Should I initiate R talk?

[Arsene]

Hi 25,

Thanks for your words and guidance once again.

It will relax you and take your mind off your situation 24/7 and you'll be able to let new things and new changes in you SINK IN...."

God knows I really need that right now. This has got to be the most exhausting 3 months I have ever been through.


Simply point it out NO MORE. IF anyone says anything you can be a tad surprised and say "Really? Well that's good b/c I've wanted to work on that for a while now..." AND IF it's your wife saying it, make it a SMALL thank you and change the topic of just STFU

Got you.


Why would you be "Cross" anyhow? Examine that seemingly natural urge of yours. IT happens too much.

Your w is an adult and when d is with her, WIFE decides the activities. Unless they are literally dangerous things to do,why do you get to have an opinion on their activity or return time?

Maybe IF d8 has school EARLY in the morning then maybe it wasn't even intentional & they were simply late....but that's the only thing I can of mattering...

I don't mean to go on the defensive here and I do know that I have a huge tendency to judge and criticize others, which I am working on. This is why I express these thoughts here instead of to W.

The issue here is that D8 has been coming down with a cold lately and that we get up at 5 am for her to get ready for school which starts at 7 am. Her regular bedtime during the week is 8 pm but when she is a bit under the weather, it can be as early as 7 pm. W knows that and yet, they got here at 9 pm and D8 still had to prepare her things for school and take a shower. In the end, she didn't go to bed before nearly 10 pm and this morning was exhausted and very difficult to get out of bed and through her morning routines.

I also agree that what W does during her time with D8 is none of my business, however, with regards to this weekend, which was meant to bring W and D8 closer as D8 had been having a hard time coping with her mom not being around. I have to disagree with the fact that W dropped D8 at her friend's house Saturday afternoon and picked her up Sunday afternoon at 3 pm (at which point she spent from 3 - 9 pm with her). This is not going to help D8 cope with the abandonment issues she might feel about her mom. Nonetheless, other than a kindly expressed concern, I didn't pursue the matter further and managed to keep my passive aggressive behaviour in check.

another 180 would be to NOT talk. Have too much to do (GAL) and be too busy for another "Session" in which she shares all her thoughts at the moment/second and then you spend hours or days analyzing them. Be warm and polite but post pone or avoid all these endless talks.

A phrase you'll hear A LOT here, is

"Believe none of what they say and only half of what they DO."

THe constant temperature taking is NOT helping YOU.

Agreed. I am nonetheless happy that last night occured but I want to try to make myself less available for these talks, for now. I find it a lot to process but considering this was really the first time she spoke about herself (and that I listened - mostly) I wouldn't have missed it for the world. It felt overall pretty good and I slept soundly, which doesn't happen often.


this^^^ seems unecessary to keep saying. Are you asking her (indirectly or even non verbally) for some sort of feedback? That will come across as NEEDY and that cannot happen right now.


No. I didn't. At least not this time and as for the other times, I don't think I have elicited any of this. The comments come from her.


Also, maybe she is testing the so called changes which have been how long now? A month? A week? IT's a drop in the bucket for now.

3) as I like to say, "do the math"...

Small consistent changes + sufficient time = change she can believe in.

I've been back for 3 weeks but been working on many of these issues (especially the anger one) for about 3 months now, since I received her bomb email.

I understand what you are saying. I am working on it and I realize it's not going to be resolved tomorrow.

Learn to adopt 2 phrases that don't allow for negative spiralling but that validate, do Not escalate, AND show change on your end. For when she goes over the marital history-
FIRST-

1) When she brings up something 'real' from the past like an event hurt her & for which you feel at least partly responsible (or totally) responsible for hurting her, say

"W, I'm so sorry that hurt you. If I had it to do all over again, there are lots of things I'd do differently."

2) if she recalls an event you have NO recall of, OR a very different recall of, you do not deny it, you say
"Wow, I sure don't remember it that way, but I'm sorry if you were hurt...

(And if need be, depending on the situation, ADD)

and If anything like that happened now, I'd handle it differently."

Point taken. I have written them down and will make them part of my repertoire.

NOTE TO SELF: don't herald or highlight behavior that most people consider just normal courtesy.

Plus once you saw that she had forgotten it, you needed to drop that (or not bring it up at all.)

Yeah, Got you.



doesn't this^^^ all pretty much resonate with you as being valid? Doing lessons with your d isn't the hard or most meaninful part of parenting.As I recall that was your "activity" or interaction w/her til recently.

So it means you are on the right track about the changes you are making, correct?

Right again.

did you want her to earn more or not? Did you want her to stay at home w/d8 or not? Is all this her fears talking?

The situation in this country is that most middle class families (which we were) have maids to do all the chores. Some westerners can't get used to the idea of having someone living in their house but in my view it was essential as I didn't want to W to spend her time doing this when we had an alternative (Maids salaries are very affordable and with both of us working in the evenings, There was no other alternative anyways). At some time W attempted to get a job and was offered 150 USD per months to work 40 hours per week for a school. This is what I made in 2 days and I told her then that if she wanted to do it for herself she should but if it was for the money, she didn't have to. I rather she worked on her music, which is what she has always wanted to do.

I may seem like I am defending myself here but at some point I think I have to. I want to take responsibility for my actions and I have faced the music. But I assure you that I supported my W in every of her endeavours. I have encouraged her to pursue her music and to grow and expand her horizons. In her good days, she has often thanked me for this and to me, it was only natural. I married her not to wash my clothes and raise my kids. I married her because I viewed her as and equal (in fact, even more than that - my friends told me I always kept her on a pedestal).
I always respected who she wanted to be and who she was. She was my companion. My friend.

I guess at some point, around when D8 was born, I forgot how to show her and I know I changed in many ways which weren't good but I was never a dead beat father. I have made sure I spent lots of time with D8, throughout her life, no matter what W might say now. I know I haven't been perfect but who has? I'm willing to improve and work on myself but d@$%& it!! I have not been half as bad as she paints me now. I know you may see a different picture and for all I know you may be right. If you are it has never been my intention, and still I have NOT been a bad husband or father. I have always taken my responsibilities and been there for my family. I don't drink, I don't go out with friends until all hours of the night, I don't womanize. I'm caring. and the list goes on. BUT... I went through a tough period. and this changed me in ways I hate to see. I have done things which are not within my character. And for that, I am sorry. Really sorry.

(I apologize for this venting. It's just that I don't understand how I can regain self-esteem if I keep taking all of this and feeling the way i do without saying how it was from my side. I know this is not the time or space for this but isn't there a possibility that she wasn't always there? That she wasn't always that perfect mother?)

would it have made any difference to you to have her tell you, then? Be honest. Would it? Would you have said "OMG I need help" and gotten it?

And when you say "depression" does that mean you got treatment for it?

And when you say "depression" is that the whole negative critical outbursts chronically happening?

How could I get treatment for something I (we) didn't see at the time. No, it's just rehashing through stuff at a later date that friends who have been through depression or been with people going through depression who have told me that they thought I had been gong through something of the sort. I know you might think I am trying to pas on the blame. It maybe so. But the person she married wasn't all as bad as what is being depicted here.

Listen 25, I'm sorry if i seem resistant to a lot of this but as you say all the time, believe nothing they say. Well I do believe a lot of what she says and I am facing my responsibilities in this but this re-writing of our history doesn't seem fair to me. I take it from her and "try" (though not always successfully) not to defend myself, and I realize that you are trying to help me see things from a different perspective (and for this I am eternally grateful) but the man that she remembers, and the man you see through her eyes, is not the man who she married and who I was up until a few years ago.

Thanks so much for all of this though. I feel a lot better now and I think I am ready to start doing some GAL.

I'm off to a job interview now. Wish me luck.

(and really, thank you for being here.)