added that luckily our sitch was not at a breaking point yet. I could not believe my ears but I kept my mouth shut.

When he was done I told him where I could cut expenses to help us out (not that many, really since I have already reduced my lifestyle to pretty much to the essentials), but my goal was to offer goodwill and intent to help. He didn't say anything.

I then said I understood we are no longer a couple but that our finances are still tied and offered to sit down with him to strategize together on how to tackle the next few months based on the cash we have left and where we can safe to figure out how long it will last. He said he has no idea how much cash we have left and didn't show any interest in working with me or trying to figure it out.

I don't know if he is in denial about our financial reality like he was last year. Let me explain...

When he left in Dec. of 2010 he was clearly depressed and didn't do anything to help sell our old home. I asked him to work with me to get our finances straightened out, given that we now had two mortgages which put us in the red. He reacted pretty much like he did today - said and did nothing. Yet I made the conscious decision at that time to not pressure him, let him handle it, be supportive and not rescue him. Of course that was the worst decision on my part and by the time I tried to get things going on selling the properties eight months later, it was too late.

We finally did a short-sale our older home earlier this year which left us with a huge tax debt for 2013's filing. I am ok with this debt - I am equally responsible for my inaction on this. We also had to sell our newly bought home this past May. Yet instead of re-paying a 401k loan which we had taken out for the down payment, H used the profits of that sale to pay off credit cards (joint and personal) without consulting me. I was more than livid and let him know. I don't think I had ever reacted more angrily with him in my life than that day. I also talked to his brother who is also our CPA about it and he was also furious with H, whom has never shown any remorse for his actions. Now that he lost his job, we will incur yet another huge debt with the IRS for next year since we won't be able to re-pay our 401k loan.

And H doesn't think our sitch is dire - LOL...
Hey, maybe he is bluffing as part of his D strategy to get me to panic and go get a job.

Getting back to this morning. At the end of the conversation I told him I have received the D paperwork and asked him if since he has lost his job if he had any plans to put the D process on hold. He said no - he has waited too long already and wants to get the D done as soon as possible. I told him I understand and have accepted that we will get divorced but I was hoping he would consider waiting until he got a job, since now I have to go hire a lawyer and spend money that I believe we now need for essential living expenses.

He said - go ahead and please hire a L.
So there it is... He has placed a higher priority in the D than in the financial stability of his own kids.

The whole conversation he was cold, detached, very business-like and almost defensive, but yet very calm as he usually is. He didn't look at me in the eyes and seem almost in a hurry to leave, definitely uninterested and ready to end the conversation. At times when I was talking, he literally started playing with our S1 and actually ignored me, which has been pretty standard behavior for him since he left.

I was very calm the whole time and when we finished talking I thanked him. He left w/o a hug or anything. I wished him a good day and he just said - thanks, same to you. I am proud of myself. I really handled that conversation well - didn't get emotional at all, didn't over-react or made any snide, antagonistic or judgmental comments, just very matter of fact.

I have placed a call to my lawyer and am waiting back with a confirmation of our appointment date and time. I am facing this head on.

[needgrace]

wow, KG, you were incredibly strong this morning. i love how you stayed calm and treated him with respect. you were truly a model of grace and strength.
((((((((((( )))))))))

[reachingHigher]

KG, you are one word -- AMAZING!!!