Piecing - Round 1

[Starsky309]

I am wondering.

Is it being suggested that if Denver's W does not admit guilt, even though it is possible that deep down she does understand she did something wrong and just won't admit it...

That it should be a deal breaker for Denver and he should file because she won't concede, because she's high risk to repeat.

And otherwise it is being suggested that Denver will be back here again because his M will fail?

Who said THAT???

[MrBond]

I don't think that because his W hasn't said anything doesn't mean their not going to make it. I just think that it would relieve alot more anxiety on everyone's part if she owned up to her part. Right now everyone's still walking on eggshells and if she hasn't figured out deep down why she left in the first place without any C, it COULD come up again.

But what do I know. I'm Batman.

[Starsky309]

I wish we knew more about her IC, and the kind of advice she was getting there.

[Denver_2010]

"She says that we were not married in her mind. "

In my mind I'm Batman. Must make it true.

Damnit Bond... you are a pain in my a$s sometimes! LOL! I absolutely say this in jest btw... I hope you know I appreciate you!

Can I call you Bruce?

[~ kd ~]

I am wondering.

Is it being suggested that if Denver's W does not admit guilt, even though it is possible that deep down she does understand she did something wrong and just won't admit it...

That it should be a deal breaker for Denver and he should file because she won't concede, because she's high risk to repeat.

And otherwise it is being suggested that Denver will be back here again because his M will fail?

Who said THAT???

No one. I was just wondering what the suggestion might be for him if his W just will not agree to transparency or admit guilt over the A.

Denver can be pretty persuasive, as we all know... and his W is probably quite deft at manoeuvring around him... so... as she will not agree, at least now and presumably in the foreseeable future, what is Denver's options?

[Denver_2010]

I wish we knew more about her IC, and the kind of advice she was getting there.

Me too Starsky. I don't ask her about it. It is her's. When she does open up about it, which is not often, this is what I have learned, again, not much:

1) She believes that we would not be where we are without her IC;

2) That it allowed her to realize an issue separate from my own actions, that caused problem in our R/M - That she has 2 sides to her. 1) the side of her that is a free spirit, that wants to pursue her music career, travel, spend time with her friends, etc. This side was not being attended to in our former R. She felt like she was in my shadow. and 2) the side of her that wants to be a wife, a mom, a homemaker, etc. She thought for a while after leaving me that she no longer wanted this. But the truth was that she began to feel trapped on this side bc side #1 was being neglected.

Since we have decided to R, we have agreed to make sure that both sides are given attention. I'm absolutely fine with this. I want her to be happy, be able to be the person who she truly is, grow as a person, and not feel trapped with the idea that her life has to be lived as society may tell us that it needs to be lived. In fact, I have a side of me that is like this.

3) That she has worked on learning some tools to handle anger, frustration and disappointment. So far, this has been very evident.

4) That she has discussed processing forgiveness for me and the hurt that I caused her in the past.

5) That she has discussed why she latched onto OM after leaving me. Basically a fear of being alone. She has told me that she has always believed that she would end up alone. She believed this because she didn't think anyone would want her after having her son so young. When she met me, she felt that maybe she wouldn't be alone. But then I took advantage of that by using the fear of being alone against her... me believing that she wouldn't leave me regardless of what i did or how I treated her. OM filled that void when she left me.

6) she has learned to better deal with a very difficult child (my SS) and his issues.

[Denver_2010]

Thanks Jack.

F- I wish Denvers wife celebreated steak and bj day with Denver twice a week...

you let me know if that happens Denver cause I got two more wishes coming to me then and I want to be selfish.

Oh man, oh man... I certainly hope that your wish comes true here Jack! And yes, I will definitely let you know!!! LOL!!

Is she going to apologize? No, not right now, maybe not ever.
Is Denver going to bring up transparancy? No, not right now, maybe not ever.

Yes. That's the situation as it stands now.

Denver you did a great job getting here...on your own. Some of us maybe offered advice or an ear, but your feet and your path.

Denver like each and everyone of us here made our own mistakes. Touched his own stove, took digested and used the advice that either he liked...or smarter, made sense even if it didn't sound pretty.

He is here in piecing. We all said our piece...or is it peace? I never could tell. Denver's feet are on his path still.

Right, wrong..."I told you so" not as important as being supportive of one of own's choice of direction, right?

Thanks again Jack. As I pretty much always have, I am taking all advice and applying it as I think best to my particular situation. Trust me, I read, think about, and appreciate, everything that everyone here posts.

But as I have said all along, none of this is black and white, one size fits all.

[Denver_2010]

Denver can be pretty persuasive, as we all know... and his W is probably quite deft at manoeuvring around him...

Oh KD, you don't know the half of it! Living with an attorney for 7 1/2 years has taught my W plenty on how to maneuver around in a disagreement. She and my SS both. He 'negotiates' everything with me these days! They should both go to law school!

[Harrier]

I don't think that because his W hasn't said anything doesn't mean their not going to make it. I just think that it would relieve alot more anxiety on everyone's part if she owned up to her part. Right now everyone's still walking on eggshells and if she hasn't figured out deep down why she left in the first place without any C, it COULD come up again.

But what do I know. I'm Batman.

That's a nice cutesy sentiment, but this is substantially different.

I mean how many times do we tell LBS that a divorce decree is "just a piece of paper." Wouldn't a marriage decree be just a piece of paper without the feelings behind it. I mean we all know of marriages of convenience right? Are they real just because they have a piece of paper.

Also, are people in a committed relationship not entitled to the apologies if one side strays because of the lack of a piece of paper?

I'm not excusing Denver's W's behavior by any means. I think it was cheating, but I wonder how much different things would be if instead of a S Denver's wife got a D, dated the OM, broke up and wanted to R. Do you think Denver would feel that different?

[MrBond]

"That's a nice cutesy sentiment, but this is substantially different. "

No. It sticks to the point.

Besides I don't know why everyone's belaboring the point. We're not his W so it really doesn't matter what we think. She will be judged by Denver on her actions.

Period.