can Turtles still stand?

[zig]

ng - he rolled his eyes at me for 10 yrs - always - i would get so mad! and hurt.

actually he hasn't rolled his eyes that i can remember since BD - which means that something i was doing or the way i did it, made that behavior come out?

I got upset - you see - not allowed to get upset and say you're upset in an upset way!! make sense?

it comes form his parents interactions - they talk to each other in a completely neutral tone - whether they are pissing mad or super happy - it's almost automaton, i swear. but mil at least can get extremely emotional with me - but in front of her family - always the same exactly

One does NOT express anger or anything in any other tone. any other tone means that you will get eye-rolling.

You can talk very gently and sympathetically and sweetly and say what's wrong ,but you cannot show the tiniest bit of frustration or irritation.

right now, i want to know if s heard him apologizing to me, and i'm waiting to calm down fully before i ask him that.

frankly i cannot decide if i care that i "reverted" - did i revert? i don't even know - all i know is that i am sick of trying to be this non-expressive person who can only express ALL their emotions with a smile - and not be able to express other emotions honestly.

the burden is too damn much - i've carried it all these years - i cannot do it anymore.

i'm not saying that i want to be able to shout and scream whenever - i'm saying that i want to be with someone who doesn't have such crazy issues that if i express a normal emotion, they freak so much that they get scornful

you're right - it's not okay - and it has never been okay for me - but h has always refused to understand my getting really upset by it. i'm not the only one he does that too - he does it to anyone he feels threatened by or anyone who stands up to him in even the smallest of ways.

one is NOT allowed to have an opinion other than the one he has, period!!

months ago mil and sil had come over and we were talking about h and i told them something he did and both of them rolled their eyes. i said - oh so all of you do this - i had never noticed the others doing it before. they asked what i meant and i said h always rolls his eyes at me whatever i say, especially if i'm a bit upset about something

they were both really shocked - they said - yeah we do that but never directly to the person ever - especially with our partners.

i tried alot to tell h over the years that i found this really upsetting-but because i said it when i was upset - it had no effect whatsoever.

but i didn't respect myself enough back then to understand that i was being disrespected - now i do, and it's even more intolerable to me

and so now i'm really mad at myself for not taking the opportunity to deathly calmly tell him how disrespected i felt today. and now i have to figure out how to let him know that he needs to apologize to s, and let s know that this is not appropriate behavior

thanks for the hug - sometimes i feel so damn alone in all of this - and i know i know - we all feel the same, no matter how much support we have

((((((((((((( ))))))))))))

zig

[chatterbug]

20 pages ... interweb is slowing down

[zig]

thanks ces - your post made me relax - here i was, getting revved up to beat myself up for not keeping my cool - and then all of you come to laugh about it!!

don't you know that i'm worried about having undone a year of DB'ing , all in one moment (laughing at myself - how we still keep protecting...)

what you described - didn't sound like you were angry at all - or did you shout it at her? you forgot to mention the tone you used.

mine was more like a monologue for 2 or 3 minutes - definitely chastised him - thus the eye rolling - so somethings haven't changed - for me - still have to work on them

i believe i've got a lot of work to do on myself still. i tried to use "I " statements but landed up using way too many "you" statements.

i believe an apology is due him from my end - but not an appeasing one - just one clearly stating that i should not have lost my cool and used "you" statements but instead have discussed my frustrations in a calm way where we both could interact, and he could say his piece . and if it was okay with him, could we have that conversation again, calmly, so that i could practice my new skills at communication

okay so the wink was me being a tad bit goofy here

thanks ces

and yes - s seems better - though this was the first time i sent them off without a smile...

zig

[zig]

hi busting - i LOVE how you said - dude, help a lady out?

sweet phrase - did you actually say that

i've notice the same with h. at s's b'day party when i arrived with a car full of stuff - he watched me go in and out 10 times, but never helped me once. it's like they forgot -

actually - i wonder if they need to see us really really independent and capable so they can say to themselves - see she can manage fine with out me, i can leave, it's ok.

who the heck knows... or cares''

blanket? - ooh yes - and i hope there's a really big bottle because i could use a stiff one right now

(((((((((((( ))))))))))))

[needgrace]

me too... a round of some big shots please! is it so so strange that we are frequently dealing with similar things at the same time...

zig, i hope i did not make you more upset w/ H about the eye rolling, i just think it is something important to talk about bc of how it impacts S...in that making sure he does not think it is acceptable way to treat you or anyone else.. but of course, talk when you are calm and i love the way you can take ownership for your role..

and hugs for you always! i agree, it can feel da** lonely.. ((((((((((((((((((((((( ))))))))))))))))))))))))

p.s. i love busting's phrase too

[zig]

you definitely didn't make me more upset - you were pointing out what was only too obvious to me.

heck, ng - i've been upset about it for 11 yrs!!

so - as i wrote to ces - i saw how i hadn't changed in this area. and that no wonder h doesn't trust my changes - i did chastise him - by telling him off.

or i pointed out enough stuff that it made him very uncomfortable and so he went to his comfort zone which the eye rolling signifies - the area in his mind where he gets to tell himself - when she talks like that i don't have to listen, because i don't have anything to do with this.

but as you said - taking ownership of my issues in this is really important - and only now did i see how i contribute to this scenario.

i was all ready to make him wait - yes DB wise - that's the way to go.

but zig wise - it would be doing the same as before. when we had this type of interaction i would storm off and he would apologise and then i would be silent - "getting over it" for hours.

i saw myself starting to do that. and said no, not this time. pick up the phone, not only acknowledge his apology and appreciate it, but show him with your words and tone of voice that you are not going to follow the same pattern again. Then tell him that you would like to talk about it calmly later - i know they are going to Busker Fest this evening.

so i did that. he start "explaining" all the reasons why he behaved as he did.

when he stopped i said - h, I would like to say that i don't think i handled the situation very well either. I suddenly after all this time saw the pattern we are in and i would like to talk calmly about it with you at some point. i know you're on your way out with s right now, so could we do it later?"

he replied - well we're both human and we make mistakes. so i said yes your'e right - but suddenly today after all this time i saw what happens and i think we could get out of this pattern if we talked about it.

so this weekend i will see if we can - i see my part in it suddenly so clearly - that i cannot understand why i didn't see it before. i can even see why it makes him roll his eyes - not that i'm saying it's ok he does that, just saying that i see now what i do that evokes that reaction in him

so unexpected insight - into myself and our r

i've been listening to those KLA tapes - maybe something has sub-consciously entered this brain of mine and made me able to see more of what goes on in our patterns and responses with each other...

[labug]

I really appreciate how you are examining your feelings and making different choices.

[labug]

And Busker Fest sounds really fun!

[zig]

thanks labug - and that's a huge compliment coming from you, so i appreciate it even more:)

yeah Busker Fest does sound fun.

I wanted h to invite me - but he didn't and now i'm denying myself the opportunity of being down there because he didn't!!

well seems like i am denying myself the opportunity to have some fun.

i think i will go down there - on my own - will admit that i am a bit nervous about going on my own - i feel so aware that i'm on my own because of my sitch - that i can't enjoy and relish the being on my own

at least that's how it has been

i do believe your one little phrase is about to propel me OUT of that way of self-pitying thinking and into a new phase altogether.

I do believe that i shall get my butt out of this house - and go down there and just have fun - even if i do do it on my own

am going to wait until dark though - that's the fun stuff - and i'll even treat myself to some of that yummy food they'll be selling down there

thanks labug - from now on - every little sentence you write to me - i'm going to see the real meaning behind it:)

sweet friend - hope you are well?

thanks for this
zig

ps - i'm still up for the blanket too!!

[labug]

I'd go with you in a heartbeat, that's my kind of thang!