Now separated. Am I doing the right things? Pt 2

[Accuray]

It is pursuing but do what works. If you feel you must you have to be totally nonchalant about it. Just remember its definitely not giving space and you most likely will not get the reaction you want. If she responds positively then wait 2x as long as you want to and try another small gift.

Honestly though I recommend against it. There's a risk W sees it as frivolous spending and gets triggered again -- is that worth it?

[Arsene]

I agree with Accuray on this. I'm sure you would also do this for a friend and that it really shouldn't be taken as pursuing but can you afford to take a chance? Besides there is always the money issue in your sitch and Acc is probably right and in her bad moments, she might use this against you.

Having said that, W brought the car back saying that she just couldn't afford to put gas in it and the other day, it was late at night when she left and I gave her gas money and asked her to just take the car. I didn't do it to pursue but I'm worried about her riding her bicycle late at night even though I'm sure she does it anyway when i don't know.

I think in the end, her safety comes before any DBing, IMO.

[Carnac]

Rough:
I guess i'd fall on the other side of the donut thing. I'd go ahead and do it as long as its done nonchalantly and without expectation. And as Accuray said, if it seems like a positive thing then wait a good while before you do anything else....if it seems negative, oh well accept and move one. My wife was indifferent so its not really something i'll be doing again anytime soon. She said thank you and acted like it was a nice thing, but really I could tell she didnt really think much of it.
As far as the hug goes....I asked if I could hug her and she agreed. Probably not something thats gonna happen again as far as im concerned unless she initiates it. Early on we were talking a little more and we would hug each time before we parted....kind of a mutual thing and one day she kissed me on the cheek...i made a comment about liking it and it hasn't happened since. After that I was too stupid/slow to realize that i was initiating each hug, and the last couple of times i've even asked if it was ok. As much as im gonna miss it, thats over for me....i gave up the "i love you's" a while back b/c I was afraid it was forcing her to say something in return she wasn't really feeling...im giving up the hugs now because i feel like I need to be really dark and unavailable for a bit.

[censored] but its gotta be done.

[roughenough]

Thanks guys! The coffee and donut thing is just so ridiculous if you ask me. I got the kids something but nothing for W. I wonder why I even think about this kind of stuff sometimes. One statement that’s used over and over on this board is the difficulty with detaching, and I see why!!!!! Sh!t, it’s a tough thing to do. I also have a hard time tracking my “feelings”. I wonder if I am improving, getting worse, doing wrong/right. Sometimes it’s really hard to get the clarity.

I am also going pretty dark with W. I think I am using some sort of LRT. Regardless, I feel I have a good understanding of the DB basics. On the flipside sometimes it’s really hard to make the most simplistic decision on how to handle certain situations with W. To be honest when I dropped the kids off with W this morning I was a bit nervous, I don’t think it showed though, the drop off was quick. I actually don’t like being in her apartment, I don’t like looking at how it’s furnished, her possessions, the pictures, nothing! I just don’t like being there for some reason.

At the end of the day if I ever want a chance towards reconciliation I will need to improve my financial situation, which I am working on. As I mentioned before, pursuing isn’t too difficult for me, detaching is.

[AlkalineThoughts]

Rough:

This is something I've been discussing on my thread too: The fact that it's definitely hard to stop thinking these things; over-analyzing actions and potential actions especially when they're so minute in the grand scheme of things.

But what's more important at this moment, IMHO, is that you're ACTIONS are correct. You didn't get the coffee/donuts for W, probably a wise decision, and you now realize all that crazy back and forth was kinda silly. I mean she didn't slap you or serve up D papers right then and there!

And as for "feeling tracking", you'll be surprised at how much you'll learn just from re-reading your old posts. Spending too much time in the "here and now" trying to figure out if you're improving, backsliding, doing right/wrong is an exercise in futility. With time comes clarity and the big picture is easier to see than the daily grind.

You, just like everyone on this board, will have good days and bad days, you'll be proud of some of your actions and realize you screwed up sometimes, and you'll improve some days and backslide others. Don't get caught up in the day-to-day... Remember that by continuing along the DB path, keeping up on these boards, reading other sitchs and advice given to others, and generally continuing to improve yourself, you'll come out better in the end.

This is SERIOUSLY hard work, and practically everyone on these boards deserves a pat on the back and a hardy congratulations on their commitment to doing the right thing!

[roughenough]

Well said Alkaline, thank you. I also read your posts. I am glad to hear you put the pursuing to a halt. It sounded like you mentioned to W that you wanted to work on thing and she said “no” . This isn’t a surprising thing to hear from a lot of our W’s.

I reference Accuray a lot because he’s taught me a ton. I wanted to pursue W more and make sure she “was clearly aware” that I wanted to reconcile. A lot of us feel by going dark or by acting business like that it might convey the wrong message to W. So that makes a lot of us want to wave our hands in the air and say “ Hey W, look at me!!!! Please listen, hey there, do you hear me!! Oh W, I want you to know that I am willing and ready, I just want to make sure you know this W!!!” Haaa, what a joke. I’ve learned that there’s absolutely no need.

Accuray asked me if W was aware that I wanted to reconcile and I simply told him “yes”. His response was that “she heard you then”. There’s no need to repeat it again.

It’s interesting that you mentioned “this is hard work.” From our W’s perspective they have no freakin idea what we are doing behind the scenes. There’s sooooo many others out there going through the same thing we are. It amazing how few of them come to this forum and have read DB. I can’t even fathom how much harder it would’ve been for me or how many more screw up’s I would have made if it wasn’t for DB. All the millions of people out there not following the 37 rules because they don’t know! Which is unfortunately too bad.

[roughenough]

[quote=roughenough]

I went through my old thread to review how much I've learned. I wanted to share this post from Accuray for those that haven't read it. It's about 180's and the importance of not pointing them out.


That's very nice of you -- no Phd, experience is a brutal teacher! I've read a ton of books, got lots of great coaching, and lots of help on this forum myself. "The Captain" on the SSM forum where I originally posted helped me more than anyone when I needed it most. I could never repay him (TeaEarlGreyHot), I don't want to sell anyone else short but that's who picked up my sitch when I was most hurt and he stuck with me.

In terms of your summary above, you have it -- patience, repetition, consistency and more patience.

I was thinking of it this way: pretend you own a shop that sells rare books that your wife really likes. Over time, you open up a poker room in the front of the store with all kinds of unsavory characters, your W has to walk through the poker room to get to the books. It makes her nervous and she starts to dread it. After dealing with that enough, it's no longer worth it to get to the books. When she walks down the street and sees your storefront she cringes and crosses the street just thinking about what's inside. The books are forgotten, all she thinks about is cigar smoke and scary men.

At some point, you decide to shut all that down and start selling wonderful antiques instead, plus your books. You spend a couple months collecting the best stuff and redecorating your store. The problem is, your wife will STILL cross the street and hurry by because of the memories and training of what to expect.

At some point she might notice a nice vase in the front window and start to think about that -- she didn't expect to see that there. A couple weeks later she sees a writing desk. She starts to think about the books and wonders if they are still there.

Eventually she's convinced there's no longer a poker room and she stops in, she's truly surprised by the change and begins to form new impressions and question what she "knows"

The thing is, if you ran out on the street and grabbed her and tried to push her into the shop the day after shutting down the poker, she would be scared, the place would still smell like cigars, and there wouldn't be enough there yet to convince her it's now an antiques store with the books she loves. She would fight you and try to run!

Unfortunately, the number of times she has to walk by before she notices is completely out of your control. If you try to make her notice she runs.

Time and patience. She will remember the books on her own. There's a reason she married you, you gave her something she needed -- she still needs it.

Accuray

[scaredsilly]

Accuray is the absolute best! So wise and so eloquent. We are lucky to be able to gain from his wisdom.

[roughenough]

Text from W:

“I need you to get off of work an hour early on Friday! Babysitter is watching the kids and she has to leave for her other job an hour early”


Ok, let my overanalyzing begin. In a lot of ways learning is how I get better though. I am deciphering the most recent text from W. Here’s how I view it. I have kids this weekend and I have no problems getting off work an hour early. She also doesn’t ask to deviate from the schedule to much so I will give her the benefit of the doubt on that one. It’s kid related so I want to comply. It’s also only an hour difference in what we’ve already scheduled.

On the flip side, W never works Friday afternoon so I am guessing she has something planned. It’s none of my business though and I won’t be asking. I also feel her text is blunt and business like. She’s demanding and she’s not asking me a question in the text.

I am thinking about waiting a couple hours and simply replying “got it, thanks”

Any thoughts?

[Denver_2010]

Text from W:

“I need you to get off of work an hour early on Friday! Babysitter is watching the kids and she has to leave for her other job an hour early”


Ok, let my overanalyzing begin. In a lot of ways learning is how I get better though. I am deciphering the most recent text from W. Here’s how I view it. I have kids this weekend and I have no problems getting off work an hour early. She also doesn’t ask to deviate from the schedule to much so I will give her the benefit of the doubt on that one. It’s kid related so I want to comply. It’s also only an hour difference in what we’ve already scheduled.

On the flip side, W never works Friday afternoon so I am guessing she has something planned. It’s none of my business though and I won’t be asking. I also feel her text is blunt and business like. She’s demanding and she’s not asking me a question in the text.

I am thinking about waiting a couple hours and simply replying “got it, thanks”

Any thoughts?

Agreed. You have no idea what she is thinking or doing. Don't mind read or try to guess. It is out of your control. This is about the kids, it's your weekend to have them, and it doesn't inconvenience you. Don't cause waves over this.