Needing some guidance... 5

[25yearsmlc]

I will respond more...

I really like a lot of the things you said, 25. But one thing I want to elaborate more on is that OW has been a family friend to H's family for several years now. H has worked with her for 6 years. She did a triathlon with H in April last year which H's parents were at, she ran a relay with H, his dad, and his sister last year and this year, she went camping with me, H, my kids, H's parents and sister last year, she's been at several work parties that H's parents have been to as well. H's father is a cop too so he works with this woman also. They are all a lot closer than you think and I really do believe that they don't want this but they still welcome her with open arms which makes it REALLY easy for H to continue this.

just for ME to get the recap here, so is your h a cop, and his father, and her? And her dad too? ALSO Wasn't she married at some time? I'm just trying to figure it out. Not sure which part matters most but wanted to "get it".


So when I say cuddled up on the couch with her. I mean it. They are not feeling awkward having her around. The only awkward part was me walking into the house witnessing what they were doing.

Okay maybe then, YOU created awkwardness for them. Think about that. Do you think that awkwardness converts into sympathy for you?

I'm NOT sure it doesn't convert, but I do doubt it.

I think they felt ashamed.


2 things you need to know, First, you are completely mind reading.

Second, I have bad news for you. When most people feel shame, it nearly always converts into blame.

I know my h was ashamed at one mc's office b/c he felt he was "maybe being selfish" (which was a serious understatement).

What matters is, whether that changed his course of action. It did NOT.

Oh maybe a day of delay and a bit of affection tossed in...
But my H was too uncomfortable not being the good guy so after a short time of remorse, he'd usually rationalize it and make ME the bad guy for making him feel bad.

Just "proved" how unreasonable/bitter/negative I was being.

Calling him deceitful infuritated him but it was a FACT that he had lied. Saying he was selfish did not ever help me or my cause. Not even once.

He could not deal with that and reconcile the behavior with his self image of being an involved father and loyal h. So he reconciled the images by making ME wrong.

And imo, and in all 3 marriage counselor's we saw, he was told he was being selfish. Did that change his behavior? NO!

So I'm telling you even when it's true, the labels and name calling do not help.

H said I had brainwashed the mc's b/c I'm a L I argue well and they were all biased. Later, I found a male mc who connected with h and steered away from labels and certainly was the most helpful.

But there's only so much a man can hear if he believes in his heart of hearts that he works hard and has given a lot already.

I think your h sees himself as a victim h. To an extent, you agreed with that assessment until you saw him with OW. So...

Let me ask you this tough question, and you may not know the answer yet. That's okay.

But did you really want to make the changes you are making, and own the role you played in this breakdown of the m,

before you learned of OW?


IOW, IS there a part of you that just hates not "winning" more than actually losing him?


You admit a lot of backslides. In a way, it's hard to know what changes your h believes have happened.

Also since the labels/comdemnation didn't help, at all, OR show change in me, I'm not sure how you benefit by declaring him wrong and inappropriate so often. Looks like more of the same AND it Seems to harden your heart.

For me, at some point I chose to forgive my h and make my own changes.

But that does not mean I don't think he went thru a very selfish time.

If he had not been selfish or deceitful there would not have been much to forgive.

I will post you a copy of a letter from a WAW to her h. The LBS h says he has changed for "Months" (and I think he had).

He was shocked that his WAW didn't come home right then. That she'd waffle between OM and her h...

see if her letter to her LBS h might apply to your sitch with the roles reversed. NOT saying all of it, but maybe some....